Old Macdonald, No, I didn't take offense, just thought you answered without reading my whole post. I stand corrected on the sheep/hay ratio. After thinking about it, I realized I should have written, 1 bale per 4 sheep, at least with my large animals, Cotswalds, they did eat a lot more than the smaller breeds. Everyone feeds differently, you have to determine, after a while, how much hay keeps your animals in prime condition.If your hay is good and high in quality, you will be able to get away with feeding less. If you have a bad year, you will have to feed more just to get the same amount of nutrition. Sheep will not eat hay that is hard stemmed. They will pull it out of the feeder and it lays on the ground and gets trampled. Thus the bedding result. If your hay is nice & green & tender, they will eat it all. But, I haven't had that many years where it was that good that it happened. So I just let the dropped hay, act as bedding. I still say, and I know how much I am feeding my horses, they eat at least 1/2 bale a day to 1 bale depending on the horse. I wish they ate less, believe me! And of course, who is going to cut 4 acres at one time? I think we were all assuming it would be cut as time permitted to get it in, not all at once. If you cut your hay and it is very humid, it will take longer to field dry, so its hard to predict what the weather will be like at any given time. Here, in the North east, 2-3 days of non-humid, maybe a little breeze, will certainly dry the hay sufficiently, as long as it doesn't rain. If the fire hazard was that high, we would all have had our barns burn down! I have had marginally dry bales put in due to pending inclement weather, held my breath, and the worse thing was I had several moldy bales. I keep a lookout for hot hay, if I suspect it was damp when baled. You can tell if things are heating up, by sticking you hand down into the hay. If it feels warm, too warm, stir it around to get the air to it. I'm still suggesting that loosly piled field dry hay, and using common sense, that you should not have a problem with it. If you find it is still damp when you go to put it in the barn, don't pile high, spread it around. To avoid this problem, don't cut more than you have space for in case it doesn't dry enough. Loosely piled hay, high high can you possible pile it, cannot compare to baled hay, stacked 10 bales high...and that is when your fire hazard is the most high. ok, I hope you take all the info that is posted here, and have a good time making your hay! You'll discover yourself how much to feed, after you get going. Good Luck. Marquisella

In many of the discussions here on mulching, especially when using straw or hay, there is always one or two who claim to have had a bad pest infestation because of it - usually it is slugs, snails, and flea beetles. But that isn't the commonly held belief. If you pull up those discussions and read through them you'll find that most feel the many benefits of proper mulching far outweigh any possible problems IF those problems arise. Personally I have used thick layers of old spoiled hay for many years with no increase at all in any pest problem. Slugs and snails, the most common mentioned problem, aren't nearly the problem for those of us in the hot south as it is for northern gardeners. What slugs and snails we may get are easily controlled and the benefits in moisture stabilization, weed control, and overall soil improvement more than outweigh any problems. Dave Here is a link that might be useful: Ruth Stout Mulching discussion

I have always been organic, ever since I was a kid and my grandma and grandpa showed me how to plant a few seeds way back in the early 60's. I ran across Ruth's book in 1978 and it revolutionized my gardening. No more turning the soil! I was already toying with "no till" methods but her simple solution is the ticket, and I've done it basically that way ever since. Hay is not the only thing that works, any sort of mulch will do. You can check with local tree services that have chipper trucks and they will often times drop a whole load (or part of one) off for you at no charge (saves them a fee at the dump). Get your wheel barrow and pitch fork ready and mulch like crazy. The main way I differ is instead of putting the mulch everywhere, I make beds that are mulched and run 2 drip lines over the top, down the length of the bed. (I use T-tape, and use the heaviest gauge) Each time I add mulch, I top dress then use an old hoe handle with just the hook (blade broke off) to lift the line back over the mulch. Beds should only be as wide as you can reach from both sides WITHOUT having to stretch to reach the middle. I lay my drip line over the mulch so that water runs down through it and gets more of the mulch wet. It works with it under though, as enough water still keeps the bottom of the mulch moist. I just like the mulch to break down a little faster so it's feeding the soil. I love Ruth's book, and have recommended it to many a fellow garden keeper. There are also several threads on this site about "lasagna" gardening which is basically the same thing by a more recent author. The term lasagna was one I came up with years ago, but I used the word to describe the way I make a compost pile, with layers, and then "cook" the pile. The author of Lasagna Gardening heard me use the phrase and asked if she could use it and I said sure, so Lasagna gardening was born. Another good book is by Max Alth, How to Farm Your Back Yard the Mulch Organic Way. BTW, I don't do that much compost piling, although it seems I always have a huge pile going somewhere on my 5 acres. Its to much work to move the material twice, plus turning. It's easier to just put it in place as mulch one time and be done with it. Let us know how your garden grows. Arthur

