I used the least amount of electricity possible yesterday. Lowered the house temp, half the lights I usually use,etc. I'll try to keep it up, except lower house temps. Kiddo didn't take their heavy coat on their trip, and the hotel shuttle never came, so they waited in 20 degree temps for awhile in a jacket, the plane that sat on the tarmac all night is freezing... gotta warm up my baby

May everyone stay electrified!!!!

Rob333, get a portable generator as soon as possible, be prepared for the next storm. In a nearby area there are still more than 30,000 families without power, hope they all have generators.

Oh yeah, this has tipped us past the point of needing a generator, since this is likely to be an ongoing thing. In 2018 we had almost a week of single-digit lows with highs that never got above freezing and there were never any issues. But with so many more people here and new construction that mostly uses heat pumps which switch to all electric heat in the super cold, they put more strain on the grid.

MIL’s power was out for 4 hours yesterday, and she is home sick with COVID.

We had some power outage overnight, but at least we’ve been able to make coffee and breakfast. Merry Christmas, Everyone.

It just ASTOUNDS me that building-codes have been so "out of touch" for a 100 years!! Yes, cold weather further south is infrequent, but is DOES ( & will continue to ) happen!

Even if I was building in Texas.....I would have a basement, full insulation in 2x6" exterior walls, GAS heat if possible, no plumbing in exterior walls, & a VERY capable A/C Compressor ( placed in a shaded area!! ). Basically, I would build a ND-Code house ANYwhere in the U.S.!

Faron

Faron, all the things you mentioned are common in the South.

Depends on where a person is in the South as to how many of those things are common. It is still not unusual to see things like washers, dryers, and perhaps even a refrigerator in the carport or breezeway. Insulation would get you a funny look.

Basements are not super common. Some people have a walkout basement, but most homes are built with a crawspace or on a slab. But I am glad we have gas heat, but with no power it doesn't run. We are also one of the few houses in the neighborhood that do not have a fireplace, though I'm sure many had to be upgraded to code since the homes were built from late 1950's to late 1960's.

I was speaking in general with "the South" encompassing many states. We don't have a basement in FL but all of our houses prior to moving did, like the majority of our neighbors, family and friends.

One of our local weathermen posted this table, which is why we have a problem.

Wonder what the percentage is for those with a piggy back furnace, and where is the FL cut off line for furnaces not needed? Miami-Dade can get temps in the mid 30s. Low temps also have the falling lizards making the news rounds for central and south FL.

We just removed the eight plant covers and tarps from our tropicals. The four large leaves on the far right were expected to be lost, as the last tarp was not large enough to cover everything that needed it in this area and beyond. Not great loss, since the container (over underground pool pipes) is too close to the pavers so that the giant leaves take over the path. But I was hoping not to loose the entire plant. The same species on its left is planted in the ground. That one was completely covered and might be a total loss. Of course the Palmettos were not harmed at all, dang it.

We don't have basements in Texas. They've always seemed like an oddity to me because they simply aren't done here. We don't have a need to build like it's North Dakota.

https://www.texasmonthly.com/being-texan/texanist-dont-texas-houses-basements/#:~:text=In%20some%20parts%20of%20the,a%20basement%20difficult%20and%20costly.

Every friend of ours in the Miami/Keys areas have heat. I don’t know how available whole house AC is without it having a heat pump as part of the package.

My next door neighbor has a basement. One of very few in the Tampa area.

If you want to see some cool basements, check out VintageBasementBar on IG. I knew a lot of people in the northeast who had basement bars.

We don't have a need to build like it's North Dakota. ??? I never realized basements were for a certain area of the US. I've lived in the South all my life and basements are very common here in our area (TN). This is our third house and we have had a basement in each house. Our first basement even had windows. We love having a basement! It's warm in the winter and cool in the summer (well warmer/cooler than outside). Our pipes run through the basement; keeping us from worrying about frozen pipes. Things like our water heater, the air compressor, etc. are housed in the basement, giving us more space in the garage/workshop. Our basement offers us a great deal of storage (which is not always a good thing LOL). We store more there than our attic.

Faron said how he'd build in Texas, hence my comment. I certainly wasn't speaking to what is done in southern states such as Tennessee. Basements are not a common feature in Texas homes and the article I linked to explains in part why that is so. I'm sure they know how to build quality homes in TN, just as they do in TX, and I doubt codes are antiquated as Faron asserts.

How is a man supposed to get away from his family without a basement man cave?

I have a full basement (~2400 sq/ft) with half of it finished out into a cozy man cave for entertainment, watching sports, etc. The other half is my shop and storage area. I have a gardening area consisting of 24' of lighted shelves where I start around 100 seedlings every spring for myself and others.

We put in a ground source heat pump when we built the house 22 years ago that manages to keep the house comfy even in temperatures like we have had the last week. It is running about 3/4 of the time but we haven't ever needed to turn on the auxiliary heat coils. It's remarkably efficient even at its advanced age.

