Dear Gardenwebbers, I haven't posted in a while but have been following every single word you have all typed-I've turning into a stove stalker ROFLOL! Of all the threads I've read over the past year regarding stoves, this is the only one whose posters have actually taken the time to break down the decision-making into the critical components. Not just reviews or opinion, but usage, wear, cost, BTUs, options,even the way the stove sticks out from the walls and integrates into the space. Well done!!You have no idea how helpful you've been! I still haven't made a decision, but I'm inching closer. Like a few of you, I took a step back and asked what I really needed/had to have. One of you rightly pointed out that deciding whether one is a stove top or oven cooker could help out. My ovens are super important to me, and have been the big sticking point in my choices (more on that in a minute) but I do most of my cooking on the stovetop.I REALLY want a coup de feu.If I pick the two burner one coup combination offered by Molteni or Gullo, I'll have to really up my cooking game and plan a bit more ahead (you have to allow the plaque to come to temperature to really use it effectively. So I was concerned I wouldn't have enough "regular" burners.But then, like you all advised, I took a step back and paid attention to what I was really doing "most" days-turns out I'm usually only turning on two burners anyway. When i move to more burners, that's when I could use a million more, so the coup definitely could work out then. I'm still kind of intimidated by it-the Molteni and the others I'm considering are very powerful, but I think that's just lack of self confidence. Burner strength/BTU's were very important to me as well. I currently have an old Wolf Gourmet line-they were better made than the current offering, heavier and more powerful.The max burner is 18K, but it loses power when the other ones are turned on, and then I can't get that nice carmelized sear on the food. I love the oven though. It's gas with a broiler and a (very noisy) convection fan, and sticky racks. Don't love the noise and the stick, but the size is pretty good, and it works well. All the units I'm considering are more powerful, but some more than others.Like everyone has noted, the ovens seem to be what pose the most dilemmas. I worry about cleanability. My current stove is a PITA to clean.The Rorgue has a neat water bath under the burners to rinse out spills-cool!It's also the least expensive of my three choices (So far. Am waiting on the cost of the UL listing fee, plus I have to add in taxes and VAT) but I can have every little gadget I had lusted for(of course, I'm now really rethinking everything). But it's the least pretty/french range looking of the batch. It does come in colors though. I'm nervous that if i select a range with two ovens that I won't be able to use them for what I occasionally need-larger sheets and pans, so I'm really leaning towards one gas oven in the range, and a Miele Masterchef 30" in the wall, which is 6" bigger than my current oven (I have a few pans that I really have to grease up the sides of the oven to squeeze in). I'm going to a Gaggenau cooking demo at Purcell-Murray this weekend and check out their ovens too. Anybody have some feedback on those? I'm also considering getting a smaller range and adding in two induction burners into the counter for quickie cooking for the kids (I have five). I could have had them built into a bespoke range, but the electric components have to be kept far away from a high heat source, which screwed up the size of the unit massively Our quotes from the contractors are coming-scary! I just wanted to thank everyone for all the input-every single comment has been so helpful. Oh, on a side note, there's a ROCKIN' Morice stove for sale that I found on the internet. It's not the right color for em (it's blue and silver) but maybe it would work out for you. It's got 3/4 burners (one is a single grate but with two burners under it-is that one or two?LOL) and a coup de feu. The oven is electric. I've (hopefully!) included the link. Parts are still available for the Morices. If it had been a different color, I would have jumped on it-great price. well, I'll be continuing to follow everybody's stove progress, and hope to have a stove too. Soon... Here is a link that might be useful: Sea Sales Morice cooker

sornbarry - After speaking with our local SZ repair guy, he suggested that we spring for the new unit, as apparently it's not the parts on the old SZs but the box itself that begins to deteriorate around the 25+ year mark. Not to mention that the cabinets for our older model would be completely different from the cabinets used to create the integrated look and there'd be no way to retrofit the unit once it died. <Sigh> Not that we were looking to spend the extra cash, but I am a strong believer in doing things right the first time (especially seeing as we have no plans to move anytime soon). You're right about the Superba, and I've only recently discovered its convection properties, which I love. The Superba also got us out of quite the jam last Christmas when the Dacor straight up stopped working partway through cooking our prime rib roast, and it was the Superba that picked up the slack. Most of the negative reviews I've read about the Superba have to do with self-cleaning mode, which I don't like using in ovens anyways. Needless to say, I think we're okay having it stick around a while longer - it's certainly a lot easier to change out than a Sub Zero! Thanks again for all of your thoughts and comments. I really appreciate being able to bounce ideas off of someone who has been in such a remarkably similar situation as my own!

