Noella Nabonnand?

15 years ago

Hi all, I need urgent help for my Vintage order...

Background: I need probably 3 red climbers (not looking for monsters, just 10' or so climbers that will fill in) for around the front deck of our mountain retirement place (zone 8) we usually get several storms throughout the season usually less than a foot, but the last two seasons we've gotten a couple of 3-4' snows. Generally lows don't dip into the teens. The roses that I inherited do fantastically well in the decomposing granite as well as the ones that I've brought up from the coast that were mildew problems down here. I want a red that stays red, don't care so much about smell as I have plenty of others around the deck. I would like a true red as it will go behind a volunteer desert bird of paradise that amazingly does great on the mountain and has red & yellow flowers that usually go all spring summer. Leaves are ferny so it's sort of see-through.

In researching on this forum (and researching and researching...) I decided Ramblin' Red would be just the ticket, however bands won't be available until May (hopefully) from High Country. BUT, in noodling around Vintage I found Noella Nabonnand. This looks just as good to me. Anybody have experience with this one re: growth and color fade to pink???

Thanks guys!

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Comments (5)

lagomorphmom
Original Author
15 years ago
Forgot to mention, really important for blooms throughout the season, doesn't have to be loaded, scattered color here and there is just fine. Also, south facing location.
kathwhit
15 years ago
I think the climber Dublin Bay would fit your criteria. It is hardy to zone 6, blooms more or less continuously, has thick thorny canes, is a true red that doesn't blue or fade. I don't know if Vintage is offering it, but it is available grafted at lots of places or you can get it own root at Heirloom Roses. Mine has been on an arbor for 3 years and has reached 10 + feet. Not a problem for disease.
Kathy
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First of all, I don't know this rose. I have recently planted Papa-Gontier-the-shrub, still a baby. I know nothing whatsoever about the climber. But for what it is worth, and that means possibly not anything at all, I am moved to share my experience with 'Sombreuil', the climber that is sometimes called 'Colonial White'. I had it on an arbor for a number of years. For several years it had a few (3? 4?) very, very long canes, much like the ones you describe on Papa Gontier Climbing. The time came to re-stain the arbor with wood preservative, and we simply could not do it with this thorny creature in place. I cut it down to about 18 inches from the ground. I know, brutal. I did not know if the rose would survive or not. But to my happy astonishment, it exploded with a dozen new canes. It looked like an octopus! Far more robust than it had ever been before. Now I have no idea at all if Papa Gontier Climbing would do the same with this treatment, or shrivel up and die, or continue on as usual. I only offer it as an example of blind luck. (So of course the very next year I took Sombreuil out and replaced it with a grapevine. It is a very nice grapevine with very delicious grapes. Yum.) Folly
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Thank you all: I appreciate your favorable comments. Cath, it's good to hear from you. I was thinking about you the other day. Virginia, I hope you continue to make good progress. DH is recovering from surgery and thought he could get out the other day and cut some grass with the motor scythe: he found out his mistake, I hope with no long lasting damage. Our first day of "rain" bestowed upon us approximately 1 millimeter of water. Oh, pooh. All we can do is hope for better today. The weather since last summer doesn't favor optimism, though. I'm all for climbers, work though they are. Just think, additional gardening room, in the air! I have this ambition for spaces walled and roofed with climbers. Henry Mitchell wrote that he had an impression that gardeners are afraid of height. I don't know whether they're afraid of it, or whether it just doesn't occur to them. I've also found that one needs to scale up one's ideas, and think of big plants. You get very wealthy, in flowers, if you do. Oh, "Miss Mystery". It was my horticulturalist sister who suggested she might be a Gigantea, and I thought the idea worth considering. Currently, while MM's official name is still unknown, I have a plan for dealing with her, leaving her as a shrub. I'm arriving at the idea that many Teas, grown in favorable conditions, can make climbers if they have support.
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Cat on your lap definitely takes priority, maybe you've never had a cat, Jin? (LOL!) Anyway, I'd love to see photos, too,and can't criticize Melissa because I don't "do" photos either. I have 2 own-root Noellas. The older one has only one cane, and has never put out basals, and is in fact hardly growing,but it's in a bad spot and didn't get off to a good start in the first place. I just put out a new Noella,that looks very vigorous and good, but still has only one cane; I hope that changes, because I agree that it makes you worry about the plant's potential longevity. On the other hand, my old Souv. de Mme. Leonie Viennots both are huge, but with very few basals. Also I think I remember reading a post from Christopher (Aqua Eyes) where he mentions a few of his roses that just have that growth habit, and it's no big deal. But this does remind me to put yet another item on my "to do" list-put alfalfa hay on my Noellas. There are a lot of sun-burn issues in my garden as well; I think this contributed to killing off my second Annie Laurie Mc Dowell; the first was too small when I planted it out and died ,but this one was much bigger, and had been grown in a pot for a year before. So now I've got this 3rd Annie,and I think it's been in it's pot for about three seasons. I just re-potted it, and it looks like it'll stay in the pot for another year.This rose is reportedly vigorous, but it sure is taking it's time ...
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Our G. Nabonnand was almost lost to extreme heat and damaged watering system, but he has staged a magnificent comeback -- Not only disease-free, but a generous bloomer, and a handsome plant. Oh, yeah ... just gorgeous. And I love the way the blooms change color with changes in weather. As for Marie . . . You might try Greenmantle . . . They're the only listed U.S. Source. https://www.helpmefind.com/gardening/l.php?l=17.3004 I am ashamed to say that I don't remember where I finally found her.
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jerijen
15 years ago
Hardiness doesn't matter in your climate.
Resistance to powdery mildew and rust matter A LOT.

