Veteran's Honor - Rosemania, bareroot

Don't know where you can find these roses ownroot but do you really want them ownroot for z4? Several years ago I purchased 2 Veterans' Honor from J&P--one was ownroot & other was grafted. The ownroot never thrived & I shovel pruned it. The grafted VH is much larger & produced lots more flowers. I have tried several other ownroot HT's but none have done well for me in z4. I can get them thru my winters ok but z4 summers are just to short combined with HT's less vigorous roots to get them to grow to any significant size. I & several rose growing friends in my z4 area have developed an afinity for HT's by Kordes of Germany because they seem to survive & thrive better in our z4 area---check out Palatines & Pickering as they carry a lot of these roses (both use Multiflora rootstock which does better in z4 & our acid soils).

If you're in a hurry for mature rose bushes own root roses are not for you. It seems to take longer for them to mature but once they do, I find they produce as well as grafted roses. At least that's my experience in my garden. For hardiness and those less inclined to spend lots of time providing winter protection, own root roses are the way to go.
Burying the bud union produces an own root bush within a year of planting. You get the boost from the rootstock the first year and hardiness benefits of own root after that.

No one has yet answered your question. The simple fact is that the varieties you're searching for are NOT available as own-root plants. 'Veterans Honor' apparently once was offered by J&P as one of its "New Generation" (ie, own-root) plants, but is now available only as a grafted plant. The varieties you're interested in are fairly recent introductions that remain under patent (and will be for years to come). You'll find that the great majority of modern roses that are offered by vendors specializing in own-roots are either varieties that have been around for many years, or varieties that were never patented.

Great info, folks!

I actually started out with a dozen or so own-roots from Roses Unlimited this year--Mr. Lincoln, Teasing Georgia, Double Delight, William Shakespeare 2000, Crown Princess Margarite. And about 6 own-roots from J&P--Aromatherapy, Pope John Paul II.

The Roses Unlimited own-roots grew like gangbusters. At the end of the season, Teasing Georgia and Crown Princess were both over 6' tall and well branched. Double Delight was 4' tall and full. Mr. Lincoln didn't have too many canes, but they were all 3-5' tall. The only one that stayed small was William Shakespeare. It ended the season at about 2-3' tall.

In contrast, the own-roots from J&P did not do nearly as well. 2/3 of them died, and the replacements languished. A couple of them did get to 5' tall, but most of them stayed around 2' and didn't even bloom till close to frost.

We practice organic gardening exclusively and I never sprayed. None of the roses got any disease until October, and then only a tad of mildew that I washed off successfully with water.

However, I have wondered about the difference in performance b/t these two sets of own-roots. If I had only grown the J&P own-roots, I would have come to the conclusion that own-roots lack vigor too. I've grown J&P grafted before and they definitely perform better.

But the Roses Unlimited own-roots performed beautifully, so what was different? I've narrowed it down to two probable causes:

J&P came bareroot and Roses Unlimited came in soil. The J&P own-roots were actually bigger by probably at least a year's growth. But they didn't do nearly as well as the small own-roots that came in pots from RU. The RU roses didn't experience any transplant shock, unlike the J&P roses, which didn't leaf out for months after planting.

In addition, I arranged for the RU roses to arrive by the first of April so I could plant them early. The J&P folks wouldn't ship until May for my zone, so their roses went in a month later.

Other than that, both sets were heavily mulched and grown organically in identical soil conditions. They were even watered at the same time.

Too bad the patented roses are not yet available own-root. Thanks for reading.

Sounds like your roses would really benefit from a jump start in a greenhouse each Spring to get the roots going--but this isn't practical for most of us.

What was different between your J&P own-roots and the ones from RU? Perhaps the primary difference is that the J&P own-roots were DORMANT -- own-root bareroots that had spent who knows how long in cold storage. If my experience with J&P's "New Generation" modern roses is typical, then their experiment with marketing modern own-roots was a failure. I've no idea why that should be the case, but (again, in my experience) that definitely has been the reality. Like you, I've had much better experience with modern own-roots from RU. However, I've found that it's the rare HT that performs as well on its own roots as it does grafted.

I'm waiting to hear from those who grow 'PJP II' on Fortuniana how that rose performs as a grafted plant. It's truly unfortunate that a rose with that much potential has been saddled with J&P's insistence on offering only as as own-root plant. Have to give them credit, though, for moving 'Sedona' (another fine rose that languished on its own roots) from New Generation to grafted.

I'd think it's more likely your J&P own root bare roots dried out too far in storage. Without the artificial vigor of a root stock under them, many just don't have the push required, and if dehydrated sufficiently, may not recover. Though many roses will grow own root, not all are as successful at it as root performance is as variable a genetic characteristic as color, disease resistance, eventual size, pruning tolerance, cold hardiness, etc.

The RU plants never dried out as they were kept continuously growing in the nursery instead of being harvested and then stored on refrigeration. RU is also a successful, continuing business instead of a new group of people running a troubled old name, and from appearances, not very well.

I've ordered very nice own root roses from Heirloom Roses, Rogue Valley Roses and Northland Rosarium. Northland Rosarium's roses have grown the most in one season, but I've had the Heirloom Roses two years...and they've done very well through the winter...I'll know more about the others, next spring :)

I think RU lets their rose babies mature far longer before putting them up for sale; hence the bigger, mmore robust plants. I know that is true relative to Heirloom roses, and I suspect it is also true for J&P New Generation roses. Own-roots I've purchased from J&P and from Heirloom have all grown fine for me....eventually. But it takes an extra half-year to year for them to start growing anywhere near the way the RU roses do as soon as I get them.

Makes sense, too, what was said about possible drying out in cold storage. I don't know.

I love RU. Only problem is sometimes the specific roses I "have to have" aren't available through them.

Where to buy?

I bought Tahitian Sunset last fall from Heirloom Roses; it's still quite small. But I have high hopes for that rose.

Seems like for a very cold climate, you would do well to buy well-developed ownroot roses, such as fromRU or Northland Rosarium, OR buy 2 year old grafted roses and plant them with the bud union several inches below the soil line. Then the roots are there to help them grow bug the first season and up their chances of surviving the winter. Then eventually they may root themselves from the canes that are partially buried.

this is something that i look forward to.. thanks for the info..

Thanks for suggesting Northland Rosarium. I didn't know they existed. Are they bands or gallon plants? How do their plant sizes compare to Heirloom's and RU?

I have an own root Veteran's Honor that is doing famously well but I am in the deep south. I know it is an own root as it arrived in a 4 inch pot and was listed as own root. I have had it one full season and half of another. It was over 6 foot tall this year and the roses were huge, lasting forever.