Neighbooring rats

19 years ago

For about two months there has been what appears to be a rat or several rats surrounding us. One night I briefly saw one on a neighbor's tree. I saw one running quickly across our fence into a different neighbor's yard. And more recently I caught the view of the tail end of one, in the same neighbor's yard that has the tree with the animal I'd seen previously.

I would like to know if these animals might be being encouraged by our bird feeding and/or bird excrement. We provide bird food and water in our backyard and have been doing so for at least a year. The birds usually finish most of the food and water by the time night comes, so I am also wondering if the bird droppings could have something to do with this. There is a fence where the birds sometimes perch prior to eating and drinking and perhaps some of their excrement goes into the neighbor's side. The droppings that are on our side end up stuck to our wooden fence and don't appear to be on the ground so I presume that the other side of the fence could be the same as ours, but can't be sure, however, droppings that are not at ground-level, for an animal which I saw climbing a tree and fence might not be such a barrier for them anyway. The other droppings that might be present are ones on our side that the birds produce after spending time eating and drinking. And the birds sometimes perch on the neighbor's tree where they may be dropping waste. The tree is very close to that fence I've mentioned. I don't know whether any of these things is related to what attracts those animals, but thought I should mention it just in case. Also, myself and the neighbor's to the right and left of us have dogs and so I also wonder if their excrements could invite animals such as rats.

I let my dog out at night to do his business and he spends the majority of his time trying to chase what I suspect are those animals that he sees/smells on the other side of the fence (the fence which has some droppings on it-our side). Looking through the neighbor's fence is not easy, but there appears to be a plant right next to the fence where the rats might be staying or have stayed. The thing that suggests that those rats are there or frequent that area is that my dog becomes hyperactive when he's next to the fence at night. He sniffs the area and goes back and forth and even tries jumping over the fence, but he can't since he is not very big.

I'm not sure what to make of this situation. The rats aren't living in our yard, but if they are staying in someone else's yard whether or not we are contributing to it, it would seem to me that it might need to be addressed. Since I've never had this sort of experience before I'm curious at to whether rats stick around for extended periods of times or might they depart soon? Any experiences or information you can share would be appreciated. Thank you.

Sort by:Oldest

Comments (13)

brooksiefan
19 years ago
Rats love dog feces and bird feces. Clean up after your dog as soon as he is done and encourage your neighbors to do so. Make sure your garbage is in a can with a tight fitting lid. The seed left over from bird feeding is also inviting to rats.

The rats won't go anywhere as long as they find something to eat. They will stay, breed and raise their families there.
0
grow_n_gardn (CA, zone 10)
Original Author
19 years ago
Thank you brooksiefan. We try to be as clean as possible with our dog and trash, but the bird seed/droppings may need better management. I'd like to think that the neighbors are doing their best to maintain cleanliness, but may need to make sure of it.

