Of all things, I really hadn't expected orchids to become the interest in "The Great Debate 2010." This whole conversation takes me back seven years. In February 2003, I was attending University majoring in none other than Horticulture with an emphasis in Business and Marketing! Wow! Ironically, I stumbled upon this discussion in hopes I'd find some help for an ailing Tolumnia I intercepted via raffle (free ticket) at our local Orchid Society meeting last evening. Anyhow, back in 2/03, I was shopping at a local Target store and a beautiful bloom caught my eye. Being from a 'lowly' farm, raising 'only' heirloom vegetables in our seven-acre family garden that nearly completely supported us and paid off the section of land and all our buildings on it, I had never even seen an orchid in person. Nor could I specifically remember ever "hearing" about one. I bought this orchid for $15.00 and it came in an ugly pot to boot. I cared for this orchid not knowing a thing of what I was doing and, quite frankly, didn't even bother to buy a book or do research about it. I was too busy and I was only thinking about the bloom in winter when there weren't any other flowers to be found through the snow and bitter cold. I didn't know why there was not tradition soil in the pot and I didn't know what to do to repot so I left it alone for three years! It rebloomed every year and I didn't know why, but I was greatly pleased. I am sure that, by now, you're all wondering why a Horticulture student (with a burning passion for plants) hadn't done any research. It's simply because I didn't have the time. I was going to school at least full time, had a part time job and a work-study job as well. I barely found time to eat and catch my coffee buzz. I must have, at some point, purchased a book about orchids because I have one and can't remember for the life of me where it came from. It's rather great! "Orchid Growing Basics" by Dr. Gustav Schoser. It helped me a great deal with repotting and making sure I was giving it the right conditions. It was all dumb luck. I put it by my bedside over a marble tray because it was pretty. Whoopie! No science, nothing fancy. Last year, when I joined our local orchid society, I realized the fact that it has a tag means SOMETHING. I only kept it because it's my "thing." I even did that with my ever-famous blue lake 274 bush beans (green beans) I grew for our garden and sold them at farmers' market every year. He's a Phalaenopsis "Brother x Lancer" by the way. He's beautiful and has taken lots of abuse from being neglected due to having babies. I have since never seen a tagged orchid in a big box store. I have purchased other orchids in big box stores, but lose my interest and throw them out. I've been soured out by the big box orchids due to finding them with viruses. My poor husband, who knows the way to my heart is through a houseplant (preferably Calatheas, Hoyas and Orchids) rather than a dying cut dozen of roses, bought a Dendrobium for me at Wal-Mart (when we were destitute and poor btw) and it had a serious virus so I had to throw it away. Can't have my blessed Phal. get sick by accident! The poor guy has no idea about orchids. I feel he was let down by the mass producer (from where, I do not know, it was all in Asian lettering) and Wal-Mart. The Dend. was unnamed and came in a nice, pretty pot. When the mass producers don't take care to name the orchid and ensure sterile conditions for the health of the orchid, does the money put into the prettier pot (a marketing scheme for sure) and instructions for care matter anymore? I'm sure he paid more than I would have for the Dend. Not to mention, it ended up a virused one anyhow. Unfortunately, I get the feeling from mensplace, that an orchid is an orchid is an orchid. One size fits all and, if it doesn't, the "orchid specialists" are of superior being than those who aren't "in the know." I've never felt this way. I have had orchids die, I've had to throw them out due to virus and I still have my first one (beginners luck). Why so many options for media, lighting and other care for orchids? It's not really an "aha moment" when you realize that orchids are found in nature all over the world. There are also different climates all over the world. Each orchid has its climate which is most conducive for the species to survive in. If you can't come close to duplicating that climate in