Thanks for starting the thread , Amy.

I had a good day yesterday. Emmy and Jerry came over, and brought lunch and took a bunch of peppers and green tomatoes hope with them.

I checked the garden this morning, and I sure need to get after the henbit, but Its too wet to do much around here. I hope to work on the deck, Step son is coming down from northwest Arkansas, and will be doing most of the work, I am just not man enough to help much, but I love to be with him, and Madge is on cloud 9 when any of her kids are around, she is already in the kitchen cooking.

It looks to be a nice day, but it is getting the time of year when good days can be a ways apart. Our forecast goes out to 11-20, and no freeze is in sight, but looks like we will get more rain.

I hope everyone enjoys the pretty day as much as I plan to.

I just made a big post lost it and came back to tell you. I am having a great day in the garden peeling Roselle.

I have had a good day. I have really enjoyed Steve being here, he is here working on our deck. I have been trying to help Steve, but I am more in the way than helping.

I had to go inside and rest for a while, I am just not able to get around well enough to be much help. after resting for about 20 or 30 minutes I went out to the south garden and was able to get on the wood chip berm I have for erosion control on my hands and knees where it was dry, and plant more garlic. I don't need the garlic, but it was something I could do. I have a pointed bulb planter, and with the soil being wet I can just stick the tool into the soil to make a hole for the garlic clove. I planted 75 today, this has to bring my total up to, or above 600 cloves planted, that is around 3 times the number I planted last year, and the 204 that I planted last year was too many.

I need to harvest some sweet potato leaves tomorrow, I want to try them like cooking spinach. I have plenty of garlic, onions and peppers to put in the sweet potato greens, I expect that they will be pretty good.

Well, as Jennifer often says, " I am just rambling". I will shut up, and go to bed.

The best I got going, a fall greens tunnel.

Kale , collards , chard , mustard, onions ,turnips , radishes , rutabaga , a little spinach , a little more spinach just coming up for overwintering.

Will be covering up the hoops with row covers next week when the first hard killing freeze hits.

Rick

Rick, that is really pretty, I would like to learn how to do that. How do you harvest that with the row cover on it, and where do you buy your row cover?

Great info Rick. I appreciate the pictures and description. It’s helpful to know what to look forward to

Thanks, Rick, great info, and pictures. This sounds like something I would like to try, but I may have waited too long, I am not sure I would be able to tend to a tunnel now. Maybe I could build something small with a hinged top, just to play with.

Larry, I have been slowly building cages out of chicken wire and covering with insect netting for my pots. I will transition to agribon for my pots if necessary this winter I also am considering covering the entire garden in a plastic. It would end up being like a hoop house.

Hello. Thanks for starting the weekly thread, Amy.

After reading everyone's posts, seems like you're all quite busy still.

I had about 20 minutes to look over the garden. One variety of garlic is coming up. It's the Inchelium--the one that I've saved for 3 years, so we're going on year 4 of acclimating to my garden.

The other varieties aren't showing up just yet--Nootka and the "generic" one that Rick brought over.

I sure wish I had a full day to spend on the garden to clean it up.

I'm not that much into trying to over winter crops. If we ever have a food shortage, I will be into that. For now, it's a lot of effort for little produce. But, it can be fun too. So that is worth something.

On Saturday, I might have some time to work in the garden a little. Maybe Sunday too because I don't have to work that evening.

However, the coop needs to be winterized, and the auto waterers needs to be cleaned up and put away. And the other waterers found and brought out.

Other than being incredibly busy at work, that's about it.

I just placed a seed order with Johnny's Selected Seed. I've been keeping seed from season to season in the freezer. But I can't tell ya where I got that. I've got some seed I bought in 2021. Its been in the freezer but I ordered fresh today. Just don't trust it. And I've found my germination rate goes down as the seed ages.

Does keeping seed in the freezer really preserve it ?

I bought my usual Big Beef tomato. But added Big Beef Plus this year. Its a Top Seller at Johnny's and tops the Most Popular list for Beefsteak varieties. I planted some Big Beef Plus for the 2022 season, but that entire year was a disaster for a lot of reasons. And I got that seed from Totally Tomatoes, not Johnny's.

