BA-yeah looks like the same plant to me too! Then again I dont have a trained eye!

Dennis

Hi Dennis. The photos don't do it justice. I was there when my friend bought the V. RxA, and it didn't look anywhere near as nice in colour, and it wasn't until I bought Gulz that I started to notice her plant, and couldn't help thinking they looked alot alike. She bought it around so we could see them side by side.
Even if it's not Gulz, I can tell you, she's pretty happy with it. Of course, I am extremely happy with mine, but just envious that she got such a lovely plant for half the price. Mind you, I've scored the odd bargain here and there.
How long should i expect to wait for flowers?
BA

Hi Guys

Yes they are possibly the same plant ???
However the reason you can,t find Vr. amazonica on FCBS is because it has been reclassified & is now Werauhia gigantea which also creates another problem because if the parentage is correct on the label, (which I feel it is as I also have plants with labels written with the same parentage), technically our plants are actually xVrierauhia.

This will require further investigation, will keep you informed.

Pinkbroms

Hi B_A,

Yes, you have noticed the similarities too. It's a long story about these two plants...but here goes.

Olive Trevor originally imported into Australia what has become known as Vr. 'Gulz'(not registered) in 1981 from Hans Gulz in Germany. She first sold it as simply a German hybrid from Gulz, and it was thought to be a platynema hybrid. That possible part-parentage is now questioned. I bought one from Olive several years ago, and have since discussed and recorded her background info on this plant.
Vr. Red Chestnut x amazonica (sometimes sold with reverse order of parentage) was named and sold by Pinegrove nursery, formerly owned by the Buchanan family, in northern N.S.W.. You are right - there is no Vr. amazonica by that name now, but what is known as Werauhia gigantea was once known as Vr. amazonica. However, I do not believe that formula name is correct anyway. Werauhia gigantea is a plain green-leaved plant with an insignificant inflorescence, and rarely cultivated. Many Australians thought (some still do) that it was a Buchanan hybrid, and sold it as such by that formula name - also unregistered. The name has perpetuated around the brom traps, and some are of the opinion that it is a different plant to the so-called Vr. 'Gulz'. I wanted to believe they differed, but proved myself wrong when I grew them side-by-side, with exactly the same conditions. They both flower at exactly the same time, have identical inflorescences, and for all the world are the same plant in every way - in my opinion.
I have heard theories that the leaf thickness and texture vary, but I have examined both closely and exhaustively, and I am convinced they are the same plant - and of German origin.
I do not know the parentage, but guess that fosteriana could be involved. It flowers at night, like many of the foliage vriesea species. It is a beautiful hybrid, and blushes pink all over when grown in bright light. The branched flower spike is not particularly colourful, but the foliage makes up for that.

I hope this info helps. Others might beg to differ with me on this issue.

Cheers,
Kerry

Oops, typing at same time as Ross!

K

Hi all,yes i to have both and at one time convinced myself that there is a slight difference,however having grown them now for several years and side by side ,i have to concede that any difference is in the mind of the seller .it certainly has Vr.fosteriana in its heritage ,but Vr.amazonica ? hmmmm sorry Wer.gigantea ? might have shared bench space with that plant,no closer than that,given bright light it can be very pink and pretty no matter what name on the tag,me? i will call it Vr.'gulz' it seems apropriate at this stage, i am with Kezz on this one. Jack

DAmn! I mean, I was pretty sure it was, but hoping not! he he. My friend will never let me forget she got a bargain!
Anyway, it is a beautiful plant by any name, and between us we can do the seed thing.
I'm kinda hoping ive got a vrierauhia! he he. Something different!
Thanks very much for your time and informative reply people!
BA