Sounds like you have thought out aspects of your cooking and are on the right track. Your choices sound great. If you have a pantry you can always put a small mw in there if you need it. That being said, I still have a hard time at the thought of giving up a mw completely and am installing a mw drawer as well as the larger cso Miele oven and a wall oven. (I envy you your lacanche though) I like the idea of the miele cso as I like the convenience of the plumbed model and know that I will love the ease of the directions and programming. Someone here mentioned that with the smaller model you can't fit multiple racks of taller items in the smaller ones. so I felt this is a good area to splurge and go larger. As to your comment about enjoying cooking more in a beautiful, convenient space that is indeed very true. The kitchen that I am planning a renovation has such limited counter/prep space, limited storage space and a crappy oven. It is so frustrating to cook in it that I HATE cooking now. Cooking in that kitchen is like trying to build a house with a nail file and a pair of scissors. I just came back to my "real" kitchen in my other home and it is such a different experience to cook when you have the space, well thought out cooking zones and good appliances. My only other advice is to think about how you cook and the steps taken between areas. I divided my kitchen up into zones and it is so efficient. I have general everyday prep with frig, mw, speed oven, cooktop, clean up,, trash and dw and storage all within a few steps near a casual eating area. Then I have a baking zone, for storage and prep of all things baking related near the ovens, a wrapping and food storage container zone, pantry storage, entertaining zone ;entertaining clean up with an additional dw, tras and sink and storage for those dinner services and flatware services there and so on. (Hope that makes sense. )

“you really need to focus first on what do you want” It is much more complicated than that. The days of taking for granted that an oven will work as advertised are in the past. I have two ovens that have great features and I love the way they bake, especially the Electrolux, but the problems with the electronics and even failure of the structure itself would keep me from buying another one. Another ”feature” electric ovens almost always have now is the hidden bake element. This cuts the radiant heat from the elements and can affect baking results. I think it subjects the bottom of the oven to a lot more heat and may contribute to the problems people have with chipping enamel. Features that have the same name vary so much brand to brand. An oven may say that they have a third element (True or Euro convection) but that element can function differently brand to brand. Convection is marketed to “even the heat“ in the oven, but can set up hot spots depending on how it is designed. Manufacturers try to avoid that by using dual fans, slower fan speeds in some modes, baffles or reversing fans. It can be very difficult to determine if ovens have these things, especially fan speeds. Even if you call and ask the manufacture, good luck getting someone that can answer the question. Some of this works and some make hot spots worse. Convection is not the best for everything that they tell you to use it For. Just a basic feature like a preheat can be a deal killer. Some use an intense preheat that will not allow you to put food in while it is preheating. Dacor says in their manual if you turn the heat up by 50°F, you must remove the food from the oven or it will burn. Are you kidding me? They are not the only oven like this. As mentioned above we have no idea what the excellent vs good means in the CR predicted reliability. Is it 10% vs 15% or 5% vs 20% or 30% vs 35%? Yale is just the last year and in some models the sample is extremely small. Both are missing major brands. Thermador completely redesigned their ovens recently and raised the prices. The best east you can do is try to read as many reviews you can for the specific model. . Many brands are talked about here. You can learn from complaints. Look for flaws that would affect the way you cook or show up a lot. Read the warranty and consider getting a service plan. Read it carefully for exclusions. Know who will provide service. Read reviews on dealers and look at how they handle problems. There is a good chance you will be told not use a pyrolytic self clean and steam clean does not get great reviews.