What's in it for Jill Stein? Maybe she just misses the spotlight of the Presidential Race? I've stayed away from these political rants as long as I can. My tongue hurts :-)

Looks like the recount is happening! I hope you Hillary supporters can finally let it freaking go.

How did the Clintons enrich themselves personally with the foundation? They don't take any salary. All their income comes from speaking fees and book royalties.

OK, maybe they enriched their FOUNDATION, because it's so dear to their heart. But HRC didn't have direct, personal sign-off on arms deals with no input from anyone else in government.

I do think the Clintons made mistakes in prevarication, etc. They should have taken a page from The Donald's book, and just flat-out denied everything and threatened to sue everybody for slander and libel. It worked for him--and his sins were as bad or worse!

PKponder TX, the biggest reason HRC supporters have trouble letting it go is because of the very big disparity between the popular vote and the electoral college.


I wasn't a W. fan. But I didn't feel the way I do about The Donald. Trump's -only- interest is attention. W/ every not-my-candidate winner in the past, I have genuinely believed that the president-elect truly wanted to do a good job for our country and was intelligent enough to give it a really good shot.
I don't feel that way about this guy.

Donald Trump isn't a career politician. Maybe America is that ready for a change that they (and I) decided that voting for someone as outrageous as Trump was preferable to more of the same old thing over and over. I won't beat a dead horse but I do not trust Hillary as far as I can throw her. At least you know what is on Trump's mind, he has no filters. I truly hope that he can make the changes that he proposes. We need to get back to what America stands for. I want to be proud of my country again.

At least you know what is on Trump's mind ... but not what's on his income tax returns.

According to FoxNews, the Michigan recount will cost taxpayers upwards of $12 million. I've read that a recount must be funded by the candidate requesting the recount, which is why Jill Stein has raised several million dollars (the last I recall reading was over 5 million), and I'd read a projected budget of 7.5 million for the three states in question. I'd check sources other than Fox News.

ETA CBSNews recount update yesterday.

. . . voting for someone as outrageous as Trump . . .

"Outrageous" was a good choice of words. Standard definitions include "grossly offensive to the sense of right or decency," "having no regard for morality," and "shockingly bad or excessive," among others.

Michigan lawsuit has been filed by the Attorney General.

http://www.clickondetroit.com/news/ag-schuette-files-lawuit-to-stop-recount-of-michigans-presidential-election-results

Fox News lies.

just listen to them.

once they (the five that talk over each other) were bragging that they

were all millionaires.

I'm pretty sure THEY "are" all millionaires. That's not such a stretch to believe. I don't hate rich people. Do you? (That's a whole nuther topic right there)

I am unhappy with the state of all the news networks and their tabloid style reporting. It is as though all they want is the most salacious headlines and the biggest ratings. It is hard to find news that is "just the facts". Does that even exist anymore? Or is it all opinions and panel discussions? :-(

I chose the online article I linked above because it lists facts and sources, and doesn't seem to present an opinion, but I know you are speaking of news in general.

It's so nice to see you post, Talley Sue, if you're the same person I'm thinking of! Very well put. I'm so sick with worry over this election that I have a tough time watching/reading the news at this time. Being that Trump is allllll about BIG (not small) business, I just don't know what middle-class people see in this man who will do anything to further his riches and has no problem standing on the backs of the rest of us, i.e. not paying his taxes. The good ol' days to which he refers is one where white men are in charge and society is even more stratified, financially, than it is now. What is there to like unless you're a rich, white man? There is not a single thing I've seen he's done that shows he cares one iota about anyone else who is not a friend or family member. Talk about polar-opposite of the Obamas.

sjerin, I just used the term polar opposite on a thread about food. ;)

As I mentioned upthread, I'm not an extreme supporter for either side. I think I'd call myself a liberal conservative--more liberal in thought, but more conservative in actions. I consider myself a political lightweight--I rarely even discuss politics. I choose according to how I feel about the candidate, not the party, and I am bewildered about the results of this election. I'm not saying what I really think of either candidate, because I don't want to be tossed from the site. They both have shortcomings, and I'm sure we don't know every underhanded, backroom deal either one has made, but I just can't imagine the future with Donald Trump as president. Giving them a level playing field based on mutual dishonesty, I still can't believe that he can represent our people, and our country, with dignity.

"All I know is that America is the only country in the world where people
risk their lives, every day, in leaky boats to get to the freedom of
our shores."

Elizabeth, there is significantly more "traffic" of desperate refugees in overloaded leaky boats in the Mediterranean than in the Caribbean and it's been going on for decades there too. It's people fleeing poverty and violence in Africa and the Middle East, hoping to land in a European Union country to have a better life.

