I guess it's time for me to go beyond a general interest in LA and decide what it is I want to do. What stirred my interest and question was the combination of outdoors work, creative work, nature, environment, and the fact that getting into LA with an engineering/geology background might easier than switching to something else "creative" that didn't involve the science/engineering side of LA. As it turns out, I am really less interested in that part though. So maybe LA is not the degree for me or at least overkill. I have since talked to two local industry professionals which has been another eye opener. It seems, the two work at opposite ends of the spectrum. One designs high-end backyard paradises, deals with planting and design. The other has a workload that consists mostly of landscaping the space around his company's architecture projects, and deals with irrigation issues, city codes, turf grass, and sprinkler systems. The latter doesn't sound nearly as much fun as the former. It sounds too much like engineering. The guy was great, almost a life saver, provided a wealth of information, and yet I came away thinking maybe I am peering down the wrong alley here. Maybe I shouldn't try to pursue LA but continue gardening at home. Anyway, I got a number of leads for additional people to talk to, and I will see what they say. I could see myself working on residential projects and even for some municipal department. 99% of the cities I see are in dire need of landscaping and protecting those small and shrinking green interstices. Maybe my green passion for nature and environment would be better spent somewhere else rather than possibly having to go to work for a company that's "landscaping" urban sprawl. I don't mean to offend anyone. I just think much of urban USA is not a nice place to live. Is LA the field for someone wanting to make a difference here, or should I look into urban planning ? Anyone ? I'm confused.

David, I checked out your profile and I can see you are an ambitious individual. It's very impressive that you have started a successful business at such a young age :-) And that does change somewhat what my typical advice would be. How much does a college education matter to you? What sort of a fall-back plan do you have if your landscaping business does not thrive? How would you prefer to earn a living, should it come to that? I am not intending to spread gloom and doom but ours is a service industry highly dependent on disposable income and if that income dries up - as it did about 7 years ago - ours are the first kind of businesses to go down the drain. It is just a reality that you need to be prepared to face. Like I said previously, it is a BIG jump from a lawn care business to landscape design and installation. I think you anticipate taking your business into the design-build realm and that is a somewhat natural progression. But design-build firms tend to focus on residential projects. It is a whole different ballgame when it comes to commercial landscape planning and design and that is typically well beyond the scope of a design-build. If I can make an awkward analogy, it's a bit like designing and building a skyscraper compared to building and designing a single family residence. The first has a team of architects that do just the design portion. Once approved, the whole ball of wax is turned over to the general contractor and the subs for construction and typically (except for some limited oversight or approval of change orders) that's the last the architects are heard from or involved. With the SFR, the designer is often the general himself and is intimately involved with the construction process all the way through to completion. So to finish this analogy, LA's are not normally associated with a design-build company and usually work completely independently from any installation contractors. You will have a big learning curve here so my suggestion is to start small. Hire a designer, maybe even on a part time basis as the need arises. Note that I said 'designer', not an LA. Until you have established a landscape design reputation, you won't generate the need for a full time designer and most LA's will require full time employment plus benefits. And their higher/different level of training typically calls for a higher salary as well. Plus, residential landscape design does not require the same educational background or licensing requirements - the vast majority of LA's never do residential projects - there's just not enough money in it to make it worth their while. Although an unlicensed, fresh out of college LA may appreciate the experience of a design-build environment, before moving on to bigger and better things. You will also need to educate your crew into the technical aspects of landscape installation. They will need to know about grading and drainage, how to install irrigation systems and landscape lighting, build retaining walls, install various hardscape elements, operate heavy equipment, etc., etc., etc. Pretty different from lawn care skills or light pruning :-) None of this has answered your question about getting a degree yourself. And I can't answer that for you. Part of it has to do with my very first paragraph - what kind of fall-back plan do you have for your life and your career? I can say that most accredited universities - those that provide degrees in Landscape Architecture - do not offer night classes. And the course work is very intensive. So you have to be prepared to put your business on hold while you attend 4-5 years of classes and whatever apprenticeship period your state requires or turn it over to your brother or other responsible employee to manage in your absence. But at the end you will have a degree you can rely on for employment (albeit very specialized employment) elsewhere or in the future. An alternative is to get formal training in landscape design. This is typically a two year Associates degree and is often offered through community or technical colleges, sometimes in association with a horticulture degree or certification. Night and weekend classes are common so you can run your business AND still get an education. This type of training should also introduce you to all the technical aspects of the business as well but all the classroom, book-learning in the world will not prepare you as well as hands-on experience. And you definitely want to get that well under your belt before offering these types of services to paying clients. So even with a landscape design degree, an apprenticeship with an established design-build company is highly advised. I seem to have written a book here :-) Let me just sum up by saying that moving from residential landscape design into commercial/municipal landscape design projects is not common for a design-build firm. Most DB's do not have the skills or resources to accommodate that switch nor are the developmental bodies that sponsor or oversee these sorts of projects inclined to look at DB's as a source for either a designer or an installation contractor for the same reasons. Sure, I do a few commercial projects now and then but most are just simple parking lot planting plans or just larger scale residential projects - like designing the common areas for condo associations or street plantings for a residential development. And these are all types of projects a non-licensed designer or a DB with adequate experience is able to handle. I hope all this is somewhat clear :-) feel free to ask for any clarification you might need. Familiarity with the subject sometimes leads to overlooking or leaving out significant points but I think/hope I've hit most.