Also, I noticed that I spelled neigboring wrong, pardon me.
0
Related Discussions
Raccoons
Q
Comments (29)
I'm an animal rights person who has done a lot of research on raccoons over the years. I've read a lot of good posts on this site, but I just wanted to dispel a couple myths I've read. First, raccoons can kill any cat or dog. The posts that say "get a couple dogs" must realize that a raccoon will bite the dog's tongue when cornered and the dog bleeds to death. Their natural predators are cyotes, so if you want to make things really bad, just import some cyotes. People who advocate poisoning them are playing with fire. Your dog or cat will probably find the bait first, then die a horrible long and painful death. Having said I'm an animal lover, I also think in urban areas where raccoons have become overpopulated there has to be a reduction in their numbers; i.e. euthanasia. I live in Lakeview New Orleans where the raccoons had two years with mountains of debris, rotting food, and abandoned houses to thrive in. The problem in my neighborhood is unreal. We've had cats with their faces torn off, a little girl was bitten after she tried to pet the "cat with a funny face" - had to get rabies shots - and dozens of other problems due to their overpopulation. Here's an animal lover saying if the population has gotten out of control, trap them humanely and kill them quickly either with a 22 or drowning. If you have a large enough trash can, fill it with water and put the trapped raccoon in it. Its a sad fact they are overpopulated on farms and in big cities, and few state or local agencies will get involved. Exterminators make a great living trapping them and dropping them off six blocks away. I was quoted $600 to rid my property of approx. 8 raccoons. My vet said the parasites and diseases they carry are in such dense quantities that dogs and cats can catch them just from sniffing the raccoons droppings. Bottom line, if you feed them, or leave food out for your cats 24/7, or encourage raccoons in any way, you are asking for severe problems and perhaps the loss of your own pet.
...See More
Slightly OT: Do you cater to critters?
Q
Comments (23)
My garden and house caters first and mostly for my dog - he's the most pampered pet you can imagine :-) This includes his own doghouse in the garage (that he hardly ever uses, but is used by the roaming cats in the neighborhood, much to Timmy's distress), an enclosed front porch with doggie door, basket, rug and private sofa, free roaming of the garden, two more beds inside the house, etc. You get the picture - he's the king of it all :-) As for wildlife, since we live on the foothills of a small mountain range and part of a natural park, we do get quite a lot of critters. We have a birdbath that is used not only by the birds but also by the bees and wasps, of which there are gazillions (we are in a honey producing area). Birds in the garden include sparrows, robins in Fall and Winter, loads of blackbirds, gold finches and a multitude of others I can't name. Last Saturday I saw my first swallow of the year. Above us on the hill we can frequently spot hawks, of which there are some colonies in the park. At night owls are a frequent visitor and we can hear their calls many times. Cuckoos are also a familiar sound as soon as Spring is here. I have a lot of evergreens in the garden and this provides excellent nesting sites for the birds. Preferred are the bay trees, laurustinus and the conifers. I'm constantly finding nests whenever I prune anything. I had a resident bat for about a year, sleeping in a closed garden umbrella we had on the patio. Unfortunately I had to remove the umbrella because the wasps decided it was a good place to nest, so it had to go. I was already stung twice, didn't want to be stung whenever I opened the umbrella! Still, bats visit frequently and it's common to see one or two flying around the garden at dusk. Some years we have glow worms in the Spring, which I absolutely love. It's magical to see them hovering around the garden at night. Other assorted critters include geckos, small lizzards, snakes, mice (yuk!), crickets, locusts and the occasional hedgehog. In terms of specifically catering for critters, I keep the birdbath going all year (we don't have hard freezes) and try to plant things I know will be used by the wildlife. This includes berry shrubs like pyracantha which are a major hit with birds in the cold Winter months. I also have a weeping mulberry tree and let its production go to the birds, who have a feast with the fruits. The compost pile is also a good feeding ground and there's a little bird that spends hours there hunting for the small fruit flies that proliferate inside the pile. Butterflies are catered for with things like lantana, mock orange and buddleia. I need to add more larval food to cater for butterflies, but haven't come quite up to it yet. I don't use any sort of chemicals in the garden, don't even spray the roses, and this of course translates into a welcome sign for critters, even if it means that slugs and snails are huge, sigh... I don't use a slingshot to get rid of them, like Edna does ;-), but I do throw them onto a neighbooring field that is kept wild. All in all, I consider a privilege to have wildlife in the garden and have been slowly educating myself to encourage it as much as possible. Eduarda
...See More
Off Topic: Beware the wildlife in your yard.
Q
Comments (19)
Nancy--In my post I wrote that I had lived in my home for 42 years among a various assortment of wildlife with no problems. I am in a situation right now which could be very dangerous to me, my visitors, and grandchildren as mother animals of most species will protect their young--sometimes voraciously. I have hired a wild-life specialist to capture and relocate this family. I am an educator and since children are naturally interested in animals and need to learn to respect them, I have used many animal speakers and demonstrations as educational tools in the classroom. The main point we always stress is that wild animals are just that. They may look cute, cuddly, needy, hungry, etc. etc., but they and their territory must be respected. And one must be especially careful around mother animals with babies-- i.e. you don't ever put yourself in a dangerous confliction with them. I did this because I had no clue I was in this situation, and it could happen to anyone anywhere. Most of the animals that are roaming our populated territories are not there because they have no where else to go (I live next door to a huge park), but because they have adapted to city life because that is where the "easy" meals are. Hosta-Junkie--a mother raccoon raises a litter alone mostly in tree nests that they build for that purpose. Her litter stays with her the first year of their life at which time they will often relocate in the same vicinity as she. Babka, I feel you are in a situation that would be past the fun stage of viewing wildlife as an interesting past time, and I feel bad for what you are going through as you can never let your guard down and feel safe in your own yard. I didn't mean for this post to be anti-wildlife. I just wanted no one else to have the experience that I had--like I say, be aware and careful even in areas you normally feel very safe in. Mary
...See More
Manufactured Homes?
Q
Comments (43)
I think we've come in at the middle of your thought process about moving. Do we gather that you are now living in your mother's home; she is returning to occupy it alone; you will be 'empty nesters' soon? You expect to move back to your mother's home eventually? Can you put at least 20% down and afford a 15 year mortgage on properties in your price range? (You'd want the house free and clear before retirement -- long before you are 80.) Do you have location limitations? How long have you been looking? By what date do you need to move? Must you buy? You might be ahead to rent -- provided there are rentals available. How long will you need four bedrooms and an office? Do you want to maintain and pay higher taxes on a large lot? One concern about a trailer conversion is that it has what is termed an irremediable fault: It is a trailer conversion. (Similar faults are when a house is on a busy street, backs to loading docks, etc.) You should be able to buy such homes for much less than comps without the faults, but you'll also get less when you sell. A little story: My late mother was a real estate broker. She sometimes had clients who had put off owning for years. They often started by looking for the home they dreamed of owning when their children were young. My mother would show them houses like that and mix in a few smaller 'cream puffs' that better suited their near-future needs. It was not in my mother's best financial interest to do this, but the buyers of smaller homes were later grateful. Often those who had bought big houses were soon asking my mother to list the houses so they could downsize. The houses and the costs of owning them were too large. Of course, then they had to pay moving costs again.
...See More
grow_n_gardn (CA, zone 10)
Original Author
19 years ago
Okay, so I spelled it wrong a second time. Let's hope I do it right this time. N-E-I-G-H-B-O-R-I-N-G

