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Howard Martin growing citrus 33

Howard Martin
3 months ago

Can I grow lemon trees near frankfort Kentucky

Comments (65)

  • poncirusguy6b452xx
    3 months ago

    Using flying dragon as ROOT STOCK has no affect on the breeding of your lemon. flying dragon pushes the lemon tree into dormancy and holds it there until it is warm again. Keep working on a cold hardy lemon but when you develope 1 that can go down to-5F you can grow it on Flying Dragon roots in ground and use seeds from that tree to push on.

  • Howard Martin
    Original Author
    3 months ago

     But to me that is  a lie to developing tru cold hardy lemons  

    Howard

  • Ken B Zone 7
    3 months ago

    I don't know why people bother here, Howard has no interest in anybody's advice and is determined to do it his way and only his way. I'm not sure why he asks questions when he has zero interest in what anybody has to say. Howard, why do you keep posting here when you get the same answer from everyone but still insist you can do better when your trees continuously die? And please stop posting selfies of yourself. Nobody wants to see you, post pictures of your trees.

  • Howard Martin
    Original Author
    3 months ago

     Well  right now I have no trees  but I'm s see

  • Howard Martin
    Original Author
    3 months ago

      Ken B Zone  7 the reason Yu are not seeing my trees  is right now I have none and apparently I must strike some interest  or they would not bother  and    some where some thing is being missed in the translation  because I'm  not going to us flying dragon and that's final

  • poncirusguy6b452xx
    3 months ago

    Howard What you don't understand is that a citrus capable of surviving -5F is still a subtropical tree and cannot survive over winters as long as yours are with out grafting it to a deciduous root stock. Citrus trees store their energy in there cambiums will deciduous trees store their energy in their roots, PT is the only citrus that is deciduous and will have that extra supply of energy in spring. Your cold hardy citrus will DIe. Without PT/FD

  • Howard Martin
    Original Author
    3 months ago

    Than it must be developed  apparently some where  they apparently have   the  potential to  to  be developed to do so   sorry we dissagree there because  I understand what you are  saying but  no one is willing to  accept citrus can be developed  to handle  winters out side  in 6b   but finding the right mutations  in lemons is hard I guess that's something is not uner stood  and that's on their own own roots     we must agree to disagree on that part  but we both can agree  to find those mutations  can take time and th are not common


     Howard

  • Howard Martin
    Original Author
    3 months ago

     If I understand u right I my as well  breed  The lemon  with flying dragon and  back cross with  more lemons

  • Howard Martin
    Original Author
    3 months ago

     Grafting on to another  rootsock to me making true cold hardy lemons a lie because  the seeds would not develop the true cold hardiness I need

  • Howard Martin
    Original Author
    3 months ago

      Ponicirusguy6b452xx  then if I understand u right to get what I want I must  breed flying dragon  with lemons  and  back cross with more lemons

    Howard

  • Howard Martin
    Original Author
    3 months ago

     What If turns into a Chmerea

  • dbarron
    3 months ago
    last modified: 3 months ago

    What if wishes were fishes and the world turned to candy (about as likely I'd say). Howard, it's occasionally amusing (that's why I continue to read), but geez they're right. You're living in a fantasy world and apparently no one can change your mind.

    Here's a list of cold hardy citrus, start there, or just move along and stop asking the same question every X days. Lemon is not on the list, it doesn't have any such genes in the gene pool so you can't breed for it using only lemon, or we would probably be pulling up lemon seedlings in Kalamazoo Michigan today growing out of cracks in the sidewalk.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cold-hardy_citrus

    If there were already cold hardy selections of lemon, you could start there, but it doesn't exist. You can't select for a non-existent trait.

    You'd be about as likely to develop water-breathing poodles by putting new born puppies in an aquarium and putting a lid on it so there was no air surface under the lid. Expected result: All puppies die, because the trait of water-breathing is not existent in canines of any species. Admittedly some of their ancestors were fish, but I think they lost gills a long time ago.

  • Howard Martin
    Original Author
    3 months ago

      Poodles are a  type of hunting  dog   that retrievese small game v from water

  • Howard Martin
    Original Author
    3 months ago

     Not fish

  • Howard Martin
    Original Author
    3 months ago

      Some times a chemirra happenns when a graft down' t fully take   and then  the plant    breeds with  graft

  • Howard Martin
    Original Author
    3 months ago

     Apparently those traits  exist   and If they  didn't the Harvey lemon  would never had  happened even though it's from unknown parentage    I May have to start with that  variety  and keep  pushing for what I want

  • Howard Martin
    Original Author
    3 months ago

     Ponicriusguy6b452xx

     Some times a chimera   happens  when a graft don't fully take   and some    breeding from    the host tree  And some  separate  and some  where the host secesfully bred with host tree

  • dbarron
    3 months ago

    The harvey lemon may have flying dragon in it's background, no one knows :)

  • Howard Martin
    Original Author
    3 months ago

      This comes from hidden genes nobody knows about 

     Howard

  • dbarron
    3 months ago

    There is no such thing as a species known as lemons. This is true of most citrus being a mishmash hybrid.