And instead of getting my cucumber seed at Home Depot, I ordered Max Pack from Johnny's. I had to plant cucumber twice last year to get any to germinate. And honestly, choosing between varieties is beyond me. Again, I bought it because it was a top seller and was not super expensive. I've no idea what I bought.

Same with the jalapeno seed , Pantera , and a bell pepper Sweet Sunrise , they were popular. I've been planting jalapeno seed from Home Depot and the plants produce a lot of peppers, but they're small.

As long as I was paying shipping, I went ahead filled up the cart.

I have never kept my seed in the freezer. And I have seed that dates back to 2014. Actually, my Porter dated back to 2011 or 12. Germination goes down, but I just seed double extra. I noticed the only seed I need desperately right now is cilantro. None of mine came up the last three times I Planted. I did get some of, but it’s not getting enough sun and it’s very scraggly

And I do that too. When I do make an order I load up

I have some volunteer cilantro coming up. But its not anywhere near what it should be, considering the amount of plants and the seeds they dropped this June.

I think its been too warm. What I've found is cilantro likes cool and wet. We've not had either one.

Oh yeah, the Al Stewart concert at Rose College, got cancelled. Probably due to extremely low ticket sales. He was competing with election coverage.

I don't know anything about cilantro, but I have been trying to grow some for the kids for the past 2 or 3 years. I don't remember planting any this fall, but I did plant arugula for the kids, it grew up and was looking nice, but now my garlic and arugula are turning yellow. I have not had a soil test in a while, but my first guess is that I may have waterlogged soil, if that is the case, why would my other plants look so nice? Also the spinach is looking bad. The spinach has never looked nice this fall.

There's not a lot of veggies or herbs that are a whole lot better home grown than store bought. Tomatoes are number one on the list. There's nothing like a home grown tomato. But cilantro , in my book, runs a close second. Its has so much more flavor. So much that we cut back the amount we put into our dishes. Its really got a flavor pop.

They tell me that fresh dill makes pickles a lot better. I can't attest to that as I've done nothing but fresh home grown dill.

BTW, speaking of pickles. I went to Edge Craft barbecue , near downtown OKC, on Linwood last month. And like most barbecue joints, they put pickled red onion and pickles on the platter. They had the best pickles I've ever had. The pitmaster, Zach Edge, makes them himself. Really good.

I have not learned much about growing spices. The few spices that I have grown is because of the kids asking if I could grow it. So far I have been able to grow what they have ask for. I bought dill seeds this year, but have not planted any.

The red onions I have grown were a big hit.

I like fresh tomatoes also, but most of all, I like fried green tomatoes.

I made some sweet potato greens for lunch, they taste a lot like spinach.

Just have to plant dill once. It will come up volunteer .......... everwhere around the garden.

Do you plant dill in the spring? I have a pack of seeds, but my guess is that it is too late to plant it now. I have tons of ground ready.

In a way I really messes up by just tilling my sweet potato vines back into soil, and replanting right after harvest. I normally push the vines up into a pile at the edge of the garden and let the sun dry them before I chop them up and blow them back into the garden to be tilled in the soil, but I think this way may work better. I may have to prune some vines away from some of my fall crop so my fall stuff can get more sun. I am hoping that the frost will kill the sweet potatoes soon enough that I can still get a harvest from the beets. I am already getting a good harvest from the onions and greens.

I would plant in early spring.

Yep, early spring ......... though dill is a cool weather plant. I go in ASAP.

Larry, I have dill that comes up every year in the bed where I normally plant cucumbers. If you plant it once, it will come back. The plants were put into the garden(years ago) in spring. Sometimes the swallowtails visit and eat it all. But not every year. Also, it seems to come in waves during the growing season. If the swallowtails eat it, more comes back.

I planted some dill that I thought was something else and I have harvested so much for my herb blends I make.

If I were to plant dill in an area that does not get mowed out in the pasture, do you think it will survive year to year without care?

