Annmarie: When thinning stone fruits like peaches and nectarines, you don't just remove some of the fruit. A normal tree will set way more fruit than it can carry, so you remove most of the fruit. Peaches are best thinned to 8-10 inches apart; the smaller nectarines should be a minimum of 6 inches apart, and on small, weak twigs, even more than that. Not only will this allow the nectarines to grow up and hold to the tree until ripe, it will also protect the tree from branch breakage that can easily occur on an overloaded tree. You should state your location when asking a question of this nature. If you live in California or a similar climate, nectarines may be easy for you, but if you are in the east or midwest nectarines may be extremely difficult to grow because of insect and fungal problems. You may not receive the best advice if people don't know where you are. Don Yellman, Great Falls, VA

Applenut, Actually, when I was buying the Arctic Star, it was a toss up between the Arctic Star and the Snow Queen. My friend at the nursery had a Dave Wilson Nursery brochure and the Arctic Star had all the qualities I was looking for. It is growing like weed and it did have fruit in early June and did not keep well either. The fruit were beautiful, very red and unblemished. Surprisingly, the birds did not try to eat them. My dog did try to take them to eat and play with so we had to put a fence around it. Can you tell me if the Snow Queen was good eaten while still hard? The Arctic Star was better really ripe in my opinion. I seem to enjoy my Peaches and Nectarines crunchy. This is actually one of the reasons I am looking for another nectarine. Thanks again for taking the time to anwer my ten thousand ?'s. Nancy

rodycca, you're probably right. We have had some unusual temp swings this summer, usually it's just pretty evenly hot all summer. And I have noticed trees in other locations with quite a bit of drop and I just wrote it off to the people not picking their fruit, but it's probably the same phenomena as I have had. I'll just wait for next year and cry tears over my fallen peaches! The few I got were soooo good! Fruitnut, I'm sorry you didn't care for the Elberta, but I also have an O'henry in another planting and you're right, it is very gooood! Elaine

Fruitnut tipped me off to your post. You do not say where in Arizona you are so I will keep my comments general. I am only in the beginning of my third year in BYOC. I have well over 200 fruit and nut trees planted in a half acre that includes a 2,200sq ft. home in a flood irrigated lot. Planting trees together in a hole works well as far as growth goes. It is still too early to say about fruit production as only a dozen or so trees (mostly peach/nectarine) set fruit their second season and I stripped all of those off as soon as I spotted them as the trees are too young to be fruiting. Have the people who are dissing BYOC tried it?---I bet not. They simply go with the claim that trees must be planted 10 or more feet apart, blah, blah, blah. Nothing like 800+ peaches on a tree that you have to get eaten/processed/given away within 10 days period before it rots! High density planting works in Phoenix. Greg Peterson at Urban Farm has over 80 fruit trees on his 1/3 acre (with 1,750 sq ft home) most planted three feet apart along boundary lines. But I do not think he has any multiples to a hole. If you are in the Phoenix area you can ask him tomorrow (Wednesday). Be warned, he is whom got me started---I only attended a class of his 3 years ago to plant maybe 2-4 trees, and look at me now. http://www.urbanfarm.org/ http://www.phoenixpermaculture.org/events/fruit-trees-with-greg-peterson-9 Basically the limits IMHO are soil (usually not as bad as people always claim, the summer, if you go with tropicals the winter depending upon the temps it gets at your place, your current resources, your planned resources, how you lay things out, the varieties (cultivars) and species you chose and the rootstocks you get them upon and finally your practices. The results are dependent upon proper pruning and a reasonable amount of observation and care (fertilizing and pesticide). In addition to the two links above, the other resources are Googling both your County Cooperative Extension and Master Gardeners. The Arizona Rare Fruit Growers as well if in Phoenix area. And I rather like local nurseries as well for answering pest, and other questions appropriate to your area. edit: I suppose I should make it clear almost all of my fruit trees are planted 4 to a hole, 18" apart and 7' between holes. My target height is 8'. I keep rootstocks and species the same in a hole if I can, but not seems to work too. You can plant trees within 6" of one another effectively growing them into a single trunk down the line, and straight up or slightly angled out from one another. Tom Spellman prefers 3' apart for easier pruning. I cluster cross pollinating close to make it easy on the insects. If you live in the zone 9b and 10 areas, and possibly the 9a areas, there is no summer pruning. Once it hits above 85F the trees stop growing so there is no need to prune in the summer. You prune just before summer to let some air and light into the canopy by keep in mind shading the trunk is numero uno. Paint trees white with water based latex (50% diluted works too) to protect from sunburn. Heavy organic mulch at least 4" to protect roots from temps and desiccation and improve soil life and fertility---I use predominately wood chips. I have not had a great deal of success with nut trees. I have pecans for a primary canopy and almonds for a western shade on the house. Remember self fruitful is great but across pollinator usually produces more and larger fruit. In some cases more seeds. If you live in zone 8/9/10 Arizona you can grow darned near anything except some berries without too much fuss. The sky is the limit. And with proper selection you can have both year round gardening and fresh fruit. Here is another BY orchard class on the 26th in the Phoenix area, by one of the most ingenious people I have met: http://www.meetup.com/GardenPool-org/events/141868522/ Here is a link that might be useful: You might want to start reading here This post was edited by Fascist_Nation on Tue, Oct 15, 13 at 15:27