Thanks Sweeby! I did check your recommendation, it seems that they do not carry the pattern that I am interested in, but they do carry quite a lot of beautiful glass and options for the overall look of the door or cabinet that the glass is ordered for. Very beautiful way to finish a cabinet. I also posted this question on the Kitchens forum since there is far more experience with cabinetry over there and as I expected, I got a few more responses to my question. Here are the replies I received. They're very helpful, which is why I'm copying them here. RE: Have You Ever Heard of the Glass Inset Falling Out of a Cab D Breathe! The glass shouldn't fall out. If you're worried about it, however, there are little clips for securing the glass, and you can add more. You could also nail in a little molding bead. Most important, if you think there will be banging into the glass, get tempered. It costs more, but is harder to break and doesn't get as many shards when it does break. Check your local code. You might have to use tempered, or even wired, in a bathroom, by code, because people slip. I think my glass was installed by my cabinetmakers. They were here at the same time as the glass company was installing my BP backsplash, however, so I'm not 100% sure. Re glass shelves, it depends on what look you want, and what you're going to store. If you want the light to shine through the shelves, you must, of course, have glass shelves. For a beach or cottage look, however, you can just as easily do wood if it has a nicely finished side. Glass shelves might be better for a "formal" look. For a "formal" look, Reeded would be very nice. Glue Chip might be more feminine, however. Any simple, all over pattern would be good. I'd avoid anything that's figural, that is, no bamboo, leaves, raindrops, etc. RE: Have You Ever Heard of a Glass Inset Falling Out of a Cabnt D Posted by mama_goose (My Page) on Tue, Jun 22, 10 at 14:15 Are there already plenty of mirrors? With several girls using the bathroom, you might consider another mirror in the door. Here is a link that might be useful: Mirrored cabinet doors thread. RE: Have You Ever Heard of a Glass Inset Falling Out of a Cabnt D Posted by cupofkindness (My Page) on Tue, Jun 22, 10 at 14:20 Plllog: Thank you so much for your reply, it sets my mind at ease. Good, practical information. Here is a link to the patterned glass that I'm considering. I don't think it is tempered, however. I just hope it has a timeless appeal. My local glass shop doesn't carry this pattern, so I may have to buy it from the cabinet company, which I'd rather avoid. But at this point I just need to move forward. Any other opinions? What do you think of this pattern? Thanks again! Here is a link that might be useful: Morisco Glass RE: Have You Ever Heard of a Glass Inset Falling Out of a Cabnt D Posted by growlery (My Page) on Tue, Jun 22, 10 at 14:30 One can't say it would never happen. But it wouldn't happen without warning. You'd notice the joints getting loose, the glass jiggling or rattling, the cracks getting wider. This could happen over the years as a normal part of wear and settling. Just take it down long before anything happens, have it fixed put it back up and it should give you many more years of safe service. RE: Have You Ever Heard of a Glass Inset Falling Out of a Cabnt D Posted by plllog (My Page) on Tue, Jun 22, 10 at 16:53 Cup, I think the pattern is pretty and girly enough, if a bit busy. It's not what I'd choose for "formal", but if you have some Victorian style elements, for instance, it should do well. You can have any glass tempered. The big problem with cabinet glass (as I discovered to my dismay!) is shipping, especially if the lengths are long. Do you live in or near a city? If so you can call around to see if anyone carries your glass. I first saw my glass at a place very near my house, but then they couldn't do it for some reason (I actually think "crazy" was in there somewhere). The cabinetmaker's glass guy wanted a humongous amount extra to have it tempered. Benheim, online, wanted the same amount because it would have to be crated and shipped by common carrier (like furniture) because it was too long for a parcel service. I had a very emotional week whining about it on GW. One of our members here was very helpful. He found a distributor within an hour's drive of me. Also that this pattern is all made by the same place no matter what the name and who sells it. I was in the middle of planning to use my GC to buy it (wholesale) but transport it myself to the temperer, when the GC had the thought that maybe he should ask his glass guys. (Ya think?) They were coming to install my BP backsplash (mirror), and they carry it, so they could just bring it instead of anyone doing any