I have been working with my daughter and grand daughter on food production. I have made some progress but not as much as I would have liked. I think dill may be something that they might like to grow.

I planted more garlic today, no way do I need it but it was such a pretty day I had to get out and do something. The ground it too wet to get down on hands and knees, so planted another row along the wood chip berm on the south edge of the garden. I also thinned some of the Daikon radishes, and tossed them in between the rows to make a mulch walkway, but I still have many to go.

I used to plant a short row of dill in the spring , especially if I was going to do some pickling.

I've had it volunteer in places the year or two after.

I don't know if a whole patch of it would volunteer, maybe in spots..

But then I till a lot.

Rick

I till twice a year. I've not found that bothers the dill. The plants put on a lot of seed and the wind will carry it out of the garden. I've got some coming up inside my winter cover now. Its hardy, but won't make it through the winter.

The rabbit that lives under my shed likes it. He keeps the seedlings cut down.

What I had in mind was to plant some out in the pasture (I have a spot ready now) that would be there for the kids. The land has already been signed over to my daughter, the house goes to Madge. My goal is to have Madge move close to her kids. Hopefully My daughter will buy this house and one plus acres from Madge, and Madge take the money from our home and our savings and move to NW AR/ NE OK. where she has 5 children. If our health keeps going like it is, we both may have to move there, but I expect to leave this world before Madge.

I found more garlic, so of course I have to go plant it, and make a wicking tub with onions and garlic to take to a couple of old maids that live about 10 miles north of me.

The 33 degree temp recorded on my back porch may have been a little warmer than what was in my garden, or maybe we had a light frost, but what ever it bit the sweet potatoes.

The dark green is the cold damage. The row behind the purple stake is the wood chip berm, which needs more wood chips added. I must have 100+ garlic planted along the right side of the berm. There is maybe as many as 50 walking onions on the far end. You will notice that I have some bare spots along the right side of the picture. I don't like bare spots, I plan to fill those in with grain rye, any growth will just be tilled in anyway.

The bunching onions and carrots still look good, but I don't have high hopes of the carrots producing before hard freezes, but maybe they will over winter. The bare spot to the right of the bunching onions is planned for the bulbing onions. The small area at the bottom right of the picture is a small bed I made for garlic, I have approx. 50 planted in it. The green spot you see at the top right of this picture is the end of my walking onion row, I have no idea how many walking onions I have.

NWS says mid 30's here next Tuesday, Wednesday, and Thursday night. That's our chance for a first freeze.

This is reminding me of 1998, when we did not have our first freeze till well into December. Maybe the second week of December.

But I don't recall that 98/99 winter being any milder than any other winter.

I remember around 1990 or 91 .It got down around 10 right around on Halloween. and that was the coldest it got all winter long. I don't think it even snowed that winter. Not all winters are alike .That's for sure.

Rick

Rick, I remember that cold Halloween, my youngest kids wanted to go trick or treating. We carried around a pump-up Coleman lantern to warm our hands with, a lot of people were driving their car around with the heaters going and the kids would jump out of the car, go hit a house or two, then back into the car.

It make me a believer in winterizing the house and vehicles...early in the fall instead of later.

That and a couple of bad snows(- 0 temps) a little earlier in the late 80's.

I remember one winter around 1989 or thereabouts , it's snowed in December about a foot and an Arctic front plunged down. It got around 0 to -3 degrees for a high for 2 or 3 days.

Nobody on my street could start their cars. (This was late 80's auto stuff or earlier. ) Just too cold . a few people tried rigged up those infrared heaters to hang around the manifolds to warm up for the gas to fire. The only people that could drive were those with heated garages.

Rick

Well I probably jumped the gun since the weather guessersguessers originally said it was going to be in the 20's next weekweek. I picked the green tomatoes before they got frost bit. I don't know what we'll do with them all. Personally I don't think they have any flavor if they are picked green and allowed to turn red. We already made a bunch of green tomato relish from the last picking.

I need to get back to working on the wood pile. I've got a bunch of deadwood blocks to split.

