You have never offended me. I think you're a great guy. do what you gotta do.

Bless you Ron! We stand by you!

I'm shocked by what has been said...but I'm going to keep my mouth shut so I don't incite more abuse...I stand by you Ron, & Trudi too.
Maggie

I have to be honest guys, I think that this was handled very inappropriately. So much so, that I am afraid of being 'bashed' by voicing my opinion about it. I keep telling myself to stay out of it, but there are some things that are still bothering me. I do not think of myself as a good communicator, but I will try.

I have never paid to be a member of DG. But, I have used, on many occasions, the plantfiles there. I think that it would be pretty cool to do a google search, select the option to visit DG to research a particular plant and then be able to see immediately if it has been wintersown in my Zone without having to do any further research. Since the Plantfiles are free to the public, it really would be an awesome tool for all gardeners.

As I stated earlier, I have been on this forum for 5 years and have been wintersowing for 4. I feel that this forum is just as much mine as it is anyones. I love to winter sow! I think that most of us are very passionate about it! I think that this passion has caused for much emotionalism whilst dealing with this issue. There appears to be quiet a few people that are members of both gardening sites. So, what will happen if they have submitted WS results to the GW database and now want to also submit it to the DG database? Will this be 'copying'? Please, please understand that I am not saying this as a smart-alec, I really want to know. Also, I still don't know why Trudi made deliberate mistakes in the GW database. I am hoping that they were just typos or some kind of insignificant changes that didn't affect the WS data. (Trudi, please forgive me if you have already answered my question in the other post ~ just in case you answered it while I was typing this message.)

The first thing that didn't jive for me was when Trudi posted such personel information on the lady at DG who 'started' this mess. I know that nowadays, everyone can find info. on just about anyone on the web, but gosh, I would be very taken aback if someone found out my home address and posted it to a public forum.

And just to be completely honest and upfront, I did pay my money to become a member of DG today. I wanted to be able to discern all that was going on over there that seemed to have caused this issue and Dave hadn't moved it over to the free forum yet. I will continue to visit this site everyday. I will also now visit Dave's site everyday. I love to read about gardening and get new ideas. I love to see what everyone else is doing in their gardening.

I hope that this can all blow over and everthing get back to normal, but I do believe that the way this was handled was wrong.

If you have read through this whole post (the longest that I have ever written on this forum) then let me please quote Bakemom and say, "anyone need seeds? =)

Necia

sorry, but there is already a forum that is called "Warm and Fuzzy", so I guess you can NOT use that one, either!

If you would all go to DG and contact distantkin, then she could send you the Dmail that Trudi has sent to her. Then you could make your own decision on what forum best suits you!

necia
#1 The info that Trudi posted had nothing to do with DG.
It concerned another web site.
#2 Any info you submit to this site or another is your info and you can do what you please with it.

flowersanonymous
But we are the orginal.
Ron

flowersanonymous

Get off my post. Start your own

Any info on the database that is sent to me to be added is done so fairly. I have your email that shows you share the information for inclusion in the WS database. Anyone can post at either database. I have no idea how DG will handle sharing the information but that is a question for their webmaster.

I do expect that people who share information with the WS database have not copied it from another existing database, that would be falsely supplying that information.

Sharing your own info is 100% okay!

Due to this current event I have been made aware that there are numerous copy and pastes of information from WSEO that have been posted at Dave's without my permission. WSEO freely share's info with non-profits and educational institutions, but DG is a .com with pay-to-view forums. The method information that was taken without my permission was method information that I myself generated. I understand that Winter Sowers can be very enthusiastic in sharing information and ideas but it's time to draw the line. I have emailed Terry/Dave that in the future information from WSEO needs to have permission accompanying it when posted at DG, that way there will be no false accusations.

The WS database is a compilation of data from the GW WSers, it would be wrong for me to give permission to freely allow that information to be copied and duplicated. I have defended this position and will continue to do so.

If positions were reversed I think that we would see a mirror of commentary.

T

No apology necessary! I stand by you and Trudi. I do not believe anything either of you posted was offensive in any way. I would probably have handled it in the same way.

Rhonda

Ron,

Thank you for pointing that out. I was confused and thought that it was refering to the person on DG that had requested that Trudi participate in their database.

Necia

Love you Ron!

Carrie

I'll split my brownie with you Ron :)

Ron,
I stand by you also!!

I've been here for at last 4 yrs and although I don't post alot I love this forum and its members.

Wendey

Ron & Trudi, you have the right to say what you believe and how you want the information you work on so hard to be used.
Trudi has a great non-profit website where she offers free seeds and free information and if it wasn't for Trudi, winter sowing would not be as well known/popular as it has become - she is the person who has publicized this method to the greatest extent. Ron has been the one working on this database for a long time and compiling all the information for us.
I see no problem with people having strong feelings about something they have invested much time and effort, esp. non-paid. I really respect both of you for all you do for other gardeners on your own time. I'm not going to get into the details of what was said and who said what to who as one who has written a number of 'hot' emails. I can only comment on the dedication of what I have seen from Trudi and Ron on this website.

squirrel

I also have kept my big mouth shut, pretty uncharacteristic of me. But like Necia I think the issue was handled poorly on both sides. This includes not only things that were said as much as the mean spirit, the unkind undertones that came through the words.

I got my start at GardenWeb. I had to check my member pages to see how long I have belonged. Turns out I joined in Sept. '04. So this WS forum has been my home for over 3 years now. But I also joined Daves in Feb. '06. I don't intend to divorce myself from either. I also belong to some Yahoo garden groups but I can't see how belonging to multiple garden groups on the web should be a problem for anyone in any way, shape or form. I have reported my database here in the past and will continue to do so. Will I contribute it to Dave's as well? Maybe, depending on how it evolves, how much effort and time it takes. When gardening becomes something I see as work, I back off.

I'm always trying to get people to try wintersowing. (I have 6 new recruits at work this year!) I give them links to places like this forum (the FAQs are here), and Trudi's site. Do I ever paraphrase information on Trudi's site? Most definitely!, probably both in cyberspace and the real world. I put so much effort into learning to WS the first year I tried that I can probably recite a lot of it verbatim like I could the Baltimore catechism in second grade. I certainly make no $ from this, in fact it costs me because I give away so many seeds trying to encourage people to wintersow. I thought this was the spirit of sharing wintersowing, the "pay it forward" philosophy. Now I feel like the wintersowing police will be knocking on my door.

As I said I often direct or link people to this forum or Trudi's site but now I will be reluctant to direct people to WSEO, holding in back of my mind Trudi's open announcement that there is "misinformation" planted within. A shadow of doubt has been cast.

It doesn't foster that "warm, fuzzy" that drew me here in the first place.

I guess we just have to put the issue to rest. I'll shut up.

Karen

Ron:
I'm with you and Trudi. I say enough and Amen to all prairiemoon2 had to say.
Mike

Trudi & Ron were defending their family and their hard work. I personally might have not handled it too well if it were me in that situation. Actually, they handled it a lot better than I would have! Of course it could have been delt with differently and Trudi and Ron as well as all involved probably know that, but hindsight is 20/20. I too belong to several garden groups on Yahoo, Myspace, Gardenguides and a few others, but this will always be my family. I LUV you guys and I love this forum. Peace out.

Vera

... and Amen to all prairiemoon2 had to say ...

When I get older they think I'm a fool,
The teacher told me I should stay after school,
She caught me pounding on the desk with my hands,
But my licks was so hot ...
I made the teacher wanna dance, and thats why,
I don't wanna work ...
I jus wanna play on dese drums all day"

[hiccup ... ummm ... scuse me.]