crating. Sigh. Such a simple answer! If you can't find a local shop that carries it, it might be best to let the cabinet company do it. They're crating and shipping your cabinets anyway. RE: Have You Ever Heard of a Glass Inset Falling Out of a Cabnt D Posted by cupofkindness (My Page) on Tue, Jun 22, 10 at 19:49 plllog: Everything you've said makes perfect sense. Thank you so much for taking the time to post. And Mama Goose, I love those mirrored cabinets, they are wonderful. However, in this small tub/toilet room, when you step out of the tub, there would be the mirrors, and I'm not sure if my girls would be comfortable with that. I'll ask them what they think. It's a great idea, mirrors add so much to any room. Growlery, you are right as well, the glass wouldn't just fall out of the doors one day, we would have some warning.... now why didn't I think of that? Thanks again to all of you for your comments and suggestions. I am grateful for each and every one of them. ~Cupofkindness RE: Have You Ever Heard of a Glass Inset Falling Out of a Cabnt D Posted by vickimp (My Page) on Tue, Jun 22, 10 at 19:57 Yes! It happened to us. We have a large TV wall unit with a couple of upper doors with glass inserts. They were held in with plastic clips. Over time, the plastic fatigued and one day my DH opened one of the doors and the glass fell out onto the carpet. If it had hit his foot, or one of our kids, it would have been trouble. In our kitchen, we ordered some of our cabinets with glass inset doors. They came with those same plastic clips. Besides the safety issue, I didn't like the way they looked, so I had our finish carpenter redo them by gluing the glass in and then micronailing in a strip of wood matching the cabinets. Shouldn't go anywhere....I hope. RE: Have You Ever Heard of a Glass Inset Falling Out of a Cabnt D Posted by cupofkindness (My Page) on Wed, Jun 23, 10 at 8:38 Vicki: Egads! I'm glad your husband did not get hurt. Was the glass tempered? I'm wondering if you can special order metal clips (those are what I remember seeing many years ago when I did my kitchen reno. The glass was held in place with rubber-tipped metal clips). Do you know what sort of glue your carpenter used? And the wood strip is a good idea as well... between the two I'm sure your glass is quite safe. I wonder what they did 100 years ago? Thanks again! RE: Have You Ever Heard of a Glass Inset Falling Out of a Cabnt D Posted by brickeyee (My Page) on Wed, Jun 23, 10 at 9:01 Very small quarter round was the standard for holding glass in cabinets for only a few hundred years. It still works very well. The only way for the glass to come out is if it is broken. In some cases you actually tape up the glass liberally, then break it if it needs to be removed. This makes it easier to salvage the thin strips without breaking them so they can be used again (important if they are finished to match). Plastic clips are an accident waiting to happen, as are any method that does not lock in as much of the edge as possible. RE: Have You Ever Heard of a Glass Inset Falling Out of a Cabnt D Posted by growlery (My Page) on Wed, Jun 23, 10 at 13:06 Yes, I have some pieces of old furniture that have quarter rounds holding the glass in. Glass has been in doors and windows for a long, long time. Get good hardware, give everything a little wiggle every once in awhile to check it's in good condition, and there are many, many more things you do every day without thought that are more likely to hurt you, unfortunately. I believe, if this is really troubling you though, there is a 3M security product that is a film, essentially like a large sheet of, I don't know, tape or sticky Saranwrap, that you apply to glass, like doors. It advertises itself as being perfectly transparent, but is apparently not quite enough so for most homeowners. It probably gets blurry and little bubbles etc. But for your purposes, stuck to the back of a textured glass, it might be worth looking into. If someone did smash the glass, it would keep it most/all stick to the film, not loose. It might be a small investment in peace of mind. RE: Have You Ever Heard of a Glass Inset Falling Out of a Cabnt D Posted by brickeyee (My Page) on Wed, Jun 23, 10 at 16:02 "If someone did smash the glass, it would keep it most/all stick to the film, not loose. It might be a small investment in peace of mind. " It is not going to help much if an entire pane of glass slips out and falls on your foot. RE: Have You Ever Heard of a Glass Inset Falling Out of a Cabnt D Posted by cupofkindness (My Page) on Thu, Jun 24, 10 at 9:21 My thanks to everyone for your replies and all of this helpful information. I'm going to the glass shop today to see what they offer in patterned and tempered glass. I'll keep you posted.

