Well..you are right about the summer maximum but to call this a monsoon....BEtween 2000-3000 m etres, where P. martinezii grows they get 680mm on average. So the circulation may well be that of a monsoon but the result is unlike what the word monsoon in general seems to imply. I also found out that the average temperature is a staggering 14 C (annual average). That is really high for a spruce. The climate is classified as oceanic. Okey, more like Southern France oceanic or NW Portugal Spain Oceanic. But than with less rain. Summer precipitation is probably 200-300 mm but the growing season is much longer. Probably all year round or at least march-november. This means that growing season precipitation is lower than that of most parts of NW Europe (much lower). It may succeed in the eastern US, but not where temperatures can drop to -20 or lower I think. I guess this spruce is may be a zone 9 one. But unsure.

And I found something caled 'Rothenburg' on one of the Coenosium pages. bboy: this 'Reflexa' name is confusing. Some sites describe it as you say, and that would be something that can't grow upright on its own. But Dave (dcsteg) is growing a couple (see his post, with pictures, under the topic "my $49 blue spruce weeper ID") and I found a place on-line--I can't get back to it now--that describes the tree Dave is growing: upright grower with branches curving upwards with weeping branchlets. I find all the contradictory descriptions of these cultivars very frustrating and confusing. Treelover: I will try Iseli--the local nursery here--Webbers--has been buying from them recently, so I will see what they can do for me. Redwing; I will try Gee farms--thanks for the reference. A nursery in WV has a couple of P. abies 'Pendula' trees for sale. They have been sitting there for two or three years now. The burlap has rotted away and they are rooted in the ground. They look really nice and are growing upright on their own. It is too late now--growth is well underway and they would have to be dug, but if they are still there and still growing upright, I will buy them early next spring. But what could they be? I understand many things are commonly sold as 'Pendula' including 'Inversa'. I guess I will never know what something like this actually is, specifically. But I have lots of room and want to grow as many of these things as I can find, maybe in multiples. --Spruce

Hi all, I'm new here. I've been trying to find a picea pungens glauca (or other similar blue spruce) in the UK (Southwest of England). All the suppliers I have tried so far, only have specimens about 20cm tall. Ideally I'd like to find one between 1-2m tall. Any ideas? Cheers Sibotts

Ireena, It is a pretty plant you got there. I'm so jealous of you guys in Europe where you can get all kind of rare and beautiful dwarf plants. We ( U.S collectors), for some unknown reasons, only have handful of rare plants to choose from. I'm not sure why all the big nurseries like Iseli do not import and graft those plants? Maybe they're hard to graft? or maybe they are too slow to grow and thus they're not a butter and milk product for the nurseries to produce? Or maybe there is only a small handful of conifer enthusiasts in the U.S and thus there's no market niche for the rare dwarf conifer cultivation? It's been a mystery to me but I'm not sure what the reason is/are. Any conifer collector vets shed light on these questions? Thanks! J.N