Hope that is right!
0
jean001
19 years ago
Rats tend to be a neighborhood problem.

Leftover birdseed, also dropped birdseed, contribute to the varied food sources rats feast on.

Some counties in CA have a Vector Control District. If that's true with your county, call them as they will help you with the problem.
0
lola1
19 years ago
Hi Growngarden - I can tell you from experience, roof rats (which is what it sounds like you have) are disgusting. Last summer, my fiance and I moved into an older home in a fairly wooded area of Fresno. One rather hot August night last year, I was feeding some kittens that had taken refuge in our yard, only to hear noises coming from the large trees above. I zeroed in on what I could not believe: roof rats---many of them.

My fiance went to the County Ag Commissioner (like the Vector Control District that Jean001 recommended above) the next day and received some bait which is supposed to only attract (and kill) the rats, not the birds, squirrels, and other wildlife. You wire it into the trees and it's a wax-type substance that they gnaw on. Rats like to gnaw. Be sure to watch your dogs for a while, as you wouldn't want them to get into the deceased rats. Also, after we researched the whole rat thing, we learned that they are also attracted to fruit trees (which we had many) and ivy. Hence, we tore down all the ivy growing against the entire length of our back fence, as they took refuge between the ivy and fence. Basically, it's important to get rid of any habitat that they are fond of. There is much info on the internet on what to do.

Rat infestations are horrible. It's not good for your animals ---or you---to be around the rats, as they carry disease.