I knew a fella years ago who used firewood to heat his house. He said he got two " warmings " from it, once when he cut it and split it, and another when he burned it.

That's a good looking wood pile. Smoking meats on my offset stickburner, I'm always sourcing wood. Oak and hickory, but mostly pecan.

Probably way off topic, but I know HJ lives near where the proposed new turnpike is going east of Norman. I'm curious how that fight is going. I see it in the media, but don't trust the media.

Mrs Dollar and I drove the new Kickapoo turnpike yesterday. We went to Wellston to eat at the Butcher BBQ Stand ( it was excellent, btw ) and we took the Kickapoo that connects I-40 and Turner turnpike, just east of Harrah.

It was fantastic. 80 mph speed limit and of course, that means I pushed it to 85 and 90. Hardly any traffic at all. Low stress drive where I did not feel like I defied death when I reached my destination.

It meant I did not have to take I-35 through downtown OKC and fight heavy traffic all the way to Edmond to get on the Turner Turnpike. What a difference it made.

This new turnpike will extend the Kickapoo south, from I-40 to connect to I-35 near Purcell.

I get people not wanting to move and start over. At 72 yo, moving would be tough for me. I don't have the energy for it. It just seems like a daunting overwhelming task. I don't want to leave my garden soil I've worked on for years.

But they will be paid well for their property. What I know from that process, they will come out ahead over if they put it up for sale themselves. They won't lose any money.

So there must be some other forces working to block this needed route ?

I see from reading our state daily rag, The Oklahoman, now owned by USA Today, that their writer who covers all the downtown development, Steve Lackymeyer , seems to be heavily biased against this turnpike. He carries water for downtown real estate developers and businesses. And I got to wonder if downtowners are worried about losing traffic on I-35 ?

Frankly, anyone traveling from Tulsa to Dallas or vice versa, would be way ahead to pay the toll and take this bypass.

And it would take a lot of traffic off I-35 to make life better for the rest of us.

Also , I had to drive a small portion of the trip on the Turner Turnpike. And the first thing that stands out, is the amount of 18 wheeler truck traffic, wow .... it was like every other vehicle was a big truck. Its not like it used to be.

I was a mother in the back of a van that cold Halloween. Memories.

There was discussion about loss of habitat for maybe endangered species in that turnpike route near Jennifer. But I have seen nothing recently, don't get much OKC news here.

The winter I remember was maybe 2015/2016? I had kale and collards planted in a bed that grew all winter. The collards bolted in spring and I ate the buds like broccoli. I got more food out of that collard plant, (maybe there were 2) than anything I've ever grown. I'd cut some buds and it would make more. I think I pulled my best carrot crop ever in January 2016 as well.

I planted some seed today. I had coriander in the pantry so since I had so much, I planted half of that and we will see if I get anything out of that. I also planted lettuce, beets, and radishes. I made cages for my pots. I thought my dog was digging to get the frogs, but she is actually digging my pots up to bury her bones, so why are cages and some PVC pipe to hold them in place? I think we’ll deter her enough. There’s a neighbors dog that comes down to tear up all of our trash and just is wreaking havoc in this neighborhood. And I may have to put up another fence to keep him out of my yard. His family doesn’t try to prevent him from coming down here so I’ll have to take matters into my own hands. I think I’m gonna pull my watermelon tomorrow. It’s not full size, but I’m mostly want the seeds to be mature. And I don’t believe it’s gonna really grow anymore. I have to spend a day or two harvesting Roselle and processing immediately. Since I lost my job I have days to do all my projects. My next Market I’m going to do is the 23rd so I need to be very busy this next week.

I don't have any dogs tearing things, but maybe I should have some to kill all the cats that are pooping in the garden, and dig out the gophers that are eating my garlic and the roots of everything else.

Kim, Madge and I were out to lunch and she said that she got a text from you, she said that she could not read all of it, and had not been able to get back to you, but she thinks that you want this recipe.

If this not what you want, or you cant see this, contact me,or her and we will try again. I am sorry but Madge and I both are as dumb as a rock when it comes to using this modern stuff.