Many cabinet companies will not do the combo because they have been burned in the past with customer dissatisfaction. The problem is that mitered doors always warp more with the change of the seasons. Warping and inset means more problems with them sticking and needing adjusting more frequently. If YOU are OK with learning how to adjust your doors, and being OK with the seasonal changes meaning more prominent visible cracking will occur in the paint in those joints, then move on to a cabinet companty that will do inset and mitered. There are several, (including Dynasty and Omega that I carry). But, you have to be OK with the issues that they will have long term and those issues are NOT "defects" in the cabinetry. It's how wood behaves.

Cup, I think the pattern is pretty and girly enough, if a bit busy. It's not what I'd choose for "formal", but if you have some Victorian style elements, for instance, it should do well. You can have any glass tempered. The big problem with cabinet glass (as I discovered to my dismay!) is shipping, especially if the lengths are long. Do you live in or near a city? If so you can call around to see if anyone carries your glass. I first saw my glass at a place very near my house, but then they couldn't do it for some reason (I actually think "crazy" was in there somewhere). The cabinetmaker's glass guy wanted a humongous amount extra to have it tempered. Benheim, online, wanted the same amount because it would have to be crated and shipped by common carrier (like furniture) because it was too long for a parcel service. I had a very emotional week whining about it on GW. One of our members here was very helpful. He found a distributor within an hour's drive of me. Also that this pattern is all made by the same place no matter what the name and who sells it. I was in the middle of planning to use my GC to buy it (wholesale) but transport it myself to the temperer, when the GC had the thought that maybe he should ask his glass guys. (Ya think?) They were coming to install my BP backsplash (mirror), and they carry it, so they could just bring it instead of anyone doing any crating. Sigh. Such a simple answer! If you can't find a local shop that carries it, it might be best to let the cabinet company do it. They're crating and shipping your cabinets anyway.

Most of the reasons for the price differences have been documented pretty well from earlier postings; the basic reasons have to do with the fact that a tighter tolerance is necessary, so there is a higher degree of craftsmanship required. The same is true on the installation side. Typical overlay cabinets are very forgiving as they are being installed; with inset, any change in the straightness or levelness of the walls and floor can cause the cabinet to be "racked" which results in the door not looking properly placed in the opening of the cabinet. Most installers are very good at using shims and other leveling techniques so that isn't a problem, just takes more care. Showplace builds both inset and overlay cabinets and there isn't a huge difference in price - probably somewhere between 5-7%, but there are actual material and labor differences that make this up (not all other brands would follow this logic though). - Wall cabinets are 13 or 14" deep vs. 12" for overlay; which adds material to the end panels, tops, bottoms, and shelves. The increased depth allows for the interior storage depth lost when a door sits "in the frame" as opposed to sitting "on the frame." - Base cabinets all have a plywood top which adds rigidity to the cabinet, helping to prevent installation racking; standard overlay base cabinets do not get this kind of top. - Beaded inset frames have horizontal pieces miter-fitted into the vertical pieces; it means they are all longer and require precise fitting - and the vertical members have multiple notches cut into them to receive the horizontal pieces. Showplace used to charge an inset "craftsmanship" premium, which is quite typical in the industry, but earlier this year reduced pricing by about 18% eliminating the pricing components that didn't have tangible reason for being there as compared to overlay cabinets. Here is a link that might be useful: Inset Cabinetry Details