Come on B.A the fact that your friend got a "bargain" should not spoil your enjoyment,Gulz is a lovely plant and worth what ever you paid, if it makes you feel better when i bought mine 2 years ago i paid around $80- and sorry but no,there is no Wer. in its make up ,look at the flower spike,its compound and it should have a single spike if crossed with the Wer.gigantea,my guess is that its a cross with Vr.fosteriana and a green leaved multi branched flowering Vriesea of some type, there are a number of Vr.hybrids (foliage types mostly)wich are registered with multy branched spikes ,yet the given parentage will be from both single spike parents,come on now who is fooling who, thats impossible,specially if both are species to start with. look on fcbs at Vr.Karamea Granada.= Platynema x Guttata, its got a upright multi branched spike , i dont doubt the Platynema at all,but Guttata? its got a pendulous spike wich dominates allways, how did it get registered? any way B.A just enjoy 'Gulz' you will be pleased at any cost. Jack

Its Ok Jack, I am stoked with my plant, just envious of a bargain! Whats worse, is she didn't know what she was buying! I'm just a green eyed monster! ha ha.
I'm not really mad you know, just playing.
I haven't seen the flower spike yet, but will have to take more notice of the single or multi branched spikes.
I did wonder if Vr. guttata would give a pendulous spike? Thanks for clearing that up.
BA

Hi Guys

Have followed this up for you & yes as previously stated the parentage on the label is correct as per import from Kent's by Pat Coutts (Townsville area, Aus.) who imported the original plants under that name into Aus.

Although we all feel the parentage is a bit dubious (as I pointed out to Derek the similarity in appearance of this plant (R.C. x Am.) with Vr. fosteriana var. seideliana x platynema var. variegata on F.C.B.S back in mid May) the fact is we can't disprove the parentage until we flower another plant & do checks.

Points to look at, also noted by Vriesea
Vr. fosteriana has a simple spike (single not branched)
Vr. platynema & varieties have a simple spike.

Simple x simple gives simple progeny

Compound (branched) x compound gives compound progeny

Simple x compound gives mixed progeny

Both K.B.T. & Vriesea have pointed out that this plant has a compound/branched flower spike/inflorescence, "not particularly colourful" K.B.T
Vriesea says "my guess is that it's a cross with Vr.fosteriana & a green leaved multi-branched flowering Vriesea of some type"

From Flora Neotropica, Smith & Downs states, "Vriesea amazonica: inflorescence few-branched or simple, leaves green concolorous."

Vr. amazonica now Werauhia gigantea which on F.C.B.S is a green leafed, multi/few-branched plant.

It appears both Vriesea & K.B.T contradicted themslves, Vriesea on one hand saying Vr. amazonica not possible as a parent, & on the other hand stating a possible parent that sounds like the description of Vr. amazonica.

My Vr. Red Chestnut x amazonica last flowered with a simple/not branched inflorescence, so the jury is still out on this one for me until the next flowering & taxanomic work can be done. (& then a guess)

This is not to say that the plant imported from Kent's wasn't imported by Kent's from Germany into the U.S. in the first place (which could make them the same plant??).

The problem being there are a lot of these crosses out there with no proper records, so budding HYBRIDISERS keep proper records, it's NOT a big secret.

I would leave the labels as is, as it appears the 2 plants in question are from 2 different import (to Aus.) sources, & remains a Vriesea till proven guilty or otherwise.

Vriesea, the parentage of Vr. Karamea Granada I would say is more likely gluttinosa not guttata, as you say it has a multi branched erect spike not pendulous. (probably a typing error on somebodies behalf at sometime or other)guess only ???

Pinkbroms

Thanks for that lesson PB. Its alot to take in at once, but I'll go back and read it again. It will be even more interesting then, to see what the flowers of the two pictured plants look like. I will try to dig this post up again when they do and put on some pics.
Does anyone have a photo of Werauhia gigantea in flower? Never mind, I'll go look at the FCBS site.
Thanks again for all this great information
BA

No I did'nt contradict myself , i said a Vriesea of some type , wich is different to a Werauhia,amazonica or gigantea as its now known,wich it is claimed to be one of the parents .you just misread it.and the N.Z plant was not a typing error as it was also written up that way in the N.Z. Bromeliad journal article by the people that bred it ,on two occasions my guess is that tags got mixed early in the piece ,i have flowered 'gulz' with single and multi spikes,this happens at times also with 'Angela' and 'Erotica' to mention a few ,and that seems to be more cultural. Jack