your home (or any other chosen growing place) then the orchid fails to thrive and/or survive. As for marketing, the big box stores and the mass-producers *do* open the door for the love of orchids for the most part. Since my first experience in 2003 there have been strides made. The pots are prettier. This year, Wal-Mart is even selling them in beautiful glazed pots for $9.99. Yes, they are the Phalaenopsis (as always). I don't know about instructions for care as I do not purchase (doesn't mean I don't pay attention to what's going on), but at just $9.99 that's probably a free orchid with a pretty pot. The orchids roots will for sure rot if not taken out of the glazed pot as soon as it's purchased (luckily, the Phals. don't drop all the flowers/buds when repotted). I don't know about you, but I'd rather have a nice orchid than a nice pot. Feeling ill informed? Well, maybe someday "Big Brother" will mandate GPS units be put into the pots of the orchids so you can automatically receive culture sheets for your orchids in your mail box as well as advertisements for more orchids, pots, fertilizer, media etc. Until then, we've all learned about places such as the public library. You can utilize modern technology such as the WWW (specifically GardenWeb forums - many newbies to orchids meander this way) or search for an orchid book on Amazon.com. All these are common places for the everyday joe. I think I may have purchased my book at Barnes and Noble as I was partial to B&N in college for the coffee and quiet study time. On to scientific nomenclature: just so you know, *all* plants have Latin names. Latin, as I am sure you know, is the "dead language." It can never be misinterpreted and/or changed. When referring to any plant by genus and species (in some cases subspecies also), you can only be speaking of plant "A" whereas if you use a common name you could be speaking of plant "A" or plant "B" or even plant "C" depending upon where you live. For instance, if you start talking to me about "Swiss Cheese Plant" I'm going to assume you're talking about Monstera deliciosa, but you could be talking about Monstera obliqua. In any given situation, the care for plant "A" could be (and usually is) different than the care for plant "B." Latin names describe the features of a plant. Nearly four years ago, I made the choice to be a stay-at-home mom because I could not stand to be away from my baby and didn't want him to be raised by a stranger. We live off one income and it's very modest. We micromanage our money so we can provide for our children and still have family fun. Unfortunately, this also means I can't really afford to go out and buy orchids at my leisure; especially not the good ones. That's what I thought until last year when I joined our local orchid society! I got TWO NAMED orchids last night for $10.00. I also got a free orchid with my membership last year. It's a seedling and won't bloom for another few years, but who cares? I love plants and I love orchids. I only want ones with names because I am serious about them. What if I want to show them someday? I'll be able to with the name tags. Are we orchid growers, hobbyists and/or specialists snobs? In some way, yes. We all have our preferences for our own reasons. I have strong preferences for Calatheas and other rare tropicals, Hoyas (which you can also pay a pretty penny for - just head on over to the Hoya forum and find out) and Orchids (mixed preferences within genera). What I find lacking in the posts by mensplace is factual information pertaining specifically to orchids. The reason "we" only go for certain orchids are for personal preference, whether or not we want to show (for which there ARE standards to win ribbons and awards for each) and what kind of growing conditions we have to offer. Before you judge "us" and make further attacks, I urge you to learn more about the processes of growing and showing orchids. Don't be afraid to ask "Why? What? When? How?" when you don't understand. We don't judge here. We each offer our own personal experiences, preferences and growing conditions. Take what you will, leave what you won't. No one is going to hand-feed you instructions to match your situation perfectly. No one gave me a manual for these boys that I have! I have to find the best information to fit my situation and it's all trial and error. It's the same with orchids, but much easier.

