Decades ago on Rec.Garden. Roses the same question was asked. Everybody who had tried them had gotten plants easily. Some were good, some were worth saving and sharing and some were learning experiences.

When I think of "the Gift" I think of it being called a polyantha. And everytime I've talked about that rose with other rose folks, every last one of us say "the gift" and follow it with a chuckle. It is simply too large to be thought of as a poly. Everybody remembers their surprise at this mannerly little very healthy rose that grew and grew and grew. (Sort of like Red Cascade.)

@stillanntn6b wrote: Everybody remembers their surprise at this mannerly little very healthy rose that grew and grew and grew. (Sort of like Red Cascade.)

EXCEPT here, Red Cascade is ultra healthy while The Gift never met a mildew spore it didn't adore. It's not a poly, but definitely a "dwarf" (term used LOOSELY) multiflora.

I've never grown The Gift. But I bought a packet of the Angel Wings seeds. It will be fun to see what I get.

The potential size of R. multiflora. Back when I first started my Rose Rosette crusade (that's how I think of it now, having read a number of books about the European Crusades), one of the first scientific papers was about RRD in the park Clifty Falls in southern Indiana on and above the Ohio River. There R multiflora had grown to the size of haystacks (as in nursery rhymes from the 1800's, )

How did a weed do so well in the short period of time since the land had been bought from the farmers to give more space to where the water falls were? The fields had grown alfalfa for years. Just as we make a soup of alfalfa as a growth stimulant, nature did the same thing. RRD took some of the mass of the R. multifloras; the huge deer population (which was "culled") also ate a lot of multiflora. When we were there, there were still R. multiflora with RRD, and the hypergrowth of the RRD infected roses were eaten by the deer.

Yes, I know what deer browse marks are left on roses. The local deer herds know my roses all too well.

Ok. Now I see that these are considered seeds of dwarf multiflora instead of chinensis. Given that multiflora is considered invasive, should I be growing these?

@bellegallica9a it's only invasive if allowed to seed and/or layer itself all over. Control the seed production (dead head every flower) and don't allow it to layer itself and there is no "invasive" issue. If you are comfortable you can accomplish that, you're good.

Those were my thoughts, too. Thank you for confirming, Roseseek.

@Belle Gallica you're welcome. It almost seems like my old interest in trying Kudzu in the mid desert. Down south, it can be invasive, but they get RAIN with real four seasons, often with high humidity. Where I wanted to try it, there was HEAT with freezes and little water so it shouldn't have been able to become an issue. I didn't get the chance.

I ran across this from an Australian rose post on Facebook.

https://helpmefind.com/rose/l.php?l=2.68726 Rose Marsh's Seedling Fairy Rose

A rose grown from a packet of rose seeds bought from the supermarket. Mrs. Rose Marsh is the founder of the Western Australian region of Heritage Roses in Australia Inc. A seedling of Rose multiflora "nana".

Kudzu! Kim, I haven't read that word in ages. As I drove across the South into Alabama, the second huge trip I'd made there in three years, I noticed for the first time this vine that was covering literally everything. What was this stuff? So later I asked my father in law, and he laughed and said "kudzu". That was 1985, and it was the first time I'd heard that odd word. I thought he was joking. Unfortunately, not. And why haven't you grown a little kudzu in Southern California? Just curious. Diane

Because the person who was to send it to me, Diane, decided it might not have been a good idea and chickened out. Thankfully, GOATS LOVE kudzu!

So are they using goats in Alabama to control kudzu? We had some goats here, hired to eat invasive weeds. Sagebrush is a native, but the goats loved it. In the end, the goats were a bust because some boys entrusted to take care of a few dogs while their owners vacationed, let the dogs out. And the dogs and goats' guard dog knocked down the temporary fencing. Luckily the massive guard dog kept his goats together, and some boys got in big trouble. Diane

2016 The great goat disaster was a few days away.....

That was 2015, actually. Diane

I remember an article in some publication telling the story of a Southern Baptist minister who discovered Angora Goats loved the stuff and he'd started a mohair industry in Alabama with his kudzu eating Angora Goats. Whatever happened to it, I have no idea but I thought the idea of someone discovering it was possible to turn President Roosevelt's misguided environmental experiment into mohair was delightfully whimsical. Honestly, what deliberate release of anything invasive and non native has ever really worked out WELL?