Ykli- Isn't it human nature to be jealous and want what others have? Just kidding! It is a beautiful plant, and I'm happy for you, but I still really want one myself! I did get my Stanley order yesterday, and they are all very nice plants. Watch the new thread for pics hopefully later today of many of them! I was really disappointed though, I had several Calocedrus on the order and I guess they lost their whole crop over the winter. Might make me reconsider trying them here depending on what caused their demise in Oregon! They are rated to Zone 6 and though we are rated as 6 I still think we are a 5b at best. Though with careful selection of sites, I can usually keep Zone 6 plants alive with no problems. Keith- Thanks, I will contact you for the list. I have never ordered from Dennis though I always hear great things about him. I have been on the website several times before, but as you said it is wildly outdated...As mush as I hate to admit it, I am part of the modern McDonald's society that wants it Right Now!!! Eliot

Jay, I am married to a former Pennsylvanian and he still has relatives there who garden and every summer I envy their cool temperatures (you know, they think 85 degrees is hot) and their usually abundant rainfall. When we go there to visit in summertime, everything is so lush and lovely that it blows my mind, especially compared to how roasting hot and tired everything looks in this part of the country at the same time. On the other hand, Late Blight seems to be on a tear there the last few years, so their beaufiful crops can fail suddenly. Marcy, That's a great list from the Kerr Center. Thanks for linking it. Susan, I think each of us adds/drops varieties for many reasons. After growing tomatoes for 25 years on my own and for at least 15 years with my dad prior to that, I'm just through with the massive experimentation. The truth is that out of every 20 or 25 new (to me) varieties that I try, maybe one or two is worth putting into the permanent growing rotation. So, rather than constantly looking for something new, I'm trying to refine the grow list and weed out those that perform least well in a broad range of conditions. I've reached the conclusion that there really aren't many, or maybe not any, incredible undiscovered varieties out there that taste/perform significantly better than what I've already tried....so I've stopped looking. I had high hopes for the Brandymaster series, likely because it is so tempting to believe there could be anything that could match Brandywine's flavor. They've performed so poorly here that I doubt I'd see a better performance next year or the year after. While many of you may be seeing significantly hotter or drier weather this year than in your average year, for us here in southcentral OK, our rainfall has been exactly 'average' for the year to date and so have our temperatures. If anything we've had slightly lower temperatures, in general, in Love County than we usually have although higher than average heat indices. So, for me, this is a pretty typical year except the real heat arrived in mid-May instead of late June so we got hot earlier, but not necessarily hotter than average...just earlier than average. A tomato variety that didn't perform well in what was a fairly typical year here at our place this year likely wouldn't perform any differently next year. In Oklahoma we have a wide range of average annual rainfall....some folks may average 15" of rainfall per year in western OK while others in eastern OK may average 50-60" or more. Humidity varies widely as does soil type and pH. So, what grows well for someone in highly alkaline soil and water in western OK may not grow nearly as well for someone in eastern OK with entirely different weather and soil. I enjoy looking at everybody's lists and hearing how different tomatoes perform for different people but I know that works well in areas drastically different from mine may not work well here. Growing in containers is much more complicated. First of all, nothing that I grow performs as well in containers as in the ground. Heat and pests hit container-grown plants much harder every year than those in the ground. The grasshoppers have completely stripped my container tomatoes of every leaf and fruit, but have only done sporadic damage to in-ground plants. It is the same thing with spider mites....only the container plants have had issues with them this summer. For me, container-grown tomatoes are great from Jan. or Feb. through the end of June or early July. After that, I might as well yank out those plants and toss them on the compost pile because they're toast. Last year, the tomatoes in containers did somewhat better than they usually do....but we had much higher than average rainfall and much more rain/clouds/cool weather than we see in an average summer. I'm looking for plants that perform best in the worst of conditions, not the best ones, because more often than not, we get the worst conditions every July and August. In containers, I plant tomatoes that can tolerate the heat and the restriction of their root growth and still perform. That means I often grow tomatoes in containers that I don't consider 'good enough' to plant into the ground....stuff like Better Bush and Husky Red Cherry. I can't speak for anyone else, but I'm just at the point that I want what produces best for us here, and I don't want to keep looking for something 'better' because I don't think there is anything out there that's really that much better than our tried and true varieties that make our grow list most years. For a long time, I gardened for fun....trying any and every thing that interested me. We ate all we wanted fresh and gave tons away and didn't care if we put up much for the non-gardening season or not. In recent years, though, I've developed a deeper appreciation for the truly superior flavor of anything/everything that's grown locally and picked/prepared/preserved at its peak of perfection. Thus, I give away little and try to raise as much of our annual food supply as possible. In a good year I fill up three freezers, a root cellar and manage to can 2 or 3 or 4 hundred jars of 'stuff'. Since that is what is important to me now, I want plants that produce well, that provide tasty food we like and that are not prima donnas requiring a lot of pampering. Thus, I'm less inclined to experiment and more inclined to plant what produces really well with little fuss. In a lot of ways, the 'experimentation years' were a lot more fun, but the farm-garden-preserving years have been much more productive. Now my family is spoiled and I must produce as much home-grown food as possible because they don't like grocery store stuff as much as they used to. Even DS's firestation co-workers prefer fresh, home-grown and I'm going to try to plant a lot more for them next year so I can send them all the tomatoes, peppers and other yuummy things they're craving. There just isn't room, or enough improved soil, to experiment with varieties now as there used to be. I don't mind that, really, because as long as what I'm growing is producing well, I've gotten over thinking there are incredible varieties out there just waiting for me to find them. Megan, Black Plum grew very well for me for a long time and then for 2 or 3 years it didn't and I dropped it. It is odd how that happens....and I loved Coyote too. If my garden were twice as large as it is, I'd bring it back to the grow list. So many varieties, so little time (and improved soil). The tomatoes I grow from seed invariably outperform storebought ones and I don't know why, but I've seen it enough years to know it is true. Dawn