Americans have been able to travel to Cuba for some time. I know many people who went during the "embargo" days by way of Mexico City, and not just in the past few years. Cuba never stamped passports for arriving Americans because they knew it could lead to problems and they wanted to encourage tourism in any form. On the US side, the prohibition was never enthusiastically enforced.

'"Outrageous" was a good choice of words. Standard definitions include
"grossly offensive to the sense of right or decency," "having no regard
for morality," and "shockingly bad or excessive," among others.'

Describes the Clintons to a tee.

It's convenient that both the Clintons and Trump have charitable foundations. Were can we see the comparison of charitable works accomplished by each one?

Many wealthy people, just like large companies, have foundations for PR purposes, to deflect criticism of too much self-interested activity. Some do worthwhile things, many don't. There are others, and I'm thinking of the likes of Gates, Rockefeller, Carnegie, Packard, etc., that have and will continue to do serious work without any intended light shining on their named founders. The Clinton Foundation is not in that class at all.

Clinton's started to raise money for his presidential library. It was so successful in shaking down contributors that once that job was done, it morphed into something different and what it is now. Many contributions have been received from less than upstanding sources. Contributions to the Clinton Foundation from some foreign governments (including unsavory Middle Eastern ones) continued while Hillary was Secretary of State. That bothers me, how about you? During her presidential candidacy, more than half of the large contributors to her campaign also gave to the Foundation. That bothers me, how about you?

What Trump does or doesn't do, with or without his foundation, isn't going to change what anyone thinks of him. And it shouldn't. Trump is what and how he appears to be, there's little doubt. The same is true in all the same respects for the Clintons.

Honestly, chisue, it's a wonder to me how many people turn a blind eye to the long history of transgressions and distasteful acts of the Clintons. And choose to give them a pass. I don't and in that regard, I'm not alone.

And yet you give that buffoon Trump a pass. Six bankruptcies, 12 charges of sexual assault, one charge of child rape (which was dropped after life threats and a payment from Trump), non-payments to contractors who worked for him. a fraudulent university where he settled for 25 million, married to three wives, two immigrants, one an illegal who posed in many nude lesbian photos. Yeah, a lovely guy.

Aw, c'mon, Elmer. Tell us what you really think. :) You're usually careful about keeping your opinions out of dicey discussions, but it appears you've bought into the anti-Hillary propaganda. So far, I have not heard anything to make me look down on her. I find her an admirable person.

I don't spend time reading or listening to propaganda of any kind. At least, not knowingly.

I had always found Mrs. Clinton to be a gracious, admirable person, also....I do have a hard time believing anything that Mr. Trump has to say but, I might not respect him as a man, but I do respect the office of the president and I do wish, anyone sitting in that office, much success....

One that does bother me, is all the nasty stuff that is being said about Mrs. Clinton...If, indeed the election is over, let it go...Why keep hitting someone when they're down.......

Again, it's been a propaganda effort by the right-wing for years now. She's tough to have withstood all the lies and innuendo.

I forgot another little tidbit about our "beloved" Agent Orange. He said to Howard Stern that 'because he owns the Miss Universe pageant, he and he alone is allowed to wander in their dressing room to enquire if everything is all right. They are sometimes nude, partially undressed, and they have such beautiful bodies. That's one of the perks'. Such a sterling character befitting a president...(SARCASM). And then there're Hillary's emails hacked by the Russians who put Trump in power.

By the way, his lead in PA has been cut in half before the recount proving what he said before the election that it was rigged. .

"Again, it's been a propaganda effort by the right-wing for years now. She's tough to have withstood all the lies and innuendo."

I twice voted for Jerry Brown for Governor, would do so again. I don't always agree with him but he's lived a life of uncompromised integrity and dignity. I voted for Obama twice, same thing, same feelings about him. I had higher expectations for what he might have accomplished but I respect him as a person and think he tried to do his best for the American people.

The Clintons are serial liars and self-promoters who've gotten caught with their self-justified sleazy capers again and again. There's no innuendo, no propaganda, unless you consider truth and other facts you don't want to hear to be propaganda.

The Clinton foundation has all but wiped out Aids in parts of the world. The Trump foundation buys $10,000 portraits of him.

The Clintons are serial liars????. OMG!! There are videos AND audios of Trump lying and backtracking everything he ever said. He WAS a Democrat, believed in abortion ,even late term, was for the war but denied saying it, and time doesn't permit me to list them all because I'm leaving. Take off your blinders and stop watching Fox and fake news. Do you believe that Hillary killed Vince Foster and had an alien baby too? Maybe you should cancel your National Enquirer subscription.

lily- perhaps some day you will realize that people who dislike the Clintons aren't Trump supporters.

I, and I believe Elmer as well, don't like or trust Trump either but his boorish behavior does not erase the Clinton's proven history of selfishness.

They are two separate topics.

Lily, I agree with everything you have posted....Thank you......