I have not met anyone in Texas so far with a basement. For one thing, in the flood prone areas near the coast, it would seem to be asking for trouble. We all like Faron and if I was his Texas neighbor I'd certainly speak up like Ida did and ask him to reevaluate his plans before planning a basement. I think part of his post though is just pointing out the value of a quality build that can stand up to the elements.

Sorry Ida. Didn't mean to take your comments out of context. Haven't been to the board in a while and haven't read this whole thread. I did go back to see his comments. You are right, codes are not as antiquated. We built the house we are in now. We did go above codes on our insulation, and it was well worth the expense. LoneJack, our heat pump sounds similar to yours. Our house is 25 years old and we had to replace our heat pump 2 years ago.

Beyond the usages that LoneJack mentioned even Texas has tornados. While some houses will have safe rooms they mostly became available as an add-on in the last ten or so years. Mine has the utilities furnace, gas inside turnoff, water turnoffs, and electrical box. Laundry facilities are down there. Once my trips are over am planning on having one or more large egress windows with popout covers done to hold some of my citrus and other hardy plants during the winter. Could also be used since the first will be on the north side to harden plants before planting in the ground.

I probably have PTSD from 15 years of my ex's family going on and on about how much "better" homes were built in Kansas and marveling all slack-jawed that we didn't have basements here. Truth is, they were used to what they were used to, and it took on a decided air of superiority which I found utterly stupid.

Homes are different around the country for a reason. As we look forward to building our next one on a mountain, I am learning the need to approach thinking with an open mind. I wouldn't build the same thing we have now in our future area, even though there are features we'll want to incorporate. The homes in the mountains are different, and for very good reason. They're built soundly, just differently.

Interesting discussion as I ponder buying a house in SC after living most of my life in MN. A few of the listings have walk out basements like we have always had in MN - very few. Most have a crawlspace and in the only photo I saw, it was dirt covered with plastic. In MN some homes have a crawlspace but anything built recently has a concrete crawlspace - like a basement just not high enough to walk around in. I can see why homes are considerably less expensive when you don't have a basement or finished crawl space.

When we were looking at lake cabins I would not even consider one with a dirt crawlspace. I'm still having a hard time considering that idea. I grew up in a house with one and it gave me the creeps. I also have a hard time wrapping my head around a furnace in the attic. Even if you build a house on a slab here, you have a utility room on the main floor. If you were running a furnace in your attic you'd have a serious ice dam problem in Minnesota.

Oklahoma has very few basements also. We have a lot of red (and brown in areas) dirt clay and with our water table-the moisture tends to make them extra musty. Also in the hot summers the wet clay dries out and causes cracks which isn't good for the basement walls here.

My BIL in Lexington, KY has a whole house basement with extra bedrooms, weight room and baths and office, and it always smells musty-but it rains a lot there. Just doesn't seem good to smell "must" if someone were to actually stay down there for long amounts of time.

Basements give me the the creeps too. I guess the unfinished ones, I should say.

Yeah, basements in MN can be musty too - even walkouts. We run dehumidifiers in both of our basements during the summer. We only run the AC when it's really hot and humid so we don't get the benefit of AC dehumidifying. In the winter there's no need for the dehumidfiers because it's so dry.

Some of the explanations in the Texas Monthly piece cited above seem bogus. There's little unique about either soil or weather conditions in Texas compared to what's found in other parts of the US.

In my area, slab construction is viewed as a cheap alternative. An inferior one, often seen in large new neighborhood housing developments built by one builder. Raised perimeter foundations, most typically of steel reinforced poured concrete and not concrete block, are what's considered the standard approach. Basements are rare and seen only in very old houses or in a few locations for new construction in areas where roof height and footprint (as a percentage of the lot size) are limited and lots are smallish, as a way to get a bit more space.

I've never lived in a house with a basement nor one built on a concrete slab.

Shallow bed rock is a very valid reason not to put in a basement. It is very expensive to excavate through bedrock. Hard pack clay is bad enough. When they excavated for my basement the operator had to scrape an inch or 2 off at a time.

I don't think locations with surface or near surface solid rock are often pursued as suitable building sites.

Clay soils are indeed problematic. Basements can certainly be engineered for Texas soils, but a cost analysis would prove this a rather pointless endeavor. There is often more land on which to build up and out, particularly in suburban communities, making an understory unnecessary.

Ida, are you suggesting that in areas where basements are common, houses built on large lots or indeed even with multi-acres don't have them? I don't think that's the case. I think as others have suggested, everything else being equal, houses either have or don't have basements based on regional practices more than for other reasons. And have or don't have cheaper slab construction for the same reason.