Good luck!
0
dseerveld
19 years ago
I think it's prudent to remember a couple of things:

First, rats aren't horrible animals. People carry unfounded phobias about rats, the same way they do about snakes and spiders. It's ridiculous. You like squirrels don't you?

Second, there will always be rats outside. You can't do much about that. The key is, you don't want them inside your home, where they actually can do damage or spread disease.

Third, please don't use poison for rat control, especially outside. It is inhumane, AND IT DOESN'T WORK. It kills a few rats, a few rats don't touch it, a few learn to avoid it, and no matter how many you kill, new ones will keep on coming. If you leave poison outside, a raccoon or dog will eat it and suffer.

All you have to worry about when it comes to rats is that they can't get into your home. To ensure this, block off any rat entry points.

Here is a link that might be useful: Rat Prevention & Rodent Control
0
lola1
19 years ago
My intention was not to offend anyone who might be partial to rats. I agree that prudence is important in anyone's approach to problem solving, if, in fact, it is deemed a problem.

I would collect information from various sources such as the county extension/ag commissioner; websites; etc., and make an informed decision.

Rats do get in peoples homes. It happens all the time. I've known and worked with several people that had rats in their house and didn't know it. In one case, a co-worker didn't know she had a nest of babies under her refrigerator until she agreed to take care of her ailing mother's cat and the cat went bezerk around the fridge. This person was not a slob. The Norway rat does find its way in the home very easily.

The Roof Rat (which is what I believe we're talking about here) commonly takes refuge in attics. If one prefers not to have this situation take place, it is prudent to seal any holes and trim any branches that come close to or hang over the roof. They often take refuge in attics when the weather starts to turn cold, in the fall.

Blocking off entry points depends on the type of rat. Norway rats commonly live and move on the ground. Roof rats literally live elevated in trees, roofs, etc., They are excellent climbers and can scale wires, posts, etc., very well. These are the two main types of rats in the US, aside from a third rat that is only found in Hawaii, and not yet here on the mainland.
0
grow_n_gardn (CA, zone 10)
Original Author
19 years ago
Hello all!!
I am so grateful for all of your insight. Yes, an informed decision is always best. In this case, I've decided to eliminate or perhaps limit the bird feedings because limiting the dropped bird seed and bird waste otherwise would be more of a challenge. I will also do more frequent dog poop pickups and continue to make sure our trash can and trash bags are well sealed.

The rats personally aren't destroying my way of life. We do have some fruit trees that are small or presently without fruit but so far so good. Am I being optimistic? Yes, at least until I see a reason not to be. The dog acting up around the fence does get annoying, but dogs are that way around animals that are foreign to them or even other dogs.

If I were the neighbor I would remove the plant next to the fence to discourage them from staying there. Then again they could end up someone else's yard, so what good that ultimately would do (other that redirect the rats to a new unknown location), might be questionable.

Since the tree where any rat poison might be used is not on my property, I have limited access and ability to do that. The poison would be a last resort. As one of you said, having dogs or other "wanted" animals that could access it and not knowing the extent of poison effectiveness with the rats, is a turn off to me at this point. It is an option though, and I would rather have it than not.

I know that mentioned feces and I may have somehow heard about an association between rats and feces somewhere (news, other tv program), so that is why I brought it up. Although trash and feces were brought up, I don't wish to suggest that all people with rats are dirty and I'm glad someone made that point. I know that these creatures just want to survive and just sometimes happen to end up in our yards and home. They and other animals make no distinction on what we consider personal or non-personal property and that is just how it is.
0
grow_n_gardn (CA, zone 10)
Original Author
19 years ago
The information provided by lola1, on roof rats, was really helpful.

Here is more that I should have mentioned. There is a roof right next to tree where the rat(s) are. The roof belongs to what appears to be either a wooden shed or shack. So, with what was stated, it would make sense that they are living on that roof and/or inside. Actually, last night, I saw a rat go from the tree to the shed, which I had not seen previously. I wasn't sure if they lived on the ground and just liked climbing trees, but now it makes sense.

