So this is totally off the top of my head and I have no idea if it would work, so if someone feels I'm suggesting sure death for the vandas please say so. It sounds like you have an algae buildup. My fiance's step-mother uses an algae remover powder on her pond. It doesn't hurt the fish or water lilies/other plants, but it dissolves the algae on contact. I wonder if you could make up a small amount of this mixture and swirl it around the bottom of the vase, in theory the algae should come right off. I just don't know how vandas would react to the stuff.
~Jem

Hello Jem, Thank you for your quick reply. We do have an algae remover for our pond. I never thought of that but I'm so scared I might kill my plants. If anyone has first hand experience perhaps they could advise or perhaps I could contact the company who makes it?
Thanks Hazel

Hello Hazel, how are you doing? Is it raining with you, it is here?
Just a thought that sprang to mind on reading your post. Could you get a length of clear plastic hose down through the roots and onto the base of the vase? If so, it may just be possible to dislogde the algae build up and using the tube as a syphon, draw the stuff off and away? Would it 'swirl' off the base of the glass to detach it? Wilko sell cheap thin pliable hose in the pet section, got some myself a few weeks ago for the syphon I use in my tropical fistank. It may work. I too would be rather tentative about using the chemical algae basher as I've not used them on our pond/aquarium personally. The dilution would have to be so VERY precise for the orchids.
I hope to post some pics of my orchids soon as I have several in spike...the Xmas Phal is STILL in flower!! I am amazed at it.
I constantly find I'm making a beeline for the flower secion in every store we visit just to see what they have as many of my plants are rescues and therefore bargains. B&Q's huge store have not had any indoor plants for several weeks now, but have heard they are back again, so I may have to pay a visit soon when we can get that way.
Was there a name on the purchase you made at Sainsburys recently, that was a lovely Phal you dropped on?

Regards as always, Gill.
PS It's gone rather chilly and wet again here in the UK hasn't it and things are winding down.

Hello Gill, How nice to hear from you. I have tried to put just a little water in the vase and swirl it around whilst holding onto the plant but some of the skin parts get tangled in the roots so I could really do with something to dissolve it.
There wasn't a name to my new phalie but what's in a name if it's beautiful?!!!!
Yes it has turned colder not that it's been much of a summer anyway. My plumerias have been in the house now for nearly a month and my wrongly named one is still flowering it's head off. The others are thriving and I've also rooted two more cuttings. I haven't posted on the plumeria forum for some time.
Hope your grandson is thriving.
Kind regards Hazel.

People that keep aquariums use magnets. Very powerful magnets. One goes inside and has a scrub surface, the other stays outside and maneuvers the one that is inside. They come in various sizes. It sounds like you will need the smallest one you can find.

H

Hello Howard, Thank you for your advice. I think I will have to try to buy those as I have just had a reply from Algon the company which sells the algae remover product and they state it will definately kill the orchids.
Where do you think I would be able to buy those sort of magnets as I have not heard of them before?
Thanks Hazel.

Hazel, you can get the double magnets over here. Is there a specialist aquarium/tropical fish shop in your area, I would be surprised if not. I have not used them personally in my tank, but a rellie does use them in his and they are quite effictive in algae removal. I had forgotten about them but they sound worth a try and wouldn't harm the orchids. good luck.
Gill.

I'd think if you could reach the bottom well enough to place the "interior" magnet in a suitable position you'd be able to reach in far enough to wipe out the deposit or whatever it is by hand, no?

It's not clear to me why you're so intent on removing the deposit at the bottom of the vase - is it growing on the roots or causing apparent problems? If it's just an esthetic issue, I'd think you'd do better to just leave well enough alone since the plants sound like they're growing well as it is.

Hello Gill, Yes there are several tropical fish shops (without the chips!)in this area but I would have to get a very small one to get past the root systems which fill the vases.
Hello Orchidsnye as I'm so new to these vandas I didn't know if the deposits are harmful to the roots and could cause rot,but if the algae could be beneficial I would forgo getting rid of it. I also had another thought that if I used a very thin bottle cleaning brush I could maybe use that.
Thank you all for your help.
Hazel.

Without a photo it's hard to say but it sounds like it could just be a thin layer of miscellaneous "gunk" that'll settle to the bottom of most any container of water. Once upon a time I heard a former forum participant suggest blue-green algae might somehow be beneficial around orchid roots but when I asked the guy about it a couple of years later, he seemed a little surprised I'd remembered it and professed to have no recollection of making the comment in the first place (or maybe he was repeating something he'd heard elsewhere without knowing why - any even the disavowed any knowledge/responsibility for it [lol]) so I'm not sure I'd go with that theory. ;) IMX, plain old algae doesn't hurt roots in pots unless it really starts to take over and then it's more a mechanical issue than anything else - it can interfere with watering and if it goes bone dry, it's even hard to re-hydrate than bone-dry bark - never a good thing.

Hello Orchidsnyc, I have tried to take a close up of some of the vases and you may be able to see the brown deposit. I have managed to wash some away but would like to get rid of more if possible. I don't think I could get a magnet into the vases so I have bought a long thin bottle cleaning brush.
Hope the picture comes through as we had bright sun today for a change!
Hazel.
{{gwi:142055}}

Hello again Hazel, yes I can see it clearly too and I agree it does spoil the look of them doesn't it? The roots are stuck to the vases then? Can see why you can't get anything down in there as they have a formidable root system. I don't know anything about vandas really but have read more since hearing about your problem. I'm still learning about the 2 Phals and 2 Cambrias that I have, so I'm a real newcomer to orchids in general. That flower is stunning, do they last long?
Gill.

