I wasn't sure from reading your post, but have you considered cabinets instead of shelving above the DW. I think it would increase your storage capacity and be more flexible as far as what you can store.

I have considered having 30 inch cabinets on that wall, and then under them having the Kungsfors grid and dish rack that I want. It's hard for me to get a idea of what that would feel like like, because the Ikea cabinets are a little deeper than the 12 inch cabinets that I have now. You're right that that setup would store more.

Can you post the 2D floor plan with measurements?

Hi cpartist. You were one of the ones who helped me the first time around.

I hope this is understandable... you have to click to enlarge it enough to see the numbers.

Hi cs. Can you possibly switch the stove to the fridge wall?

I've considered that -- this is a rendering of what that could look like (I know that the individual cabinet setup could be changed a little bit, but it gave me a way to picture it. Those are two 15 inch cabs flanking the range in this rendering.)

Long story short, I just didn't like the way that looked and it seemed like a lot of trouble for not much net gain. When I come into my kitchen I often drop mail etc on that cabinet that is currently next to the fridge, but now I'd be dropping it next to a range and that doesn't seem like a good idea. I'd have to either run a new gas line or switch to induction, and I'd like to wait for the tax incentives to be in place before I switch to electric. I'd have to figure out a way to vent on an interior wall instead of venting right out through an exterior wall.

It does put the fridge in a pretty good spot, but then II wouldn't be able to open one door fully.

None of this is impossible to overcome, but mostly it comes back to me just not liking it.

I agree you should switch the fridge and range. Consider a 24" counter-depth fridge (we have one from F&P) so you can put a full-height 12" pull-out pantry on the left.

If you switch to induction, you only need to upgrade the electrical in that area and not move the gas line. And your worries about dropping mail next to the stove wouldn't be an issue. Do you do a lot of cooking? If not, you could also switch to a 24" range. AJMadison carries smaller sizes.

And I would not drop to a 24" sink cabinet. You won't be able to put any larger pots and pans in there.

Okay, I'll take a fridge/range switch under advisement. :-)

If anyone has thoughts on the other questions I asked I'd appreciate it! I'm not sure about the concern with pots and pans in the sink cabinet? I don't store pots and pans in there now, just various cleaning supplies and garbage bags.

Re the sink cabinet, I meant you won't be able to put pots and pans in the SINK. It will be very small with a 24" cabinet.

Can the microwave go in the pantry? I my house it would not get such valuable real estate as your tiny kitchen.

Oof! I'm sorry BPMBA, I was just stuck on the word "cabinet!" I follow you now.

My current sink is 21 inches wide by 16 inches front-to-back (the bowl interior.) And it is like 6-7 inches deep. I hate how shallow it is.

The largest D-shaped sink I can find that fits in a 24-inch sink cabinet has bowl interior dimensions of 21x19x9. ( (I'd have to off-set the faucet.) I will love that extra depth, and I already know the width and front-to-back dimensions are manageable, since that's what I have now. It fits my regular pots and pans easily. (My largest bowls and cutting boards I try to clean and put away quickly)

https://www.nantucketsinksusa.com/product-page/ns09i-16

I would love to have a larger sink, it would feel very luxurious. But I'm not sure I want to trade counterspace, and more importantly the corresponding drawer storage space, for it. I'd love to hear from someone with a similarly small kitchen to find out how they balanced those competing goals.

Re Microwave in the pantry -- it's posslble. I'd have to think about where to put the food that is there now (but that food COULD go to that wall cabinet.) That said, tucking it away would also be a slight pain because I do use it every day, sometimes multiple times a day. So giving it valuable real estate makes sense based on frequency of use.

I could just also put it on the counter on the sink side, either all the way to the left (might not quite fit) or all the way to the right. I was trying to avoid having too much stuff on the counter as I do now, but there might not be a good way to avoid that.

This is a before-and-after of my pantry -- it's very deep and awkward and has a sloping floor because there's a stair case on the other side. It was an absolute mess, but I recently installed Elfa components. To put the microwave in there would mean removing at least one of those drawers and replacing it with a shelving. (and adding an outlet.)