There are some places in MN where homes are built on a slab because the water table is too high for even a crawl space. Friends of ours recently built a new lake home on a slab for that reason, not because it was cheaper.

That is true 3katz, although I don't think we would ever build on a slab. We would more than likely look for another lot/land. When we built, we had maps which showed flood lines, etc. (although we are not in a flood zone, in fact we are up high). People need to look at these things before building or buying. We actually had previously found some land which we were a bit worried about due to the flood lines, worried enough that we passed on the purchase.

Basements are the norm where I live north of Chicago, unless you live near the Des Plaines River. We looked at the listing sheet for a nice 1960s center-entry colonial a few blocks away from the river, and part of the description read ”No basement to clutter up or flood”! Another house we almost looked at near the first had a lower level that was completely tiled. Big nope. A friend of mine who lives in that neighborhood said most houses there don’t have basements. And even my church near the river, which should follow the tradition of the Lutheran Church Basement, doesn’t have a basement.

But still, many houses have only partial basements, with crawl under a portion. and MCM houses built in the ’50s often don’t have basements.

That is not at all what I "suggested", Elmer.

I think it is, in your comment " There is often more land on which to build up and out, particularly in suburban communities, making an understory unnecessary. ".

I believe your comment is misleading. I think even where there is "more land", basements are built in regions where basements are a common feature of homes. And not where they're not.

Do you live in a region where basements are not common? Are they built in homes with small lots but not in homes with large lots, as you intimate?

OMG. You can be so effing tiresome. Will your wife not spar with you? Is that why you're constantly bringing it here?

Every home that I have lived in in Texas has had a slab foundation and an attic (or two). I have never personally known anyone with a basement in their home Texas. I have seen a few in very old buildings. We live on solid limestone, which is one reason that putting in a pool is so expensive here. I can‘t even imagine what would be involved in building a basement. Older homes here were built with pier and beam foundations. My inlaws’ home built in the 1940’s was pier and beam, and there was nothing colder than their floors in the winter.

Ida, I thought your comment seemed misinformed. Nothing more. Not sparing. I was trying to get you to explain what you were basing your comments on, it's your choice not to.

Texanjana, I suspect a home when built in the 40s was unlikely to have had underfloor insulation and was probably also poorly sealed if at all. Perhaps not even wall insulation. Such features can be done after the fact but without them, a house can be cold on a cold day. (And can have a hot and muggy load for the AC to deal with on a summer day)

If I had spare thousands of dollars, I'd buy a generator. For sure.

Too many other things in front of that.

Made it through negative temps without burst pipes, so yay! TVA repealed the rolling blackouts just as soon as they were back to what they thought was needed.

Happy to be on the other side now. Whew

Rob, I bought a small Honda generator (quiet and easy to start, easy for me - an old lady - to manage, move, lift, etc.) Many years ago, it was well under $1000, not sure the price of mine today, but they have generators for below $1000 that might work for you. Hondas are notoriously dependable. Mine won't run a lot of things at the same time, but will run the refer, alternate with the freezer, a lamp or two, charge my computer and phone, etc. I had a handyman install a thingy that allows me to plug the generator outside on the covered porch into a heavy duty extension cord inside the house to reach the refer and freezer and lamps. It's a hole through the wall in my utility room that has a cap screwed onto it when not in use to keep critters out. I don't know exactly what it's called but it's less than a couple of inches across. It can run my cpap machine if needed, but I bought a battery pack specifically for that. But I can recharge the battery pack with the generator. If you need to run a heater, you may need a higher watt unit than mine, but I would guess you could get set up for much less than thousands of dollars. It's really worth the peace of mind.

“I was trying to get you to explain what you were basing your comments on …”

I’d like to hear what you’re basing your comments on. Have you ever built a house in Texas? Lived in Texas?

The Texas Monthly answer is not ”bogus”.

Various types of clay soils are notorious in Texas for severe expanding and shrinking. It absolutely does make a difference regarding building practices.

Bedrock and the water table are other important factors, as previously mentioned. In areas with bedrock, it’s not uncommon for dynamite to be used in certain construction situations. I have a lot of experience with having no choice but to use posthole augers to build the most basic of fencing.

Texas encompasses a large geographical area, as we all know, and has very diverse regions throughout the state — sometimes even on the same residential street or ranch.

I’ve worked in new home construction in Texas, have had university schooling in soils, have ranched in various towns in Texas, and have lived here most of my life.

Both my husbands (I’m a remarried widow) grew up with basements — midwest and NY — and both quickly understood why they are not common here.

Can it be done? Of course. There’s a 100 yr old house in my town that has one, a rare thing and not desired here.

It’s not being cheap to not construct them, it’s being wise.

Bedrock and the water table are other important factors

There is an absolutely wonderful article in today's NYTimes talking about construction, bedrock, water, and why the plans for the huge cathedral St. John the Divine significantly decreased the original planned height of the tower due to those factors.