To be honest, I have only done the theory part of this. Since the first post, I have spent every night researching the different methods of in vitro propagation. So while I have no real world experience, I have done tons & TONS of research & gotten lots of tips & tricks from those who are experts. So I am more than happy to pass on that knowledge, but just remember I myself have not successfully made these things happen. First, I think that using the Keiki Pro method will probably just work on plants like Phals & Oncidiums that have the nodes at the segments of the stems. Vandas (at least those in my collection) do not have those nodes at the segments. Lotte sent me a photo of Chiloschista that they removed the node coverings & placed into the sterile medium. I am planning to experiment with both the sphagnum moss & sterile in vitro methods when I eventually get my Chilos to bloom. I have really taken an interest in Meristem propagation of my Vandas, That involves removing root tips or shoot tips, placing them in a media with hormones that stimulate multiplication of the callus cells. These masses of PLBs (protocom like bodies) are then divides & placed into other flasks where they are placed on a medium that will allow for root development. I have read that meristemmed orchids do not necessarily mature quicker than seed propagated plants, but you can produce carbon copies of the adult plant much more quickly with this method! I have also read that Phals. will be ready for first blooming within a year of coming out of the flask when you use the in vitro node method! Again, I have not done these things myself, so I would encourage you to spend some time on the web or at the library reading about the methods available to you! As for Super Thrive. It is not a hormone; it is a concentration of vitamins that helps to make your plant healthier. It will not stimulate Keikis to grow like one of the hormone products (kind of like Centrum. It is a multivitamin that gives your body a boost, but it will not remove the blemishes from your hand. You need special product that has been designed to remove the blemish.) Get the Keiki Pro, it is an awesome product! Much better than the powder stuff! I hope this has answered your questions, if not, let me know... I just got back in from a run & my mind is not all here just yet =0) -Ray-

Linda, Orchids still seem advanced level for me. I am not sure why, as they are low maintenance. They are very common here for ornaments in every kind of store or hotel or beauty shop or restaurant because the natural weather is conducive. They are also very tidy looking and neat, no messy soil to spill. People use them to decorate instead of cut flowers. At parties, for table decorations, people can take them home. People who use them in their shops for ornament just rotate them out. Once they stop blooming, they put them into their "orchid farm," usually, their back porch where they are retired for a while. They seem to consider it a bonus if they bloom again. A friend of mine has a green thumb for orchids but not violets. I had to take care of them for her. I would give her my dormant orchids, she would get them to bloom. It is probably just a matter of learning what they need and not expecting too much from them after the first bloom cycle (orchids). Joanne This post was edited by fortyseven on Tue, Mar 18, 14 at 1:34

jspen jspen you are asking questions for which there are currently no clear cut answers. At this time the sheer number of university abstracts published on the subject is enough to boggle the mind. Not to mention the endless discussions about them. I gave up keeping up on them a couple years ago. This much we do know. What we as lay people call FMV is not. Its only the visual expression of a virus. In fact its not just one virus but many. Apparently there are many viruses that produce the same visual expression. Each can be spread to plants in different ways. Some by insects, some even through bird droppings. We also know that plants can have the virus and not exhibit any visual characteristics of infection. The only reliable honest to goodness way to know if a plant or tree is infected is by looking into that particular plants RNA. Then you would need to continually test the plant to be sure it had not become infected since the last test. Since visual cues of infection in infected tissues is so idiosyncratic. There are a myriad of theories that have yet to be proofed. One thing is for sure. Without continual RNA testing it is impossible to know with any certainty that any tree or plant is not infected. With what testing has already been done at the university level it appears that these viruses are prevalent and in fact endemic. It is more likely that any given plant is infected than not. In other words if you assume every fig tree you see is infected you will be right more often than not. With what little we already know its obvious that as lay people we cannot effectively fight FMV. We don’t even know if the trees in our yard have it or not. Ask yourself these simple questions. How can you fight something you cannot see? Something that can infect your trees without you even knowing it? Something that more likely than not my trees already have and I have no way of knowing? Again; Nearly every nursery and every fig collection has received trees and or cuttings from three main sources. All of which have long been infected. Not that they are the in any way responsible or the original source. Just stating fact. Not to mention all the collectors selling and trading trees and cuttings that originated from those sources. In closing. You cannot fight something you cannot see. It is utterly futile to fight something that spreads so easily. Someday people much smarter than I with lots of funding will find all the answers you are looking for after dedicating a lifetime research to the subject. When they find all those answers there is still a good chance they will find out its incurable and inevitable. I just don’t want to be the person spending all my waking hours trying to find out. Why would I? Most trees produce well in spite of the virus. Others appear only to be affected for a short time. Other varieties appear to show no signs even when RNA shows they are infected. Given all this I choose to spend my time thinking about other things. If or when a cure comes I’m sure someone will tell me about it. Perhaps that person will be you. One thing for sure. I’m certainly not going to pull anymore trees over it. Trying to fight something I can’t see ludicrous; tantamount to jousting at windmills. A blind baboon brain surgeon with one hand tied behind his back would have a better chance of success.