We got outside fairly early and started on projects. It's our first day at home for awhile. While Tom changed the oil in my car, I added woodchips to the native bed behind the shop. Tried to clean up the hoop house a bit. It's a useful thing, but not the pretty thing I had hoped it would be. Too much junk gets stored in there....and not the pretty terracotta pots, cute gardening tools, etc.

I did get all my "expensive" pots and trays brought inside and washed up so they're ready for next year. Normally I'll clean them between spring/summer/fall seed starting.

We took out the auto chicken waterers and decided to toss them. We'll make new ones next summer. They're great for when we travel and neighbors care for the animals. They were pretty crusty after two summers of use.

I also sorted through my seeds. I want for them to all fit into one container. I don't know what to do with the ones I'm giving away. Any ideas?

About the turnpike....well, there's many reasons why people don't want it. People are paid for their properties, that is true. But, for most, they're not paid enough for what it's worth to them.

Things they've added like trees and landscaping. Not to mention people who garden and have spent years amending their soils. Remodels. Additional structures like shops and coops.

Some people are on land that's been in their family for years.

Also, finding something comparable to what one already has, isn't easy. I can guess what they would offer me. After paying the bank for the remainder of what we owe, finding a property that is similar would be difficult. Especially if we didn't want to go into debt above what we already have. AND with the interest rates higher....

There's a couple of properties that I've looked at that would leave us with about the same amount of debt, but those properties are fixer-uppers. I've already fixed up this house and put over $100,000 into remodels, shops, etc. Plus all the back-breaking work on the portions that we DIY'd. We basically gutted the main living areas of this house and added to our utility room. We had the money to do that, but that money is gone now into this house.

I don't know that we have it in us to fix up another house to that extent.

Luckily, for us, our house won't be taken (probably). But, there's others like us who will. They'll never get back everything they've put into their properties, and it will be hard for them to find something similar.

Another aspect of it all, is the people like us. We will have a turnpike in our backyard practically. For some, that's not a big deal, but the people who moved out here, don't want that.

I know all about the traffic on I35. It takes me an hour to get to my daughter in Edmond. That is from Indian Hills and Sooner Rd to Covell and Kelly. It's a nightmare. I drive it every Tuesday to babysit my grandson.

So, the Kickapoo ends basically at my friends' property. When the begin constructing the new one (It's called the East West Connector), it would cut directly through her property and go south but take a curve to Indian Hills. That part of the TP will run along IH. There were several access points, but after the City of Norman said they didn't want to maintain those points, the OTA dropped them. However, Sooner Rd is maintained by the state, so that will continue to be an exit.

My friends' section and our section of the East West Connector is in active design right now.

Lynn, the part that reaches down to Purcell (it's called the south extension, I think) is not in active design. There's a lot of stuff they're having to work around including tribal lands, the lake, aquifer, and many environmental factors.

Some people are worried that the TPs will cause traffic to bypass the cities. I guess like Route 66 when the highways were built. Honestly, I haven't heard much about that aspect of it. I'm on FB groups but sorta get lost with all the political talk on there. These are mostly Norman people who are very unhappy with what Norman leaders are allowing. Other than that sorta talk, it's mostly concerns about the impact building this thing will have on water and other environmental things.

Builders have already bought up land all around where it will go so they can build homes and commercial things all around it. Will our water be messed up? How much wildlife will be affected.

Lots of concerns and lots of research.

Larry, that is exactly it. Tell Madge thank you so so much. The original recipe she gave me only had the ingredients and directions for the crust and then some directions for what to do with the filling but no actual ingredient measurements. This is perfect thank you

I feel sorry for most of the people that are affected by ( progress ) as it comes through our area, some will make a lot of money, in my opinion most will have to deal with heartache.

I live in the area where I grew up. Almost everything has changed for the better, and I would not like it to go back as it was, but I miss the old times, and ways. I am unhappy about all the traffic, but I like the better roads.