    A genomic study of the lemon indicated it was a hybrid between bitter orange (sour orange) and citron.--Wiki

  • rusty_blackhaw
    3 months ago

    In another 100 years or so, the combination of selective breeding and warming temperatures may make a true lemon tree hardy in zone 6B Kentucky a reality.


    Unfortunately that will be too late for me and Howard. :(

  • Howard Martin
    Original Author
    3 months ago

      A bitter orange  is  flying dragon

  • Howard Martin
    Original Author
    3 months ago

     Rusty I believe It can be done sooner    but I must start with the coldest hardy lemons of today  and push them for even  colder  cold hardyness nobody said it was going to be easy

  • Howard Martin
    Original Author
    3 months ago

     dbrron see  there are still some genes we know nothing about 


    Howard

  • Howard Martin
    Original Author
    3 months ago

      Partim  they seem to think  that only way  to get cold hardy lemons for zone 6b is to use trifoliate  genes  but still think it can be done other wise  are you  with international citrus growers

  • partim
    3 months ago
    last modified: 3 months ago

    Nope. Retired banker. Botany major way back when.

  • Howard Martin
    Original Author
    3 months ago

      I know I'm different than the rest on this forum  but  believe   that true cold hardiness in lemons  are in the genes

  • Howard Martin
    Original Author
    3 months ago

      That my be so ,  this is the classification  of true lemons


    Howard

  • poncirusguy6b452xx
    3 months ago

    Cold hardiness is definitely in the jeans

    shown by this model.

  • partim
    3 months ago
    last modified: 3 months ago

    My uncle had a fruit farm in Niagara, Canada. Mostly peaches, some cherries and a lone apricot tree just for fun. The apricot was the least cold hardy. It didn't die in cold winters, but most years there was no fruit, because once the buds had broken their dormancy and started to open, a late frost would freeze the flower buds dead. And in some years a late frost killed all the cherry flower buds too.

    http://omafra.gov.on.ca/english/crops/hort/news/orchnews/2014/on-0214a1.htm


  • Howard Martin
    Original Author
    3 months ago

     I was not talking about that type of genes   it is   in the genome  of lemons it has  get developed  and expoliotesd

  • Howard Martin
    Original Author
    3 months ago

      I have no access to flying  seeds and what  If the graft doesn't 'fully take  then  the lemons and flying dragon  will breed  to each other 


    Howard

  • Howard Martin
    Original Author
    3 months ago

      I have no access to flying  seeds and what  If the graft doesn't 'fully take  then  the lemons and flying dragon  will breed  to each other 


    Howard

  • poncirusguy6b452xx
    3 months ago

    No They won't. The grafted tree will die instead.

  • Howard Martin
    Original Author
    3 months ago

     You mean they won't turn into a chimera

  • Howard Martin
    Original Author
    3 months ago

     That is what I mean by not fully taking effect

  • partim
    3 months ago

    Citrus chimeras are extremely rare, despite the common practice of grafting. It is not the result of a failed graft. Let us know if you produce one!

    http://www.homecitrusgrowers.co.uk/citrusvarieties/bizzarria.html

  • Howard Martin
    Original Author
    3 months ago

     When that happens is partial  rejection  the graft

  • Palms And Pines
    3 months ago

    While I wish you luck with your endevour, I agree with others sentiments. Even in central florida which is citrus country, citrus can sometimes be setback by freezes, this is why they cant be reliably grown in north florida. Lets say hypothetically you could get a lemon to survive it still would never produce fruit because of the cold and freezes. The only reliable way that you could ever grown one there is through genetic engineering and that is an entirely different can of worms.

  • Howard Martin
    Original Author
    3 months ago

     Selective breeding  is genetic   engineering   and I still believe it possible  to get the fruit up here  but my selections  will have to be with the most cold hardy varieties I can find and cross them

  • Howard Martin
    Original Author
    2 months ago

     The farm  will be moved to Ashland Kentucky

  • Howard Martin
    Original Author
    2 months ago

     Can I get cold hardy lemons by selective breeding

  • poncirusguy6b452xx
    2 months ago

    yes.

  • Alex [Zone 6a Lithuania.]
    last month

    Howard, are you tired of spamming the forum?

  • Meyermike(Zone 6a Ma.)
    last month
    last modified: last month

    I think Howard just loves the interactions and the friends he's made here. Who can blame him? Probably lonely and there are good people here. Therefore the reason his threads get this long. Good for him)

    he's not afraid to dream and even post pics of himself.

    Good to see you are well and still dreaming Howard.

  • Howard Martin
    Original Author
    last month

    Meyermike(zone 6aMa.)

     It true I'm a lonely man but I honestly right now I have no trees to show and i'm not kidding but I don't  do anything for attention like you think

  • Howard Martin
    Original Author
    last month

     Alex [azu9()yandex.com] I'm not spamming the forum I'm trying to be honest

  • partim
    last month

    @Howard Martin you're not the first (or the last) person on Houzz to stick to your original ideas even though other people disagree with you. It's much more common than the reverse. And it's not "spam" to post to your own thread.

  • Howard Martin
    Original Author
    last month

     I'm one of a kind that is clear  but with my choices are very limited  and I might have to get. Some of my lemons from other supermarkets Besides Kroger so I can have a  better selection of the genes and  bigger genes pool