You may want to contact APLD for a member list. Word of mouth referals come from talking to people in your area who have recently had landscapes built that you like on homes similar in style and value to yours. You mentioned that you are in a rural area which would make one assume that there is not a lot of properties that would fit the description above. That really cuts down on the opportunity for word of mouth referal. Because of that limitation, I think you have the choice of trying to complicate the process, or to just dive in and speak directly with people offering these services in order to try to find one that you are comfortable with and is interested in your project. You will wind up doing that no matter how you determine who you will call. I'm suggesting that it might take less time and effort to start there given that most rural areas do not have a huge long list of LAs and LDs in the yellow pages. I would not discount those that do not advertise heavily. This is a business that requires a lot of time invested in a project before you actually get a signed contract to work - driving out to meet client, spending time discussing project, walk through the project, show portfolio and self promote, define the scope of work, and write up a proposal. Advertising heavily draws lots of dead leads which burn up a lot of time. Consequently, busier people tend to advertise less in order to avoid that wasted time. Word of mouth referals are much better to the designer because they tend to match the profile of the people who he already has done work for therefore having a much higher liklihood of getting the work. There are several things working against you that is going to limit the response to you. I'm not trying to rain on the parade, but only to point out how it is viewed from the other end of the phone line. 1. You are in a rural area - Often landscaping is a keep up with the Jonses thing. If the Jonses don't have much, the Smith's are not usually looking for much either. It also means more time invested in trying to get the work due to the distance. 2. You are going to implement the job over a longer period of time. That will deflate any design/build company because they translate that to mean that you don't want to spend any money on having them build it or you want to do some of it yourself. 3. A small budget to start with. - This combined with the above is going to make a prospective LD/LA think twice about taking the time to pursue the job. This is because they know they have to make their income on the design alone since there will be little opportunity to manage the project or sell materials. Designers learn very early on that when the budget is low people don't tend to spend a grand or two on a design. While it is not always true, it is not a productive segment of the market, so it is usually avoided. What a potential client sees to be an opportunity for a designer can also be seen as a high potential of a lot of time and effort invested in a low paying job with a very slim chance of getting it. What do you expect to pay for a Master Plan?

I am no expert, but, I'd say it depends on how far along your plans are, your level of knowledge and what you want to accomplish. Landscape Architect Designs the garden, taking into account different elevations, planned usage, climate and drainage. They should forecast how the landscape will look in 10 or 20 years, so as not to plant trees that are too big or shrubs that take over. Landscape Contractor Does the actual landscaping. Creates suitable ground conditions such as proper water drainage, digs the right sized holes for the trees and bushes, adds the proper amendments, and does eerything to ensure the long term health of the plants. Here's a recommendation: Zack Smith, http://touchtrees.com/ What I like about Zack is his knowledge, enthusiasm, and ability to first understand your vision then to add practical suggestions. He seemed to know every tree I mentioned and whether the location and orientation in our yard was right for it. He had some great suggestions as alternatives to the usual lawn which will be difficult for us to maintain in an all-shady area. If in doubt, have a short conversation with John Black. If he is not the right person for your project, he will cheerfully suggest what kind of expertise you will need and specific professionals who can help. It's refreshing because you see that sort of generosity so infrequently! Also - I found a terrific wholesale nursery! It's Ogawa-Mune in Fremont, off of 880 near Stevenson Blvd. Yes, it's a bit of a trip, but well worth it. They offer acres and acres of very healthy specimens, some of which are very different from what you see in the usual nurseries. And, the prices are terrific. They can deliver for a small fee, or will waive delivery fees if you order a certain minimum amount. Wish I had more to offer. I hope it goes well for you.