A "floor" is not necessary for composting to take place - completely housed systems (e.g., tumblers) work just fine. The absence of a floor can make it easier for earthworms to join the party if the pile conditions are suitable, but in an open bin they will probably find their way in anyway, condition dependent. The absence of a floor can, however, provide an easy entry for furry pests.

When I've had open piles I never had a problem with pests, but many have. You might find some useful ideas in the linked tip sheet form Cornell.

Roof also is optional. Keeping rain/snowfall out gives you more control over the moisture level. But I suspect most piles are left open, and they work just fine.

Here is a link that might be useful: Preventing Animal Nuisances in Small Scale Composting

As soon as the first batch turns to compost, it will sift through the mesh floor and fill in the gap anyway. I only use a mesh floor on the all-food-waste composting bins at our office building, to keep out digging critters.

Your frame will rot anyway, slower or faster depending on climate and what's in the bins. Note that if the compost is damp as it should be, there's plenty of biological action going on against that wood. A lot of people use free pallets which are easily replaced, or plastic or treated lumber which lasts longer.

As for roofs, I don't have a permanent one. You might want to have a tarp or piece of plywood or barn tin handy to cover it when it's too rainy or too hot and dry, or if you make a roof, hinge it so you can leave it completely open when you want to for moisture management. But as TXEB says it's not mandatory.

oh that is gorgeous. I vote for location #2. When I was first looking at the initial location, I could not figure out how you would get in there with a shovel/pitchfork to move stuff/turn your piles. In location 2 you have all the room you need. Can you SINK the pavers at the perimeter so that your lawn mower wheel can roll over them? It would be nice if the perimeter of pavers could somehow curve so that you do not have to take sharp turns with the lawn mower. Love how you can save leaf bags next to the shed!

I like it in the "alternate" location - it's more accessible, which you will appreciate once you have things working.

Any more opinions on the how I should go about making the base of the system? Would I see a big difference in compost production if I have a perimeter type base where each bin would make direct contact with the ground (separated only by hardware cloth) vs. making a completely solid platform with the pavers for the entire structure to sit on.

Would I see a big difference in compost production ...

No.

So, scientifically speaking, how do the organisms that breakdown compost arrive on the scene? I would have assumed that entry from beneath each bin (i.e. bare ground) would be the route.

Then explain how closed systems like tumblers work.

They are already present in the debris and waste materials being added to the pile. It's like natural yeast that is present in milled grains - it came with the grain.

I can't explain....because my tumbler was awful in terms of production of compost. I Craiglisted it and turned my interests to my current endeavour.

But you've answered my question in my favor because a solid level base is something that would be easier for me to create as opposed to a perimeter-type base to keep just the framing off the ground.

In composting the most common reasons for problems are moisture level (either too wet or too dry), the mix (too high C or too high N), and/or insufficient aeration.

A number of people advocate when starting a new pile to add a small handful of normal healthy soil the first time as an inoculant. It surely won't hurt anything, it might help get things started, but it also surely isn't necessary.

Bacteria is everywhere and given appropriate conditions will flourish. Ground contact isn't necessary but will help with drainage in the event of a high moisture event (heavy downpour). Often, a persons personal preference determines how they want it to look. Having said that, air infiltration from the bottom is usually very beneficial.

Lloyd

Your compost bins are a work of art, njitgrad!

I've never seen the need for a 'floor' on a compost bin and also never had earthworms in my compost.

Whether you need a roof or not depends on how much precipitation is usual in your climate. I live in a dry climate so have only occasionally used a piece of plywood to cover during infrequent periods of heavy rain.

Organisms are everywhere, in the basic materials you are composting, in the air, and perhaps delivered by birds. I have occasionally put a shovelful of forest litter or garden soil in my compost but I doubt it made much difference. Composting is an exercise in patience!

My OCD would (and did) demand that my bins be level. I spent all that time & effort making them square in the garage--I was not about to have them all crooked-like when in place. So I graded my site a little bit on one side, and supported with a few bricks on the other.

You'd have to do a similar bit of shovel-work to do the pavers, right? Why not just do that, but put the bins directly on the ground, and get your money back for the pavers? (or do something else constructive with them).

Also, if it helps. My soil is clay, and I find that when emptying a bin that's had the compost for a while, I can clearly see where the clay starts, but that first 1/4" to 1/2" of clay has been so worked over by bacteria/fungi/worms, that it's pretty good looking stuff. I'll often find a use for it filling a mole hole, etc. etc. I think of it as a little bit of free soil for use around the lawn/garden. ;-)

Either way you choose, compost will happen. C+N+water+time=compost. :-D

That new bin system really does look more like a piece of fine furniture than something for holding compost. Leave out the hardware cloth, put in a few shelves, and it would make a great entertainment system. Rather than fill it with leaves and kitchen waste I suggest you fill it with electronics and put a new 70" widescreen TV right on top.

I wonder if your tumbler system that did not work may have been falling short on the total volume of materials, since you need a lot to help build up the heat. I have never used a tumbler but I know some people have success with ones that are quite large.

