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Can this shower set up work?

Kendrah
last year
last modified: last year

Here's a brainstorm from my designer for my super challenging Manhattan bathroom: Anchor a metal post into ceiling and shower rim. Right of post a glass entry door opens outward. Left of post is a window access door that swings inward 180 for full window access.

Sounded like a great idea until it became obvious this was all custom and she didn't know if it would actually function well. What are your thoughts?

Note challenges - see in pic below - 1.) Need solid wall at entry for vertical grab bar 2.) Window is half in and half out of the shower and needs to be fully accessed for cleaning and repair 3.) Window extends all the way up to ceiling height so no ability to mount anything to wall above window 4.) Not allowed to change fixture locations.

Mock Up of Post Design



Same bathroom in neighboring unit shows window challenge and fixture placement


Comments (27)

  • PRO
    Windows on Washington Ltd
    last year

    Anything can work, but windows in showers usually produce more than their fair share of issues.

  • PRO
    HALLETT & Co.
    last year

    Skip the pole and just run the fixed glass to the ceiling and hang the small hinged panel off of it. That said, why not just have a curtain or a fixed panel at the window end that's 6" short?

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  • Kendrah
    Original Author
    last year

    Hallet, I'm confused by what you mean, "Why not just have a curtain or a fixed panel at the window end that's 6" short." Do you mean a shower curtain or a window curtain and what is the 6" about? The window needs to be able to tilt out 10" beyond the wall for cleaning and repair.

  • Lorraine Leroux
    last year

    Let me understand-you are looking at a custom designed glass shower $$$$$ so you can open a small window to clean and service it? I feel changing the window would be less expensive $. Replace the window with a fixed panel on the left and an opening window on the right that is only in the shower with some type of divider/mullion where the shower glass wall will be sealed to it. Another option is to cover over the window. I assumed you were in a condo/apartment and not a house in Manhattan? Of course if this is a house there are many other solutions.

  • PRO
    HALLETT & Co.
    last year

    Have you called a custom glass company? I bet they could get a track for bypass doors but ceiling mount the track

  • Mrs Pete
    last year

    This might be a good spot for glass blocks. They don't open /close, but you won't have problems with water ruining a "real window". You could put them on both ends of the shower to bring (some) light through to the sink. Take a look at them -- they aren't just the old-fashioned 80s blocks anymore; they come in colors and textures.

  • PRO
    Sabrina Alfin Interiors
    last year

    Generally speaking, most glass fabricators don't like to have both door hinges affixed to another glass panel, for safety and stability reasons. At least one hinge should be affixed to a permanent wall. Here's how we solved that problem for a recent client:



    Beauty and the Baths: Primary Bath · More Info

    The top hinge is glass to glass, but the bottom hinge is glass to wall.

  • Kendrah
    Original Author
    last year
    last modified: last year

    Can anyone take a wild guess at how much it would cost to do the door configuration in this picture or a bypass ceiling mounted door? Both would be custom and I'm in Manhattan. Is this a fabrication and install in the ballpark of $2k - $4k or $5k-8k or over $10k? I just have no concept and am trying to weigh the cost of this vs tub with a wall third wall built for enclosure and using a shower curtain hung from the ceiling.

    I have asked my contractor 3 times to contact their glass fabricator to talk this through and he has not done so. I have showed pictures and diagrams and asked for a quote and he says he can only get pricing once the shower is built and the tile installed and they come to template. How can this be possible? I want an estimate to see if it is worth the expense or if I should just do a tub, third wall, and shower curtain instead.

    I also discussed this with my designer who said we could use a ceiling mount barn door track for bypass sliding glass doors. But I am concerned about using hardware that is not specifically created for wet areas. She said the hardware would not actually get wet, but I think she is unrealistic. I'm also concerned about how much of a gap would be between the by pass doors if the hardware is not designed for an application where you need to keep water out. She said it would work if we make sure that the inner most door is always closed closest to the shower head. But, this is a guest bathroom and I don't want to police my guests about which door they have to close and risk water on the floor. Also, the ceiling is 91" high. That seems like really tall glass panels that could weight a lot and I presume cost a lot. Is it realistic to have that tall of a bypass door?

    Mrs. Pete and Lorraine - I live in a prewar coop building and am not allowed to move the windows or change the window materials. If I were in a house I'd put the window over the toilet in a heartbeat!

  • PRO
    Sabrina Alfin Interiors
    last year

    If you have a drawing, you should be able to get an estimate. Your contractor is BS'ing you. Yes, until you pick the exact hardware the number might be slightly higher or lower, but the fabricator can most definitely get you a range. Also, make sure you ask for Starphire glass (or equivalent) which is the clearest glass. For this type of installation, you don't want a green tinge on the edges.

