Of the five you listed I like the Cub Z-44 and Simplicity Champion 2044. The Toro will do the job for you but I just think it's a lower line compared to the two beforementioned, but of course it cost less. From what I observed, the Champion 2044 has some commercial features such as wheel motors and pumps and appears well built and they advertise that it has a nice cut. I don't think you would be happy with the Javelin. I just haven't looked at the Cub, but I beleive it's made by MTD and I see a lot of not so favorable e-traffic about MTD made mowers. While you're looking around there are a bunch of other ZTR in the 4 to 5K range if you care to stretch your budget. Also, you should look at the Simplicity Champion 2050. It sells for $4,299 here. It it the same as the 2044 except the deck is 50 inches and the engine is a Briggs Vanguard, which has very good reviews by their owners.

Thanks for the info. How reliable are the Toro's and what issues are there with it being a "lower line"? I am trying to walk the line between buying too much tractor for my needs but also making sure I am going to have a reliable, long lasting tractor.

If you like the price of the Toro go to the dealer and try it out. Pick a couple different brands and try them out within a short time of each other. Look at and try the Toro Titan. Compare it to the Time Cutter Z5000 and you'll discover the differences.

New this year is the Deere z425. It lists for $3995 and it has
separate pumps and wheel motors just like all the commercial grade ztr's. You should consider it.

My son bought a Gravely 1740 for $3300 a few years ago,
so you might find a nice Gravely in your price range.

U might want to take a look at the Hustler Mini-Fastraks
also, think some of them may fall into Ur price range..
Paul R...

Thanks for all the posts. It sounds like there is quite a difference between the Toro Timecutters and the others. I will try them out though. Right now I am leaning towards the Simplicity Champion. Any thoughts on the Husqvarna? If the Gravely is in my price range would you recommend that over the other models?

I can't opine about the Husqvarna much because it is a new model and I haven't operated it yet. I don't like the plastic parts it has and it doesn't have wheel motors and pumps which I like and it has some so it's not for me. However, it's in your price range so try it out at the dealer. As for Gravely they make very good commercial machines. What model are you asking about? There is a one for around $5,300 that's an excellent choice for your needs but maybe out of your $ range. Is that the one?

You may also want to look at the New Simplicity Axion ZTR

I am going to look at the Gravely's tomorrow. From what I have been told, though, the Arien's are Gravely's residential models now. Based on the info above I think I am going to go for the Simplicity Champion but will check out the Gravely's first.
Thanks for all your help!!!

jmkrafczyk don;t be afraid to buy a toro i have a z4200 which has a 19hp kohler courage motor and have about 20 hours on it with no problems.I love it i know a guy that has one that has 900 hours on it and the only thing he had to change on it was the belt..not bad a .....so that;s why i bought one there very reliable...hope this helps

1*I need advice on a ZTR tractor.
2*I am hesitant to go with the Cub Cadet because I have not had good luck with MTD products.
Posted by jmkrafczy
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3*I see a lot of not so favorable e-traffic about MTD made mowers. Posted by glero
****************

1* A ZTR is not a tractor it's a lawn mower.
2*What MTD products have you had bad luck with?
3*What folks don't seem to Realize is MTD builds in 2 different
Quality levels But then so does John Deere.
What mystifies me is people assume all MTDs are junk but all JDs are top quality which is a very false and misleading assumption.
Something to keep in mind : An entry level cheapy is An entry level cheapy is An entry level cheapy no matter who built it.

I have owned the Z425 for a full season and it is more than fine. OK, it isn't a $5,000.00 mower, get over it. For the price, it is by far the most solid feeling mower over all that I looked at from Husky, Toro, LawnBoy, CubCadet ETC.

I selected the 48" model based on storing it in the garage, and maneuverability. The seating position and comfort are markedly better than the competition except maybe the Husky was equal. I also needed the bigger wheels for better traction on slopes. The V-twin is a nice addition for smooth power and longevity over the Z225 one-lunger.

The controls are superb, and smooth, with ample adjustments. The cut is fantastic and even. I only use the highest setting to let the grass have a chance to support the root system. Most people cut their grass way too short. But even with a maxed out cut setting, it is smooth and even.

Deere uses parker wheel motors that are very good, but uses the standard (or so it seems) Kanzaki hydrolic pump. But this is still on the commercial side of things for long life.

The engine? The ELS series engine is about $100.00 more than the Intek series when bought separate. I really don't think that the Intek will be an issue at all based on it's construction (oil filter and high pressure oil system). Throw some synthetic Mobile 1 in there after the first 50 hours to break the rings in and go. Could Deere have used the ELS? Yes, but they didn't. This isn't a deal breaker for me at all. The CubCadet has a Kawasaki, and it is not as nice to use. The controls are too loose and imprecise and the overall build is not as finished as the Z425 Deere. Is the CubCadet a "bad" mower? No, it just isn't as satisfying to use as the Deere, so the engine isn't all there is to it. Not to mention local Deere dealers to properly get parts or fix any nasty issues that might arise (machines do break eventually).

Oh, the 3.5 gallon tank? I can mow six acres on a tank (my 2 acre yard three times) before I run out of fuel. If you can stay on it long enough to run it dry, stopping for gas will be a relief.

My biggest nit is that the controls do not have a center point adjust and are slightly forward and back from one another in the straight ahead position at less than full speed, maybe an inch or so. I got over it and don't notice it much any more at all. So once you adjust the mower for even full speed tracking with the adjuster bolts, the less than full speed tracking is off some.

So, for the 3700.00 bucks, the Deere got my cash and I was glad to part with it.