It is hard to tell from the pictures, but are the front panels removable so that you can get at the materials when you want to turn them over to another bin?

Going against a bunch of suggestions, I decided on location #1 (to the side of the shed). I will post pics later on what this looks like. The biggest decision making factor swaying me away from location 2 was having to relocate a sprinkler head located in the corner where my lawn ends and the mulch begins.

My revised plan is as follows: move wood rack out of the way, remove mulch from the area where the compost bins will be located, excavate 3-4 inches of soil of an area just slightly larger than the base of the bin system, make an enclosed perimeter with landscape edge pavers, fill in the enclosed area with pea gravel, the position and level the entire compost bin over the gravel. The bottom of the compost bin will be covered in hardware cloth so none of the pea gravel gets scooped up when I turn my bins.

Does this sound like a better alternative than making a solid foundation out of the cinder blocks that I was planning on? I figure with the pea gravel I would have better drainage since the lids of my bins are going to be only protected with hardware cloth.

Moving one sprinkler head is lot easier and would take less time than the added work you've outlined.

As for drainage, it really shouldn't be an issue. The bins won't act like funnels, in fact, the material in the bins will act as a bit of a shield or sponge. I suspect that a hard base would be easier to work with when moving the contents out of a bin. When those patio stones are installed as pavers there is a little gap left between them that subsequently is filled with sand or something similar (many of the stones have a molded in ridge on the edges to fix the spacing), and those gaps will allow for drainage. Putting the stones on top of a drainable base (paver sand, small gravel, etc.) will help that.

If you go with straight gravel underneath, eventually the pores between the stones will get filled in with decomposed organic matter from the compost.

OKAY.... the debate continues....(by the way, thanks for all you die-hards for sticking this one out with me).

Here are three pics from a short while ago. Notice that I removed the firewood rack and simply propped the two main sections of the bin system on pavers. I also moved my round walking path pavers closer to the shed to compensate. The two main sections have already had hardware cloth installed on three sides. They are not connected together yet so I can't put the hardware cloth in the middle section until I join them. The bottoms current have no hardware cloth either as I debate how to proceed.

Is there really not enough room between my shed and the fence as some originally thought? I can easily get a wheelbarrow through. Believe me, I've tried. There is plenty of ventilation on all sides, even more so than if I had it on my lawn becuase of the pine trees on the other side of the fence.

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This post was edited by njitgrad on Mon, Sep 9, 13 at 14:20

You'll have to decide where to put it. But either way, put it there and get on with filling the thing. I don't say this to be harsh or critical, but you really are overthinking this. After you've been at it for a few weeks/months you will soon figure out what does and doesn't work for you. It's a very personal thing. You really need to just put it somewhere, and get on with it. After next spring, you can then make improvements to where and how your system is used.

looks like you are ready to go! If you can get in there with your shovel/pitchfork and simulate scooping stuff from the bins with the instrument being "not too vertical" to avoid hitting the shed, then you should be able to turn the compost. Having room for the tool to go in front of the bins (clearing space from the front corners) would be nice so that you do not need to lift the compost OVER the sides to turn it from one bin to the other. If you have to lift it OVER, you will soon be very tired. Might mean looking for a shorter length fork/shovel, but see if you can simulate the turning with the tool fairly horizontal for scooping.

I never thought about the turning process and the clearance for the shovel/pitchfork. I am so glad I ask as many questions as I do. I will try later on today and report back.

TXEB, I agree with you that I'm overthinking this, but that's just what I do. Too often I make costly or time consuming mistakes and with a project of this magnitude (at least for me it is) I'd rather play it safe than sorry. I am getting great suggestions from everyone, yourself included and I greatly appreciate it. I won't be doing any work on it this week because we are hosting a birthday party for my daughter this weekend and I don't want to tear up my lawn to move a sprinkler head or do any excavating to make a base for my bins. So until next Monday, I'm just trying to layout my plan forward so I can finish this baby up ASAP and start composting.

Not sure how long I'll have to wait until I can actually compost because the Tung Oil has to dry for a few weeks, doesn't it? I cut it 50/50 with the Citrus Solvent (which evaporates) to allow easier application but it still has a tacky feel to it. It's probably best to wait a few weeks, right? Whenever I maneuver it I just wear work gloves to keep my hands from getting all oiled up.

nj - didn't mean to jump on you. Careful planning is a good thing. I spent the majority of my career doing very long-term strategic planning and running project based on those plans. My only counsel would be just don't let the analysis paralyze you. Once you're engaged you will come up with about a dozen things you will want to differently than you planned to do them.

And on timing, yeah, do wait for the tung oil to cure a bit. Wait until the tack is basically gone.

Hi. I'm trying to figure out how to ask the community questions. Do I ask here? I'm building my compost bins, too.

You are actually in an old thread here. Back up to the list of threads that says SOIL, COMPOST AND MULCH at the top. Where it says "Example: I need help with my kitchen..." use that box for your thread title and enter your text in the box below.

It's so obvious it's easy to miss!