  • Kendrah
    Original Author
    last year

    Sabrina, thanks for the note about Starphire. Is there are particular coating I can ask for to make it easier to clean?


    I feel he is BS'ing me too. I wonder if this is just a tricky design and install with more that could go wrong and he is hoping that I'll just want to do a tub to keep it more simple? If so, I wish he'd tell me that. I want to make sensible choices and not pick something that could go terribly wrong.

  • PRO
    Sabrina Alfin Interiors
    last year

    The other option, if you want to avoid tricky installations, is to just do a sliding shower door. Not clear to me why you need that metal post; that's a question for your designer. Like this, maybe?



    Frameless Sliding Shower Doors · More Info


    Master Bathroom · More Info


  • Kendrah
    Original Author
    last year
    last modified: last year

    Sabrinia, in your first pic the crossbar mechanism at the top connects into the glass panel on the left and the wall on the right. In our situation there is nothing on the left side to screw into. The left wall is the window all the way up to the ceiling. So not only do we not have anything to screw into there, but we need to be able to slide open that area somehow to allow for window access. If you have any other ideas, I'd love to hear them. You are clearly experienced in this department!


    Here is a head on pic of the window wall.



    Upstairs neighors did a glass wall that you have to remove to access the window. And it has an open back. They said the floor does get wet and that concerns me as a fall risk.




  • Gerry
    last year

    I would go with what your neighbor did.

  • PRO
    Sabrina Alfin Interiors
    last year
    last modified: last year

    @Kendrah, hard to comment further without seeing a dimensioned floor plan. Need to see where the walls are and other possible obstructions.


    ETA: Sorry, just looked at the photo you posted of your neighbor's bath. Where is the shower head located? next to the window?

  • Kendrah
    Original Author
    last year
    last modified: last year

    Just update my comment below with a shower head location pic. Here's a very DIY sketch with measurements.

    The other big factor is I want to get a vertical grab bar at the entry way no matter if we go with a tub or shower. And, you can't put a grab bar into glass. Here is another apartment in our building. It doesn't have the window problem we have, but they erected a wall and have a tub with a curtain and I think this is what we'd do.



    I think I want a chorus of informed voices telling me to get over the walk-in idea, do the tub, you are freaking crazy to attempt a walk-in shower with full enclosure and grab bar in this bathroom.


  • PRO
    Sabrina Alfin Interiors
    last year

    I think the glass panel idea shown in your previous post is a good one, but just add a swing door if you don't want the water to get beyond the shower pan.

  • artemis78
    last year
    last modified: last year

    @Kendrah I wasn't going to say that since I have already said it in some of your other posts--but yes, just do the tub! You are going to be turning somersaults and spending $$$$ to get a custom glass setup and it will probably still not be perfect wrt either water containment or window access. I think what you have is great as far as functionality given your constraints, and you can snazz it up with new fixtures.

    We're on the other side of the country, but our plain-old-standard shower glass for a 36"x42" shower was $2500 with nothing special at all (and with regular glass). For something like your photo, I would imagine you're looking at much more than that--but I'd call glass places directly to find out.

    I like all of your neighbors' solutions better than your designer's plan from a usability perspective. Glass hanging from the ceiling would make me nervous, but also, I just don't love the idea of the full wall of glass in such a narrow bathroom--what I like about the curtain in our similarly-narrow bathroom is that it can be pushed aside when the shower isn't in use to open up the space. (Ours looks like your neighbors with tubs, except that we have a full height partition wall at the end of the tub with a cabinet there, and the sink faces it on the other side. We also have a window in about the same place yours is.) You could also do a shower in exactly the way your neighbor's tub is designed, too, if you prefer a shower or want a lower entry--it doesn't need to be a tub for that setup to work, though I do think shower curtains work a bit better with tubs than with showers.

  • Kendrah
    Original Author
    last year
    last modified: last year

    "You could also do a shower in exactly the way your neighbor's tub is designed, too, if you prefer a shower or want a lower entry--it doesn't need to be a tub for that setup to work, though I do think shower curtains work a bit better with tubs than with showers."

    I'm confused by what you mean here, though I want to understand. Are you saying do a shower pan but with a shower curtain instead of glass? I'm going for low entry, so that is appealing, but how do you get a shower curtain to contain water inside such a low threashold? Does it run the risk of going on to the floor? Do you mean something like this picture, which baffles me a bit about water containment?