Getting back to Texas, while I do not have the experience or education concerning construction as Jinx does, I have certainly heard numerous stories about Texas clay and have myself experienced adverse home effects when the clay expands and contracts. I think basements are uncommon here due to such factors.

I think some of you are munging together the topics of slab foundation vs raised perimeter foundation, and basements vs no basement.

I believe houses with basements would have a raised perimeter foundation at least around the portion of the structure where the basement is. The prevalence of slab foundations in Texas wouldn't facilitate having basements.

I don't know that there's anything particularly unique about soil conditions and variability in Texas versus elsewhere but the very consistent use of slab foundations there does differ from other places.

Parts of the South SF Bay area have dense clay soils. My first house was in such an area - a low spot in the backyard could accumulate a few inches of standing water and if it remained cloudy and not sunny after a rain (to evaporate the water), the large puddle could remain for a week. That house had a raised perimeter foundation (as did most in the area. There surely must be suitable trenching equipment to dig through the hard clay for the foundation footings in such places.

Living in PA all my life and in every house having a full basement, I can't imagine not having one. Where do people store stuff? It just would be so weird as I'm guessing not having a basement for those who never did would feel the same.

Lily, I’ve always stored things in attics, accessed through our garages, and in some cases, storage sheds (such as lawn equipment).

I don’t have that much to store.

I did like my in-laws’ basement in the midwest — it was a walk-out with three bedrooms, full bath, and rec area. It was nice having our own area when we stayed!

My DH (from NY) had one with a bedroom, bath, small kitchen, and hobby room. Again, nice for guests.

Where do we store stuff? Well, we have a few seasonal items stored in the attic (which is easy to access), and utilize closets for other normal storage considerations. What sort of things do you store in your basement, Lily? I'm sure if you didn't have one, you'd adapt! ;-)

It is true that we tend to think that what we're used to is "the way to do things." I never liked the basements I encountered when I'd travel to Kansas and Missouri to visit my ex's family. That's not a reflection on them or their lifestyle or building norms of their areas, just my own personal preference.

The clays of Texas and the problems for building are legend. All clay soils are NOT equal and all clays are not the same. In some areas you have expansion contraction problems so bad they can pull slab construction apart. There are maps to consult if you have sense. Other areas in the south can have areas similar but Texas seems to be in a class by itself. Slabs have the merit of float and that can make areas buildible that would not be otherwise. I would not presume to dictate building practices based on what is done where I happen to be living. I would certainly want 2X6 studs and plenty of insulation anywhere but all the rest is mutable. Basements are great where they work. I am sitting in a daylight basement but if I were up valley where the watertable is at surface level in the winter-you get geysers coming up out of the basement floor from the water pressure below. The expense of double walls with a space to block off the flow of water would be outrageous.

" It is true that we tend to think that what we're used to is "the way to do things."

I agree 1000%.

For this "never had a basement or accessible attic" person, "stuff" is kept in closets or in the garage. As we park cars in the garage, that limits available storage space. Not a bad thing. I've never had a yard shed.

Attic access in my area tends to be difficult. Framed in ceiling access holes covered by a piece of plywood. Usually located in closets or hallways. Get on a ladder and push up to open. about 24x30 inches in size. In my places, one is in a water heater closet, the other in a hallway. I'd never think of keeping anything in these places, access is too hard and inconvenient.

”just my own personal preference.”

Exactly, Ida. That’s what makes people so interesting.

We all live in different places for different reasons and how we live can be very different from others. The one thing to remember is that where you live is your home, and if you’ve chosen to stay there or have moved there, it is because of something that appeals to you.

I understand the need for basements, especially in colder climates. Basements have come a long way. I seldom see one, especially in newer builds, that I would describe as dark and dank as the author of your article describes. A properly built basement can be a wonderful and necessary part of your home where I live.

I also understand why Texas has so few, and found this thread extremely informative. 🙂

I’m sorry for what the folks in Texas had to go through during this cold snap. It must have been scary for some. I hope that they can be better prepared for it next time.

Lily. I'm the same in PA. iI don't know what I would do without a basement. My camp only has a partial basement you can only assess from the outside. If it was as a permanent residents it would drive me crazy. Needless to say cooking utensils and food storage is at a minimum at camp. No craft or anything supplies. Everything is at a minimum. The hot water tank, generator and well equipment is in the basment, but the furnace is up in the camp between 2 of the bedrooms. When it fires up it is noisy. Whenever it dies hopefully that can go in the basement.

Where do you hide presents from kids without having to climb a ladder.

" Texas seems to be in a class by itself "

Everything about Texas is unique and different - including the oft-heard comments about its being unique and different in various ways.

Function, we used to hide presents in our closet, but if it was something big, at my dad’s.

She got a pony one year — even a basement wouldn’t have worked in that situation! :D