Greetings I am new to posting to this site although I have referred to it from time to time when I had a gardening question. I find that when several people corroborate each other on a subject it's usually the right answer. Very interesting. As to Ruth Stout, I read about her quite a while ago through Rodale, and I thought she made perfect sense. When I built my house here in Sacramento (shout out Carla) I started gardening in earnest. I started out using the Bio-intensive method because my ground had been scraped and compacted down to hard clay. I constucted a few beds with this method, but I always added mulch because I couldn't stand to see the bare soil getting baked. In bio-intensive the ground is supposed to be mulched just by the foliage of the plants close together. Problem is when they are small. Then a friend loaned me "Gaia's Garden" by Toby Hemmenway. I experimented with one bed using what he called his bomb proof sheet mulch bed. I was really blown away. I now have committed my whole garden to this method with some exceptions. It is the Ruth Stout method with a giant kick start. This web site details the process. http://www.patternliteracy.com/ I have added to the knowledge of this method by putting it to work on my 1/4 acres under Sacramento conditions. I generally do not need to water during the winter rainy season, but because we normally get no rain between May and November I add drip irrigation between the top two layers at about five inches apart. If I keep my top mulch at about 6-8 inches I only need to run the drip system every few days when it is 100 degrees F or over. otherwise much less often. This method requires a lot of collecting of materials but i get most for free. Sacramento is a tree mecca. Every late fall I go around in my van with large plastic bags which I use over and over again to collect the leaves which have fallen and people have been so nice as to have placed in nice piles. I stockpile the leaves because when it's done it's done. I don't have to go far from home to find plenty, much more than I can use. I like oak, elm, and just about any deciduous type. Avoid magnolia types. I avoid wood chips for the most part because they do take a long time to break down. I am able to find straw from ads on craigslist for free, and I have my own secret source for free spoiled straw and hay. Because I live in an urban area I use coffee grounds for my nitrogen source and it again is readily available from coffee shops for free. In fact you are keeping it out of the landfill. I supplement sometimes with oyster shell and greensand just to be sure I have enough P&K, but probably with the tree leaves I don't need it. Also I chop up my plants like tomato and everything not harvested and add that as well. I think that because P is supposed to help grow strong stems and stalks P must be in those stemmy parts. Incidentally when you remove your plants with this method you simply cut the plant off at the base level and allow the roots to rot underground. I never dig! Ruth would be proud. I did run into problems planting small starts so I got a few hundred clear plastic pint containers and cut the bottoms off. I clear some mulch aside insert the container and plant inside. When the plants are big enough I pull out the containers. I just keep reusing those containers. When I plant seeds like carrots I reduce the mulch layer down a lot and add it to another bed. When the carrots get big enough i start to add mulch back again. Slugs are an issue especially in a newly formed bed with things like lettuce and chard. I just deal with it by using sluggo and some hand picking at night with a headlamp and a bucket of soapy water. We have a lot of slugs here anyway. Pill bugs are shredders and they seem to go after the areas that the slugs have munched on, otherwise they are valuable for breaking stuff down. I think Ruth would approve because this method really gets thing off to a dynamic start. Afterwards you just do as Ruth does and just keep adding more mulch. I do continue to sprinkle coffee grounds with the other mulch materials. Normally I have to pull my irrigation lines up about two inches a year because so much new compost has formed. I do this when I am planting a new crop. The exceptions to the sheet mulch method is for potatoes and sun-chokes because you would have to dig up your bed to find them all. So for those I use a high-rise method in a wire composter. It works great. I guess that's it except that I wish I could have met Ruth Stout. She sounds like a fabulous person. Come on gardening in the nude! How great! I couldn't get away with that here.