Good source for Pinus contorta var. latifolia 'Chief Joseph'?

15 years ago

Hi all. Anyone have a good mail-order source for Pinus contorta var. latifolia 'Chief Joseph'?

Took a quick look online yesterday but couldn't find any vendors. Just thought forum members would know a good, reliable place to get one.

Do they perform well in a typical midwest Zone 5 climate?

Also, about how large do they typically get? I see them mentioned as being "dwarf" conifers but how large might that be? I have a great space in our new garden bed but don't want to get something that grows 20 or 30 feet tall and overwhelms the available space.

Thanks

Dave

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Comments (7)

ken_adrian Adrian MI cold Z5
15 years ago
extremely rare.. and extremely expensive..

burns heavily in my z5 ... hopefully not so after it matures ...

expect to pay a lot for a very small graft .... do NOT buy a fresh graft ...

try coenosium ... or gee's... i would make phone calls ...

ken
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firefightergardener
15 years ago
I'd probably recommend Coenosiums. Having seen their stock first hand, Bobs' stash of 'Chief Joseph's are pretty large compared to most.

I think the growth rate is listed as half the rate of the species, or about 3-5" a year, so maybe 5' tall and 3' wide in 10-15 years.

Will
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Holly, the vast majority of conifers and plants I buy as 1/2 gallon pots. I have bought some 5-10 gallon plants or larger but generally I'm with you - my budget stretches further if I start with smaller plants. You'll probably have the best success with 2-4 year old plants in 1-gallon pots. Not too young that they are super delicate, and not so old that they are pot-bound and will take a while to establish. Coenosium Gardens stock size varies a bit by cultivar and rarity. The most coveted stock is usually quickly sold, meaning newer stock is generally 2-3 years old tops. As long as you plant them right, you should have a 90%+ success rate with 1-gallon sized plants. Over my three years of conifer gardening, I'd estimate I've lost about 2% of my cultivars a year, so maybe 1 in 50 plants. A rate I am more then happy with. -Will
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Hi Edwin. Yes I think I will do that ,but in any case,when I see one of your plants or others and I write here on the forum that I'd like to have one,you can take that as an order and put a label "sold" on it .So far I count six ! In fact,the only time when I get a chance to see a decent conifer display is at the Paris plant show,twice a year .There are the Laurains sisters, Ward Alpines (who carry a fair selection of conifers from Lime Cross Nursery in Britain, and also Vallonchene. I have also obtained some fine plants from Clement in Belgium by mail. Talking of wich (and in order not to deviate too far from the original post) I was wondering what the understock was on Clement's 'Chief Joseph'. What a shame to see a fair sized plant like that go down the drain! T.
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In the real conifer world everything is surviving naturally because nature placed it there. These issues of why it failed never come to mind. They come and go naturally. Gardening with conifers represents a real challenge. Why, because a big percentage of conifers you are growing are trying to survive away from their homeland where nature intended for them to survive. Most of us grow them on the edge where acclimation is questionable. If you want to do this expect failures. I have had my share. Certain cultivars require modest attention to insure their survivability. Others a more intense regimen of care is required. In spite of all our efforts we still loose them. The chemistry is just not right. A lot of variables come into play for a conifers survivability in a garden setting. Micro climate is number one. You have to figure out what yours is and what will successfully grow in that environment. Soil composition is a big player. Have you had yours checked? Planting correctly, watering and after care. All three of these require attention. Have some idea of the health of the conifer you are buying. Pop it out of the pot. Root bound, don't buy it. B&B, broken root ball. Don't buy it. This is a frying pan that just keeps on cooking. Big time if you have become heavily evolved in this venture of collecting. Count you losses only as opportunities for learning and enjoying the hobby more. Dave
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ken_adrian Adrian MI cold Z5
15 years ago
cant remember where you are..

be careful about bringing z8 stock into z4 or 5 ...

might want to keep it in the garage until the zones match up a bit ...

ken
0
gardener365
15 years ago
'Chief Joseph' grown onto seedlings of either Pinus contorta var. latifolia or better yet, those grafted to actual seedlings grown from a Chief Joseph will be winter burn free after a period of time. Those grafted to other hard pines such as sylvestris I've been told are likely to continue with needle tip burn issues throughout their lifetime. This is something that Bob Fincham at Coenosium Gardens has figured out through trial and error.

I'd stick with him. His grafts are generally immaculate as well as stocky. They cost 50 bucks for a one-gallon. While I don't believe he ships larger than that, it wouldn't hurt to ask. Basically, he's know for growing and having this plant, for sale, at all times. He must have a lot of stock plants.

Dax
0
noki
15 years ago
Coenosium sure makes it difficult it seems. You gotta call him then send him a check in the mail? And deposits? He could at least try paypal.

If I understand you could just order one plant when you order the 'Chief Joseph', that would be enough for an order.
0
bobfincham
15 years ago
Hi Noki,

You don't have to call to place an order. Deposits weed out the deadbeats and are only required until we establish a relationship. Checks are simple. Why raise prices to give Paypal their cut? You probably don't realize that their service is not free to the vendor.

If you care to look at the online catalog, everything is explained there with photos, availability is periodically updated, email corrspondence is a common form of communication, and the telephone is used by many of our customers who actually like to talk to a living person (Dianne, my wife and shipping department for our 2 person nursery).

Bob
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gardener365
15 years ago
I must say from my perspective that the annual catalog alone is as much fun as having plants delivered and boxes opened at your doorstep and the information too is, well, gold.

Bob, if you see it at all possible in the future it sure would be an asset to me to know the origin in as many cases as possible for the conifers. Having this information would provide details for Records to the ACS Website and in the future could clear up any discussion with elements of uncertainty. While it's true I'm very deep in information already to be added, I will get it all done and my plan is to never stop working/revising records for the ACS Database. It's a hobby for sure. I know it could be a lot to ask cause I'm not footing the bill! Anyways, just thanks to your consideration.

Dax
0

Good source for Pinus contorta var. latifolia 'Chief Joseph'?

Comments (7)

ken_adrian Adrian MI cold Z5

firefightergardener

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