In mid-july, I looked at my row of AGGold - beautiful plants 4 foot high, I couldn't find a fruit. In late august, they started to show up, and now they're covered. I've concluded that to really appreciate the wonderful variety of flavor, tomatoes has to ripen within certain temperature parameters - below 95 day time and above 55 at night. Here, that means 3 weeks in July. So to do this, I have to have flowers on the plants when I set them out in June. Anyway... Thessaloniki came through once again with lots of perfectly shaped, tasty tomatoes. Cour de Boef - Some viral disease (I think) with scrawny plants, pulled the worst looking, the rest produced a good crop of decent tomatoes. This one, I may pop for new seed because thats 3 years in a row that they haven't looked good. The fruit looks suspiciously like German Red Strawberry. Vorlon - stabilized cross between Cherokee Purple and Prudens Purple - I grow this for the market, and this was my first to ripen. It's a beautiful fruit and has less distorted fruit than the other dark tomatoes I've tried. Great harvest. Pink Climber - spotted fungus leaf disease and never really took off. Off the Vine Brandywine. This is one tomato that I continue to grow because, if the weather is auspicious and the 'mater Gods are smiling, it is the best tomato I've ever tasted. But most years, including this one, it's just another tomato. Had to pull most the plants because of July leaf wilt crud. Rainy's Maltese - huge plants, good fruit, early producer, and I'll grow it again. Sun Gold - I was smart and only put in two plants, which are now monsters. Pick a lunch sack of tomatoes every day if I wanted to. Oh, and before I forget, there was some discussion here some time back on lack of Phosphorous being an issue with leaf turn, red veined leaves. So I filled a 3 gallon sprayer and filled it with high P soluble fertilizer (bloom booster) and gave everything a spray. It seemed* to work, the plants looked far better, the leaves straightened out. *note scientific lingo.

Thank you all for your kind comments. They have made my morning! I put a few plants in the yard four years ago when my husband and I built our new home. I had no idea I would be bitten but the gardening bug the way I have. I love every single aspect of it, from planning to playing in the mud, even pulling weeds. I thoroughly enjoy photographing my garden blooms and arranging them in bouquets. We live several hundred feet off of the road in the woods and the property is not visible from the road. So I really appreciate the opportunity to share what I do with everyone on Garden Web. So thank you all for humoring me and having a look. Also a big thanks to Beth and Iris gal for help with Mondiale??? rose. I have tried to do several google image searches on Mondiale and came up empty handed. The picture on the tag did look like my rose when it is first opening. I have been meaning to try a knockout rose and I guess I have. Does anyone know what kind of knockout it might be? Carrie