I finally found this page after lots of searches at usps. To my interpretation of what it says, bubble mailers do count as letters/flats if thin enough and are only subject to the .17 non-machinable rate (why else would they need the .17 cents still if all non-machinables were all parcels). This quote sounds like an exact description of a bubble mailer to me..."Items mailed in large envelopes cannot cause more than a 1/4-inch variance in thickness, to within 1 inch of the edges of the envelope. The outer edges of the mailpiece (up to 1 inch) are not considered when measuring variance in thickness." Here are a few more excerpts and link(note last one about securing small things like she mentioned earlier...) "Are items sent at First-Class Mail flats rates (large envelopes) required to be flexible and "uniformly thick"? --Yes. Large envelopes must be flexible (cannot be rigid) and uniformly thick. Items mailed in large envelopes cannot cause more than a 1/4-inch variance in thickness, to within 1 inch of the edges of the envelope. The outer edges of the mailpiece (up to 1 inch) are not considered when measuring variance in thickness. Also, envelopes must be rectangular-in-shape and the maximum thickness (at the thickest point) is 3/4-inch. A large envelope that exceeds any maximum physical dimension (length, height, or thickness) is classified and priced as a package (parcel). Bulky items placed in padded mailing bags generally will not qualify as a large envelope." "Is there still a nonmachinable surcharge for First-Class Mail? Yes. The nonmachinable surcharge applies to all First-Class Mail single-piece and presort-rate letters (up to the 3.5 ounce maximum weight), and is 17 cents." "Are large envelopes (flats) subject to a nonmachinable surcharge? No, since large envelopes now have their own price structure (flats prices); the nonmachinable surcharge will not apply." "What is the definition of "uniform thickness" for flats? If a flat is not uniformly thick, would it have to be mailed as a parcel, or NFM? All flats must be uniformly thick so that any bumps, protrusions, or other irregularities do not cause more than 1/4-inch variance in thickness. The outer edges of the mailpiece (up to 1 inch) would not be considered when measuring variance in thickness. Also, if the contents are significantly smaller than the envelope, wrapper, or sleeve, they must be secured to prevent shifting of more than 2 inches within the mailpiece. Flat-size pieces not meeting the uniform thickness standard must be mailed as either Not Flat-Machinable pieces or as parcels." What do ya think??? This quote is the hard one..."Bulky items placed in padded mailing bags generally will not qualify as a large envelope." I think the key is "Generally will not" not "WILL not" Here is a link that might be useful: usps ratecase faqs

I'm sure there will be some strong opinions on this...as there has been in the past. I myself see no need to have to use bubble envelopes, but use them because so many it seems 'require', and/or expect you to use them, because they do. Send a bubble...receive a bubble. Personally, I have received many seeds in the past that were not in bubbles that arrived alive. Tomatoes (typically send by 'just' tomato sharers), are often not padded at all, and are just fine. I have received Trudi's kind offer b4, and what she uses 'I think' is the foam for padding. I find it here and there...sometimes in things I buy and sometimes from friends or at the recycling place. A little dab will do ya. In order for it to be a regular 41cent letter, it has to be less than 1/4 inch thick...so it has to be wrapped with care to not go over. My PO has a template, and if the envy does not fit through it, it goes as a 'Large Envelope (Flat) at 80 cents for the first ounce. I imagine it could be quite possible that if one sent it as 'regular 41cent postage and it was over 1/4" on thickness , that once it arrived, there would be postage due. In fact, I had that happen last winter b4 the big rate change. Good judgement and packing according to the PO guideline measurements is important that the receiver won't have to end up owing once it is received. Just to make a short story long....I think non bubble trades are fine, but I think it might be wise to post it in a thread offer, and/or on one's page, and/or seed trade list. Sue

Michelle, Please don't get disheartened. You and I are at a very different level from some of the folks here. Just learning to air layer was a huge accomplishment from me (I'll see if I can find a good online guide for you because it's fun once you get the hang of it and often works for plants that everyone says are easy to propogate, but don't just start growing roots in soil or water, which to newbie me is the easy way.) There are truly some very generous people here on the forum, and there are a few prickly types, you'll begin to recognize them. And then there are some who might just be having a bad day, gosh knows I've had some bad days. A Tropical Storm is bound to cause one. When it comes to the folks like Bihai, they're in a different league from you and me and it's sad that people have tried to take advantage of their expertise and generosity. That would leave a bad taste in my mouth too. But don't worry. As long as you don't do that, no one will be mean. Honestly, I don't see any reason Bihai needs defense. What she says makes perfect sense to me, and certainly didn't come off as prickly, or unkind. Just a different experience with trading from someone who has a lot more experience gardening and trading than I do. And if you and I weren't in such completely different climates, and miles and miles from each other, I'd love to trade with you. Do NOT be embarassed by your trade post. I doubt too many people are posting trades to show off what they can propogate, or are looking at other's trade posts and snickering at the amateurishness of them. If they're snickering at me, well, I hope they enjoyed that moment feeling superior. I've learned to do many things in my life, speak other languages, find common ground with people from wildly different backgrounds, find my way around war zones without getting killed, raise tomatoes, not kill gardenias. Each was challenging and in each endeavor, I found people who felt superior. The trick is to not let those people get to you because some of them aren't superior and I've understood things in a foreign language that they missed, found people who would tell me their story when they wouldn't tell the superior types, even gotten behind rebel lines before them and beaten them on news stories. I haven't grown better tomatoes yet, but someday maybe I will. Hopefully someday I'll coax the gardenia into blooming again. And I've already traded with several other newbies here, and I've sent seeds to people just because they wanted them and I had a lot of that particular thing. Others have done the same for me. Please, really, don't get disheartened. It's nice here. Susannah Here is a link that might be useful: air layering guide

I am probably closer to zeedman in my seed collecting activities. Collection & Drying? -- I like to use brown paper bags, like grocery bags and lunch sacks, and I love the idea of hanging them. I have a plastic chest of drawers and a couple of nice sized screw/nail/small-tool-keeper thingys that I found at WalMart for storing my seeds. I use manilla envelopes of various sizes to store all of them. This way, it is easier to keep them in an orderly fashion, and I need all the help I can get. I use the big 9" x 12" manilla envelopes for large storage, and the 6" x 9" for smaller amounts. Very tiny seeds are stored in packets that I make from freezer paper, with the waxed side out. For trading, I use coin envelopes, which come in 3 sizes. The small ones are ideal for sharing cleaned seeds, and the 3 1/2" x 6 1/2" envelopes I use for trading seeds like hyacinth beans or sweet peas. I like to leave them in the pod if possible, as they seem to keep better. Because it is soooo humid here, I don't like to use plastic bags at all. I use bubble mailers as a rule, and I recycle all of them as well, but I keep every little box I can get my hands on for mailing too. I mail out a lot of plants, and the boxes really come in handy. I remove any tape, lay them flat, and store them under my bed. Don't tell anybody. LOL I do store some seed in the refridgerator in the shop, but DH does not like for me to do that. It takes up room that could/would otherwise be used for the storage of Lite Beer from Miller. In late summer and fall, however, bulbs dominate that fridge. He does grumble, but he does like the bulbs when they bloom too. Janie