Texas gem said it better than I could, with the addition of the words to say "not ALL people who dislike the Clintons are/were Trump supporters". You can describe me that way and also many other people I know.

lily, you're thinking of the Gates Foundation insofar as spending billions to eliminate endemic diseases like HIV and Malaria. That and more as far as Gates is concerned. The Clinton Foundation isn't in the big leagues like them and others I mentioned before.

I know someone from the East who knew the Clintons personally and saw them frequently during a stretch of several years. Clinton supporters don't want to hear what he has to say about them, and he's a lifelong Democrat.

There's massive misinformation, misunderstandings, and blind idol worship among supporters of both candidates. It's unprecedented in my memory of such things..

I am not a blind Clinton supporter. She's not my favorite person, but I do think she's very intelligent, devoted to her work, and is the most qualified person to ever run for the office. I worked for Jimmy Carter, B. Clinton, Gore, Kerry, but did not work this cycle for the first time in many years. I am a lifelong Democrat and I know she has flaws, but compared to the alternative it's a no brainer. In my whole life I have never to my recall ever had political dreams, but in the past three weeks, I've had them almost every night which almost turns into a nightmare. Less than a quarter of the people in this country voted for Trump, and even some of them are having buyer's remorse. He's a loose and very dumb cannon.

Maybe you should cancel your National Enquirer subscription.

******

You mean the paper that won a Pulitzer for breaking the John Edwards story wide open? I rather like to think they saved us from possibly having that hormonally-addled putz in the Oval.

;-)

Yeah, the tabloid that showed Hillary holding an alien baby. That one.

Really? Hmm lily, glad you keep abreast of the tabloids.

Yeah, I read them cover to cover. NOT!!!! Hard to miss when they're at the grocery check out lane.

I'm on my phone in line. Saves me from inadvertently looking at some Kartrashian.

Plus, you can't prove Hillary DIDN'T have an alien love child...

The National Enquirer did not receive a Pulitzer Prize - for reporting on Edwards or anything else.

Because it's a magazine and not eligible. However, the story, investigating and writing were quite worthy.

It was a technicality. The magazine put out award-worthy copy, no doubt about it.

" detractors who contend the supermarket tabloid isn't worthy of commendation, Levine said, the proof is in his paper's reporting.

"The fact that we may package this story along with the types of stories involving celebrities that are not typical of newspapers that the Pulitzer committee may look at on a yearly basis has nothing to do with the reporting," he said. "That persistence, that old-fashioned, shoe-leather reporting that we exhibited on this story, at the end of the day, is what the Pulitzer committee recognized."

http://abcnews.go.com/Entertainment/national-enquirer-now-legit-pulitzer-prize-board/story?id=9887329

The Democrats sure had a run of deceitful, dishonest and narcissistic politicians surfacing on the national scene in the 1990s and into the new century - the Clintons, Al Gore, John Edwards. Going forward, I think the worst of the run has passed.

Take off your blinders and stop watching Fox and fake news.

It's ALL yellow journalism anymore. The only difference being that Fox is conservative and the others are loony lefties. There is no integrity in news reporting anymore.

My eyes! My eyes!

That is disgusting !!! Ewwwwww

It was a Vulcan lip lock ;-0

You mean the paper that won a Pulitzer for breaking the John Edwards story wide open? I rather like to think they saved us from possibly having that hormonally-addled putz in the Oval.

You mean like the one we're getting in January?..........and a whole lot worse.

Huh? Is Trump cheating on a terminally-ill wife, with a harpy who conveniently forgets to take her birth control pills?

Maybe I should read the tabloids.

Yeah, at least Ivana wasn't terminally ill, when Marla Maples forgot her birth control pills.

I though that moment between Al and Tipper was kinda cute, but I do recall Tipper seemed quite taken aback.

Aww, 23 years ago? Really?

OMG, has it been that long? ;)

It has, and Marla is looking amazing. I saw her on DWTS a couple times and she seems like a really sweet person.

I watched a documentary on Ivana's life, in which she expressed a
different sentiment. But I have no problem with either of the Trump ex
wives, or with Melania. His children seem well spoken and intelligent, although I understand the criticism that the elder
sons have received over their big game hunting. I wish them all the best.

Tiffany is lucky to be here because her father wanted Marla to get an abortion. I totally agree about John Edwards. He was a sleaze as was his lover, but we have someone much worse going into the White House. Since Fox News(?) never ran the salacious audio tapes with Stern about how he didn't go to Vietnam but put in his duty here by not getting a venereal disease with all the screwing around he did in that period, and then they laughed. How do you like that, veterans? He got six deferments for a bone spur which never hampered him in any way.

Agree about the big game hunting, mama. It does not endear them or anyone who partakes, to me. Yet, I also wish them all the best.

Well, maybe not Ted Nugent ;-)