I wouldn't switch the fridge and the range. I'd rather have one skinny drawer base and two wide drawer bases, than three skinny drawer bases. I would opt to put the garbage in the pantry if possible. That's where I put my garbage in my small kitchen and it is perfectly find there. I use a scrap bowl when prepping. Sometimes I pull the can out into the kitchen when needed. I'd keep the 30" sink.

I understand your concerns about the 15" deep cabinet above the sink. In that case, I would put shelving above the sink. The other thing you could do is to build out the lower cabinets on that wall to add a couple inches depth. That would give you more countertop real estate and there wouldn't be any worries about hitting your head on the deeper cabinet above. The depth of the range will be an issue, so you might consider a slide-in with countertop behind it.

I like your idea for the MW.

Kohlers 24” Prolific sink is great for a kitchen such as yours. Deep bowl and a cutting board that fits over it when more prep space is needed.

And a garbage can on wheels is also a good idea - wheel it over to the sink area when prepping and store in the pantry

And I like Theresa’s suggestion to add overhead cabinets on the right - and I like the way it’s shown so the section directly over the sink is higher up.

Much better with it switched. It gives you more prep space next to the sink.

Get a 24" fridge and leave the needed room on the left of the fridge to open it fully.

And get an 18" wide dishwasher.

When I come into my kitchen I often drop mail etc on that cabinet that is currently next to the fridge, but now I'd be dropping it next to a range and that doesn't seem like a good idea.

If you do as someone said and get an induction stove, that won't be an issue. Or better still get a little wall pocket to stick mail into. Or a mirror with a shelf below it to put the mail on.

I'd have to either run a new gas line or switch to induction, and I'd like to wait for the tax incentives to be in place before I switch to electric.

Forget waiting. I was a gas lover UNTIL I started with induction. Now you wouldn't get me to go back to gas. So much cleaner, easier and efficient.

I'd have to figure out a way to vent on an interior wall instead of venting right out through an exterior wall.

Is this a house or an apartment? If a house, 1 story or 2?

None of this is impossible to overcome, but mostly it comes back to me just not liking it.

Do you not like it because you truly don't like it or because you're used to it the way it is now?

Re Microwave in the pantry -- it's posslble.

Or put a shelf under the upper cabinet for a small microwave.

Although it's not quite the same thing, I have seen a number of designs lately in which the upper cabinets are higher with a single open shelf (or hanging mugs, etc) underneath. So I think the cabinets + kungsfors could be a happy solution.

Mainly I'm just chiming in to say your pantry looks AWESOME and a great way to use a weird little space.

In the end you have to do what works for you. :)

I'd rather have the shelves on the wall by the refrigerator than lose storage space by my dishwasher. I would swap those (shelves by frig, wall cabinet by dishwasher)

I, too, have a tiny kitchen and tight budget, and had to make hard choices like you are doing. In the end I decided to do without a microwave. I realized I mainly used it to reheat coffee and defrost chicken breasts and decided those things weren't worth the precious real estate. I rarely miss it. It's worth asking yourself if you really need a microwave or if it's just a convenience you can live without. They do take up a lot of space. Good luck with your project.

Yes, I agree with you and Theresa; I'm going to see if there's a way to restore the cabinets on that wall. I'm torn between wanting the open, airy feeling of open shelving and the basic need to have a place to store all my junk! For a person with a small kitchen I have accumulated waaay too much. This renovation is going to involve some paring down, for sure.

Einportlandor, I hear you. All my friends right now seem to be raving about their air fryers and I want one too and then I think, where the heck am I going to put an air fryer in here? I already have way too much room being taken up by my Instant Pot (though I do use it fairly often) and my Kitchen Aid stand mixer (which I use once or twice a year, if that.)

But my microwave genuinely gets a workout. I work from home, I have a 11 year old, and I'm constantly using it to warm or reheat meals, melt butter, defrost [whatever], and so on. It's also a little safer for my kid right now to use than the range. When my over the range MW died, I missed it a LOT.

That said, there's absolutely some stuff in here that needs to go! For example I have two stick blenders...why???