How about small gravel chips that could be swished around to dislodge the deposit whilst carefully holding the plant in situ? They could be used either dry or in water if that fails, and all could be washed out afterwards. We will (dis)solve your problem somehow!!
Gill.

Be careful with the brush - maybe natural/paint brush texture nylon/etc bristles would be soft enough but I think a "bottle brush" would probably scratch the roots and while they may be adapted to water as they are, I suspect scratching them up would invite all kinds of pathogens to settle in and cause serious problems...

fwiw, from what I can see on my monitor, that doesn't look like algae so I wouldn't worry too much about it "growing"; you could try wrapping something decorative around the vases so you don't have to look at the gunk, maybe?

Maybe you could just cover the bottom of the vase to cut out all the light for a period of time?

No light = no algae.

Another option, although I know it is difficult ... can you drill a hole into the base of the vase ... large enough to allow gunk to be flushed out with fresh water and then re-seal the vase? Or perhaps pre-drill a vase and have that set up and just sacrifice the old vase and re-plant in a vase with a drain.

Your orchids are beautiful, BTW! :-)

C3D

Hello C3D, Thank you also for your advice but I have now cured the problem (see my new thread re New problem cures old). I had been afraid to remove the vandas as I had wrongly thought they were stuck to the glass which they had indeed begun to do so but I was so horrified at the black bugs I thought removing and cleaning the plants was the lesser of maybe two evils. Now the vases sparkle and I won't be afraid of removing the plants from time to time and inspect and clean everything. I'm afraid being new to them I was too timid but I won't be again.
Thank you all for your help.Now I would like to know what miniscule pure black bugs might be that enjoy damp roots???
Thanks Hazel.

Hi Hazel.

Sorry but I don't know what the black bugs might be. Some kind of scale perhaps? Could you post a photo or describe them a bit more please?

How did you place your Vanda in the vases? Did you gradually increase the humidity ... moisture ... acclimate them somehow to a life in water or did you just place them in a vase with water and let them do their thing? How often do you change their water? How often do you feed?

Are other orchid species adaptable to such "potting" ?

I *really* love the water vase idea! Thanks for your help! :-)

Hello Chickadeedeedee, Firstly let me relate my first vanda orchid which is the blue one. I bought it already in a vase and in spike from a nursery. I googled how to grow them and found that during summer(if you get one ha! ha!) you can water up to the little black orchid pot,leave for half an hour for twice a week then drain away. They must get very good light and heat so I placed it on my south facing window sill as I can't heat my greenhouse to sufficient air temperature during autumn and winter. I also spray the roots every day as indoor growing is not that ideal. My other vandas I bought from orchid sellers on e-bay and bought some heavy glass vases very cheaply from Marks & Spencers and just lowered them until the black pots lodged neatly. Some roots hung down and some were above the rim.You don't leave them permanantly in the water or they would rot,only give them a drink and spray. I think I needn't water so often in the winter. It's all very neat now I know I can remove the plants to clean up.
The bugs are not scale at first I thought they were tiny pieces of black grit smaller than a pin head,no wings,but then I saw some crawling along one of the roots of the blue one. I just flipped as I have never seen such a bug and there were 20 -30 of them. I must keep checking in case any eggs hatch out. They definately don't mind the dampness and fortunately are not on the other vandas.
Hazel.

Hi again Hazel.

Thanks for taking the time to answer all my questions. I *thought* they were in the water vase permanemtly and thought that was a great adaptation you had achieved. Still ... a lovely way to showcase them.

I was thinking of doing the same with my Vanda: {{gwi:194728}}

Maybe you have aphids? Are they little round-ish squishy insects?

C3D

hello, Hazel and D3D, your blue vandas are beautiful. i think blue is definitely my favourite flower colour, next to green.
sue

Hello Sue, Yes I think blue maybe my favourite colour too although the others I bought are all different.
Hello C3D again, your plant is lovely and although I'm very ignorant of these plants it looks an ideal candidate for a vase! Better than a bunch of flowers!
No the bugs don't look like aphids but more like tiny black seeds,I didn't realise they were bugs until a few bagan to move. Nothing I've googled in images looks anything like them. The annoying thing is they were on my expensive £40 nursery bought plant that had been imported from Holland yet the ones from e-bay (much cheaper) are lovely. There's a lesson there.
Hazel.

Hazel, I wonder if the bugs you had were black aphids. google images "black aphids" and you will see lots of pictures of them. Hope they are all gone. I wanted to say that you have done a very fine job in growing them in the vases. it did not work for me; on retrospect, I think it is because I don't have a window with as much sun as you have to put them. good luck.
sue

Hello Sue, I am going to re-name you littlegem. Thank you! I am almost sure that they are black aphids after saying I didn't think they were especially as any aphids I'd seen were always greenish. I had been googling black bugs. I do hope with more careful cleaning I won't get the problem again.
Thank you all for your advice it seems my other thread isn't needed.
Hazel.

hello, Hazel, you're welcome.
sue