6a Massachusetts rose grower, I am looking for roses that perform well in 4 hours of sun. I love sweet fruity fragrances and colors in pinks and corals. I am drawn to the older style English rose, the same form as Eveylyn. but, I will lean towards best frangrance in deciding. My space is 4-6,000 square feet of rapidly declining lawn, though the beds are getting bigger each year.
Reposted from Help me Find: (thanks again!)
To: StrawChicago Alkaline clay 5a, you have convinced me to get Zephirine D. I am in zone 6a (North of Boston) moved here from Chicago! If you can grow these in 4 hours of sun, than I ought to be able to. Most of my roses will only get 4 hours. I am also considering a few others you have mentioned. Currently, I have Boscobel (not thriving), Princess Alexandria of Kent (vigorous), Jubilee Celebration (good) and a bunch of tiny drift roses that are easy. I want to get Eden too and Alnwick. Your posts will guide me! CC
5:09 PM 7 DEC 21
The Right roses (edit:what resource is this?) used to have open info. to the public, and it ranked Boscobel as needing full-sun, vs. PAK can take partial shade. The shallow cup with zillion petals can take shade: W.S. 2000 and Radio times, but the deep cup like Evelyn need full-sun (it balled in partial shade). Evelyn has lots of petals.
Darcy Busell (shallow cup) can take partial shade, versus St. Cecilia (deep cup) need full-sun. The Alnwick rose and Eden look like deep cup to me.
Less petals and deep cup like Pat Austin does well in partial shade because of its orange color. My best performers in partial shade have yellow color (zillion-petals Tchaikosky), or orange (Pat Austin).
Orange Crown Princess Mag. (zillion petals) can take partial shade due to it's orange color. Sutter's Gold is said to perform as well in partial shade as in full-sun at Columbus rose park in Ohio.
Zepherine Drouhin has very few petals but the blooms last long in the vase. It takes partial shade well.
The most shade-tolerant roses I saw are FlowerCarpets at Chicago Botanical garden. They had a bunch of light-pink flowercarpet with tons of blooms, planted below a large tree. It was amazing !! Knock-outs can't take partial shade like FlowerCarpet .. the zillion-petals pom-poms take partial shade well like my single-petal salmon FlowerCaret.
5:52 PM 7 DEC 21
CC: Oh this is such good information! I was most impressed with your Evelyn! I fell in love with her in a bouquet and that is what started all my rose growing. I am wondering if I should give up on Boscobel and put in Sweet Mademoiselle instead. I like the coral color. To be fair, the bunnies loved Boscobel and did not let up on my FIVE (5) "bushes". I am drawn to the sweeter fruitier smelling roses. I love the shape and form of Evelyn, so pretty, it is where my rose obsession started. Now, I just can't fet enough.
As far as defining shade tolerance: I do not fully understand what you were saying about the cup depth affecting roses grown in part shade. Is it the deeper cupped ones that struggle with shade? Does petal count affect it? How does the color of bloom play into this? It is hard for me to visualize. I understand that roses need 6 hrs sun to have enough energy to produce buds. I also understand that to some sellers/catologues," shade tolerant" is a phrase that means different things. To some growers it seems to translate to disease resistance. I did not see much in the way of diseases. I wonder if sellers use the phrase shade tolerant to mean, for growers in the south, the color will be better in some shade? It is certainly used as a good selling and marketing ploy.
I am recently intrigued by the Gallicas roses. Several are listed as "tolerating shade". Some have this little button in the middle that is adorable. I might be able to move things around and fit one, they are huge.Monday,
I was about to place an order with Palatine (when the site crashed), this is good though, now I will reevaluate my list.
My list looked like this:
Zephirine D (which you confirmed for me is a good choice)
Eden Climber for my front door (gets morning sun til noon) I can not resist.
Still waffling on Jasmina Arborose (I am all about the strong fragrance) I could skip it.
Roxy (ground cover like)
Larissa (pink flowers on tiny plant)
Pompom Veranda (same, pure extravagance or me)
Bliss Perfuma (I can't resist the fragrance)
Earth Angel (I have one that did well last year in a container)
James Galway is on order from DA for spring.
Alnwich is on order for Spring (i love the coral orange colors) (DA)
Eustacia Vye is on order (Heirloom)
Pretty polly is on order from White Flower Farm.
I have The Pilgrim (yellow climber, did ok)
Olivia Austin, tiny but adorable
PAOK - huge, I may need to peg it
Princess Charlene of Monaco, came late in the summer and there was almost complete die back, I doubt it will make it through the winter. (I love the paler pinks)
Jubilee Celebration., surprised me, I like its fragrance and color.
Drift roses doing ok. (Peach is the best, Apricot, coral and red all ok)
My soil is acidic, I grow rhodedrons, hollies and blueberries and hydrangeas side by side with the roses everywhere. I used to try to grow roses in the soil in Chicago, you really do have to ammend it. I lived on Shakespeare, near Damen. Any soil I had, I brought in. I miss Gethsemane and the Botannical Gardens. I did most of my container gardening then.
Thanks for responding!
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