I would hate to move anywhere. I live in an old mobile home, buts its HOME, and I have too much junk to haul to another location, and I don't have the strength or money to move it. I am hoping to the cemetery is my next move, and I am not taking anything with me.

I took a wicking tub over to a couple of old women today, along with a purple sweet potato plant, bunching onions, walking onions, garlic, and a few carrot plants. I got all of that stuff planted for them, then got stuck in their yard. I call my neighbor to come and pull me out. When the lawn dries up some I will haul some soil over and repair their lawn.

Goodness Jennifer y’all were busy. That “progress” is always so hard on lots of folks. I would be so upset but that wouldn’t help anything I guess.

Turnpike Authority built the Kirkpatrick. Then extended it west just past Council Road. Turned it south and went just to the west of Lake Overholser, then on south of I-40 to join Airport Road.

The plan is to extend it further south and eventually turn back to I-35.

And they built the Kickapoo.

So there could be complete loop around the metro and take traffic off of I-35 and portions of I-40.

And in doing all this, we did not hear all the political controversy that's coming out of Norman. People along the routes faced the same issues. There were no environmental issues, tribal issues, or whatever.

It seems nothing can happen or be planned in or around Norman, without political turmoil. Its just the order of the day for Norman.

Mrs Dollar is now retired, but for a lot of years she had to drive I-35 to work. We don't have a direct dog in that fight any more, but hundreds of thousands other people have to drive it to commute.

But hey, Norman.

Lynn, the turnpike will come through. Back in 2022 it was a 9 year plan. We are at 2 years and a half. No worries. It's coming. People will lose their properties to make life better for others.

Hopefully those others won't take it for granted.

There were protests when the Kickapoo was built. It just wasn't as loud. My friend that I mentioned was involved in that. It stops right at her property. And will cut through it and she'll need to find another place to live and hopefully can find something that won't require her children to move schools.

There are problems with Norman because it wasn't originally made to be the 3rd largest city in the state. There's flooding issues, water issues and all sorts of stuff.

There has been property taken in Norman way back when they built the lake. People lost their farmlands and stuff.

But there wasn't the internet and you couldn't see people being sad about it.

Kim, we were so busy. But it was a great day to get things done. I need to do a bit more this afternoon after work.

I think there's little chance I'd ever drive the planned turnpike that's creating the controversy. I may not even be alive to see it completed.

But we've got traffic congestion all around us. I-44 just to the west has heavy traffic all hours of the day. We drive that to go north and its not a relaxing trip. The gal that cuts my hair on the north side and lives in Newcastle, won't drive it any more. She takes Portland to and from work. Its a race track.

And then I-44 going south of here is handling a lot of traffic. The Newcastle to Blanchard area is growing. I avoid it.

I don't even get on I-240 unless I'm pressed for time and just can't avoid it.

There's an east / west arm of this planned Norman turnpike that may change traffic patterns around here. IDK, I'm not a traffic engineer. But there will be an interchange at I-44 and SW 119th. That's gonna present options.

But I don't think I need to be a traffic engineer to know something is needed. Its only getting worse.

I feel sorry for you that are in the highway construction zones, but I would bet my bottom dollar that the constructions is needed. I haven't driven an eighteen wheeler in 22 years, and I don't remember any major city that was really up to date on the needed construction. I think that the U. S. is behind many countries when it comes to moving people freight.

I can remember what a blessing 344 and 240 was in Oklahoma City. If any of you are unhappy with the traffic around OKC, you should try visiting some of the other major cities, you will come back with a different point of view. I am not trying to down play your problem, just trying to point out that we still live in a pretty good part of the country. I will add, that after I climbed out of that truck cab, I don't even like sitting in the drivers seat. I try not to drive any further than 1/4 mile from my back door, and then I sit in a tractor seat, or my RTV. I saw so many accidents that I am uneasy even getting out on the highway, and the accidents can happen anywhere in the blinking of an eye.

I guess, this being a gardening forum, that maybe I should say, my garden is wet, we got rain last night, and more rain and cool weather heading our way, but this to will pass, pass into what, I have no idea, but there is always change.