I have not grown Dublin Bay, so I can't comment on its disease-resistance.

I do not grow Noella Nabonnand -- but I WANT IT REAL BAD!
I fell in love with it at first glance, and right now it is one of the few roses
that I do not have, and want badly.

The Nabonnand roses in general are superb for Southern California gardens,
and they are for the most part disease-free here, once mature.
Tea Roses in general are good prospects for Southern California gardens,
as they are undemanding.
Once mature, they're pretty drought-tolerant, which is of increasing importance to us.

Jeri
lagomorphmom
Original Author
15 years ago
Thanks Kathy, DB was my top consideration until I saw the the discussion on Ramblin' Red. I was put off by the thorny comments that I read as this is my first climber 'project'. It would be fun to grow all three side by side, eh?

Jeri, I knew I could count on you! Want me to order an extra?

You're right about the PM & Rust, I'm down by LAX and a bit inland - I call it the PM Hellmouth (for all you scary movie fans). I've bought a number of non-toxic things to use to spray including the garlic spray which worked pretty good, but the bottom line is that I'm "no spray" because I'm just too busy and by the time 'tomorrow' comes around they look like heck. Plus I don't have much room either so now in the small pot area I'm simply sticking with more resistant florabundas, own-root preferred as I think they work better in the pots.

At the mountain place, it's a lot more fun because the humidity is usually teens or a bit higher so almost no fungus. Even the Cotillion that got 'sent away' only gets a bit of rust up there. If it doesn't do well up there, out it goes, like my neighbor says, "we're not getting any younger so we better have what we enjoy around us".

Keep the comments coming if you have Noella!
jerijen
15 years ago
Jeri, I knew I could count on you! Want me to order an extra?

*** Get the behind me, Satan. --G--
I'm NOT buying anything more at this point. Eventually ...

You're right about the PM & Rust, I'm down by LAX and a bit inland - I call it the PM Hellmouth (for all you scary movie fans).

*** Your conditions are probably a good parallel to mine.
Like you, I decided some time ago that roses which need all sorts of spraying and pampering just don't fit my lifestyle.

Jeri

Noella Nabonnand?

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lagomorphmom
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Noella Nabonnand?

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