Suggestions from a low-volume cook:

1. Retain the original design with the range and sink along the same wall. (Having the range and prep/sink on opposite sides is a pain -- I have it.)
2. Replace the open shelves with cabinets. Open shelves in a kitchen get dirty fast.
3. At 30", the workspace between the range and sink is short. Consider swapping the sink and dishwasher to expand the workspace by two feet.
4. If the dishwasher is next to the wall, be sure to allow adequate space to its right. As I read them, Whirlpool dishwashers, for example, need 1-3/4".
5. Install a rectangular (to maximize the surface area), undermount sink so you can shove stuff from the countertop into the sink. If you move the sink to the right AND SHRINK THE SINK CABINET TO 24", resize the sink to 20" to allow 2" between the sink bowl and the wall.
6. Install a slide-in range instead of a freestanding model so the controls will be on the front.
7. Consider a slim (10-1/4" high) microwave (e.g., Whirlpool WML55011HS) over the range. Not only does the place the microwave in a convenient location, slim microwaves are deep (18") so they cover much of the cooktop.
8. Check installation instructions for allowable locations of the range, dishwasher, and OTR electrical outlets.

cs929 - If you use the microwave then keep it for sure. Maybe consider another over-the-range model even though they aren't ideal. I don't have a stand mixer, a blender, an air fryer, or any other appliance that takes up space. I get by with a hand mixer and an immersion blender that get stored in one of my large pots. I also gave up a garbage disposal so I could have space under the sink for a small garbage bin. When space is tight every single item has to compete with every other item for space. You're on the right track . . . focus on function and you'll love your kitchen when it's done. Luck!

re: single-function appliances. I am keeping the OTR micro in my renovation. The kitchen is tres petite and I didn't feel it made sense to give up any other space (countertop or cabinetry) to it. We also don't need powerful venting.

My in laws just got a new range that has a air fry setting, I think it is basically convection + a special kind of tray. They rave about it.

I am definitely guilty of buying things I think I'll love to use and then... pasta roller, anybody?

It's funny...when I first posted about my ideas for a kitchen renovation 6 years ago, everyone was like "get real ventilation, OTR microwaves are the devil," haha. And now this recommendation to get another one!

I'm torn. I would love to have better ventilation, I hate it when I'm cooking and the whole house smells like bacon or stale onions or whatever for a little while. That said, everyone is right that there are limited places to put it. At first I didn't like it above the range because of my kiddo but soon he'll be taller than me so that won't be an issue....

Anyway. I will think about this some more. This reno sometimes feels like trying to get six pounds of "I wants" and "I needs" into a five pound sack.

"I would love to have better ventilation"

Most slim OTR microwave ovens such as the GE Profile UVM9125STSS offer only 400 cfm ventilation. However the Samsung ME11A7710DS claims 550 cfm and is deeper at 19-1/8" so it covers more of the cooktop. Specs show it can be ducted from the top or rear* so you wouldn't necessarily have to give up space in the cabinet above for ducts. Unfortunately, Samsung microwaves aren't known for their reliability; the Whirlpool WML55011HS might be a better choice.

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*most ovens allow this

It's funny...when I first posted about my ideas for a kitchen renovation 6 years ago, everyone was like "get real ventilation, OTR microwaves are the devil," haha. And now this recommendation to get another one!

I'm still of the mind to get real ventilation after suffering with the over the range MW in our rentals. I can't begin to tell you about the grease I had to continually clean. YUCK!

Get a small MW that will sit on a shelf below your upper cabinet.

At first I didn't like it above the range because of my kiddo but soon he'll be taller than me so that won't be an issue....

If gas, I'd definitely forego the above the range one but if induction and you don't like the idea of it under a cabinet, then I'd consider it, especially the one that WD is suggesting which can be vented out.

Can you take a few photos of the space as is now? Maybe there's an area we haven't thought of that could have a MW?

It's a little messy right now and I'm embarrassed. 😬 But, since this is IKEA and I'm not getting an expensive door, I think what I'll just do is go ahead with my plans to put 20-inch doors on that fridge wall cabinet, and buy 40 inch doors to hold onto in case I change my mind. Swapping them out should be easy enough if a much better microwave location occurs to me.