It seems that if the tree were trimmed or even removed, the shack would probably have to be demolished, to prevent rat access, because of its design.
0
father_o_4
19 years ago
It sounds like you are on the path to eliminating anything that is inviting them into your yard. If you do find them becoming a bigger problem, you can always get a Rat Zapper which will kill the rats as they come onto your property. Here is a site with more info, www.ratmousezapper.com.
0
adchon
18 years ago
Try this one. Make up a mixture of plaster of paris and wholemeal flower with a small amount of caster (icing) sugar for smell and put that out for the rats. Must be enough to fill their stomachs with the plaster of paris (more for plural rats), so they block up and cannot eat or digest food.
Here in Australia there is no problem with other animals geting at it, but there may be one in the USA I.E. Squirrels and Chipmonks.
The rats do not know what is going on and eventually black your establishment, the older ones may work it out, not so the younger ones.
The best part is that being non toxic animals that eat the dead rats don't get poisoned.
0
grow_n_gardn (CA, zone 10)
Original Author
18 years ago
This rat issue is quite a challenge. Soon after I posted this, I found out that there were rats living in my house. I've inspected the home and closed up some areas that could be letting them in. I stopped the bird feeding in May and keep the outdoor and inside home area as clean as possible, but the rats persist.

I have two non-lethal rat traps which the rats have avoided. I got them when I saw a small rat and thought it was the only one in the home (I would have released it to a location away from homes). Why non-lethal traps?...I like small animals and have owned hamsters in the past, so I can see all small animals in a positive light. However, rats eating (my) human food, chewing holes in walls and other items, putting feces everywhere, seemed too much for even a rodent/small animal lover, like me. So, I've put some small (lethal) mice traps out, still uncertain that they will be effective and not completely at peace with the idea of having to kill them, but it appears to be the only other option.

The only dead rat I've seen was killed by accident. I have a wicker chair covered with a floral cushion. I found the dead rat with its head sticking through the seat-part of the cushion... it had suffocated itself, by making the hole the size of its neck. Seeing the animal in that condition was not a nice sight, so I cut around its neck to release it and to simultaneously check, that in fact, it was deceased, and then I disposed of it. I found it odd that it could have gone in the cushion, but could not come out through the same opening I presume it went in through.
0
jennijenjen
18 years ago
Our neighborhood has a bad rat problem. I've been told that it's because of all the canals nearby and fruit trees. I have a neighbor who actually got rid of her birds to get rid of the rats.
We have a pair of beagles & 4 cats that control them pretty well but I'm reluctant to get any fruit trees.
Also I'm stuck with the dilemma of using chicken wire around the garden to keep the dogs & rats out but I want to allow the lizards in!
Could someone tell me how I could have any fruit trees?
0

Neighbooring rats

Comments (13)

brooksiefan

grow_n_gardn (CA, zone 10)
Original Author

Related Discussions

grow_n_gardn (CA, zone 10)
Original Author

jean001

lola1

dseerveld

lola1

grow_n_gardn (CA, zone 10)
Original Author

grow_n_gardn (CA, zone 10)
Original Author

father_o_4

adchon

grow_n_gardn (CA, zone 10)
Original Author

jennijenjen

COMPANY

BUSINESS SERVICES

GET HELP

CONNECT WITH US

Neighbooring rats

Comments (13)

grow_n_gardn (CA, zone 10)Original Author

Related Discussions

grow_n_gardn (CA, zone 10)Original Author

grow_n_gardn (CA, zone 10)Original Author

grow_n_gardn (CA, zone 10)Original Author

grow_n_gardn (CA, zone 10)Original Author

COMPANY

BUSINESS SERVICES

GET HELP

CONNECT WITH US

grow_n_gardn (CA, zone 10)
Original Author

grow_n_gardn (CA, zone 10)
Original Author

grow_n_gardn (CA, zone 10)
Original Author

grow_n_gardn (CA, zone 10)
Original Author

grow_n_gardn (CA, zone 10)
Original Author