    I agree, that pushing back a shower curtain can really open up the look of a room.

  • acm
    last year

    Are you just redoing your shower, or are you updating the whole room? Because the better solution would be to run the shower/tub across that back wall so that the whole window is inside it, and then move the toilet between the shower and sink. You might even get a couple more inches for your vanity that way. Worth a thought, once you're doing crazy science with glass!

  • artemis78
    last year
    last modified: last year

    @Kendrah yes, just like your photo. Not as good as glass but not that much worse for water containment than a tub with a curtain. That was the original plan for our shower in our new bath—we tested the setup at a friend‘s place. We ended up with glass because we had to flip the shower and toilet to avoid a joist after construction started and wanted natural light to get in, so did a glass-topped pony wall instead. We had planned to use a Kohler shower base but you could do tile and have a slightly higher curb, too.

    (Also, we planned a three-walled shower, so only one side was curtain.)

  • Angela Carlson
    last year

    Are you really not allowed to move fixtures? Or are you not allowed to move plumbing in the floor? I'm not sure where the drain is for the shower, but there's a *chance* you could swap the toilet and shower drains for each other to allow you to swap shower and toilet. If you did mind an industrial look, you could run the plumbing on the wall. This is all a long shot though. 


    I've stayed at a house that had a ~4 inch tall shower pan with a curtain. Yes, water does get out a little on the floor if your curtain is too short or not placed correctly (much like a tub), but it's honestly no worse than the glass-enclosed swinging-door showers I've used in hotels. You're going to have water get out pretty much no matter what, especially if you're not careful with the doors or curtain. 

    Also going to put this out there: in Europe, a lot of bathroom floors are expected to be wet all the time. They put the shower drain in the middle of the floor of the bathroom. Maybe that's an option, adding textured tile flooring, if you're worried about wet floors being slippery. 


    If cost is not a problem, I think the best option is what your neighbor did with the removable glass wall. I'm assuming that would require a track of some kind on top and bottom. My second choice is the bypass doors... third, and by far most economical choice, shower pan with curtain.


    Because if you're concerned enough about your guests' mobility to *require* a handle to get in/out, you really should not put in a tub.

  • Kendrah
    Original Author
    last year

    We truly are not allowed to move the fixtures, cannot swap shower and toilet. We are also not allowed to have a shower room / curbless shower with a drain in the floor.


    "You are pretty much going to get water on the floor no matter what."


    I have never, ever had a problem with water getting on the floor when I use a tub and shower curtain. (Maybe because I grew up with one, know how to use it?) I'm confident my parents can keep a floor dry with a shower curtain at a tub too. However, other guests might not be as good at it. It is a vote for getting a shower curtain that has those suction cups to keep it attached to the wall. I could use those on the back end of the curtain by the window and then folks just have to figure out how to close one part of it.


    I think you are somewhat right that if a person needs a grab bar they should not be stepping over a tub. On the other hand, it seems prudent to have one there as a preventive measure. My mom is quite capable of stepping into a tub and does it daily in her own home. However, she has osteoperosis and I think would instinctively grasp on to a grab bar getting in and out, which could steady her and prevent a fall. I live down the hall and have a walk in shower in one of my bathrooms. Maybe I just go for a tub in the guest room and if they are ever not able to step into a shower, then they come shower at my place?

  • thinkdesignlive
    last year

    I think the second to last photo is the best of all worlds considering your situation. I feel the glass panels will compartmentalize your space even more (even though the glass is clear the open shower curtain makes the room feel larger)…..and squeegeeing and cleaning the glass is tricky when you don’t have the proper room to maneuver. I think the photo you referenced of what your neighbor did is attractive and checks off all your boxes (where you added the grab bar note).

  • Kendrah
    Original Author
    last year
    last modified: last year

    squeegeeing and cleaning the glass is tricky when you don’t have the proper room to maneuver

    Putting this on the pro's and con's list. Had not thought about that. Seems like I am leaning towards tub. I'd love to hear suggestions about low tubs, and tubs with the most floor space as some really tapper in as they go down - should I start a new thread on that or go for it here?

  • Mrs Pete
    last year

    Mrs. Pete and Lorraine - I live in a prewar coop building and am not allowed to move the windows or change the window materials. If I were in a house I'd put the window over the toilet in a heartbeat!

    Then I vote for an extra-long shower curtain on a ceiling-mounted system.

    Kendrah thanked Mrs Pete
  • Kendrah
    Original Author
    last year

    Verdict - Going with a tub instead of standing shower. Will post before and after when I'm done. Thanks for all the input. Very helpful.

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