Actually some ants do bring the aphids to the plants, others are opportunistic farmers. It's misleading to talk about ants, or aphids, as if they are all the same. There are thousands of different, unique types of ants in the world and they don't even all eat the same things. There are populations of aphids that are winged and fly to new plants, others are carried by ants. The OP probably has both types occurring. There are some cases where I ignore aphids happening, like trees and sunflowers, since large plants often don't seem to care. Also some populations of aphid are not large enough for me to bother with. Anyway, for the OP's particular case, I would say if the ants ignored the bait, then it isn't the right type of food for them. Baits can be protien based or sugar based. Sugar based baits are probably appropriate for the ants in question, but even that may not be enough to get them to sample it. Since they are feeding on honeydew, it is likely that these ants will go for a bait that is in a liquid or at least gel, form. I think you can find baits and traps online that will work. I made a homemade bait of sugar water and borax that worked pretty well last year, but you have to be careful with the borax. It's pretty much harmless to us and most wildlife, but the plants really don't like excess boron. Don't know if any of that will prove useful to you in the long run, since a lot of what you are seeing sounds environmentally based. But sometimes a little intervention can give a plant enough energy to survive until the weather or soil get to be more copeacetic.

Hey Spruce, No problem! I love to share places that I know and love, especially with people who would very much appreciate such places, and may not know they are there. I was just up in WV this past weekend (again) and did not get a chance to visit Gaudineer this time. This time I went to Blackwater Falls, and then on to Dolly Sods. Blackwater Falls is nice and all, but a bit too touristy for me. I can almost never go into that area and NOT go up to DS. I just simply love it up there. I did pay extra attention on this trip to what people have planted around their properties, and sure enough, there are a TON of Norway Spruce. I even saw some areas where it looked like they have naturalized a bit. That said, I also did see quite a lot of properties that had Red Spruce planted as well. Granted, they were probably more elevated than you, and also much closer (and some were on) the Allegheny Front, so they probably were not as affected by the rain/ snow shadow. None the less I was still surprised at the number of places I saw that had Red Spruce planted, even at lower elevations. I would LOVE to visit your Timberland. I did see and read your other threads in the trees forum, and it looks FANTASTIC! It also looks like you are a wonderful steward of the forests on your land as well. I would definitely love to see it, and am really not that far away. How far up into Western MD is it? I have 2 brothers and sister in laws up in Martinsburg, WV, and could always combine a trip to see them with a day trip or stop on the way up/ back. I would almost kill to own even just a half acre of land that looked like some of yours in your photos. Not to build on, hunt, or anything like that, but just to go to and get away. Pitch a tent, and stay for a couple days. I love the open meadows surrounded by forests and the high altitude wetlands / bogs / beaver dams...etc. Not sure I will ever be able to afford even a small parcel of undeveloped land in this life tho, but if I could it would remain untouched as long as I had it and I would do my best to make sure it stayed untouched long after I was gone. Having a place like that to go to would make living where I do more more bearable. I don't dislike it where I am, but Ive been here for 40 years (my whole life) and well, its just gotten kind of old. I'm always up for a trip to Gaudineer or anywhere else around the MNF for that matter. =o) Also, glad to see (at least from what you posted in your other threads) that your Hemlocks seem to not be suffering from the woolly adelgid. Just this weekend at Blackwater Falls State park I saw many many hemlocks which were infested, and way too many snags that once were beautiful hemlocks. Just sad. Anyway, Thanks for sharing that with me! Hope to get to see it some day! KJ

I've been feeding them with compost tea when I water twice each day. Like most tap water, mine has a a fairly high pH, so minerals may not be as available to the plants as they should be. I try to avoid all toxic stuff, but I do use non-organic fertilizers when my compost for tea is either used up or washed out. I mainly compost maple tree leaves and grass clippings that I bag with the mower each fall. I gave the plants dose of Epson salts and bought a small package of Miracid fertilizer with trace elements. I'm going to try adding a small bit of this each day with their water to lower the pH and supplement their feed now that I am running out of compost that is not already washed out. The rate of leaves dying has slowed down a bit, so it looks like the plant might survive to give me a fall crop after the weather cools down a bit. I am not sure if the improvement is because our temp for the past week has finally dropped from over 100 to the high 80s. It may also be that the sick leaves are the left over ones from before I got rid of the last few aphids and mites. I cannot find a single aphid or mite anymore. It cannot tell for sure which growth on the plant as emerged since the final bugs were beaten. I did take some of the leaves and hold them up to a flash light last night to see if there were any pin-holes. The leaves that have any yellow all seem to have some tiny holes that light would shine through, but the newer mature leaves do not have any holes or yellow. Thank you for the suggestion regarding the magnesium. Between the Epson Salts, more balanced pH, lower temp, and beneficial bugs, I hope somethings works. If I can get this problem with leave drop fixed, I think I can get a good fall crop. The plant's basic stems and roots seem to still be very healthy and there is enough new growth with leaves to still produce a good crop once our night temps drop back below 70 so my blooms will set fruit. Knoxville is near the mountains, but down in river valley, so our cool fall temps are moderated. Last year, I was able to cover my plants with a sheet at night for the first 3 or 4 frosts, and then we got a warm spell without more frost until mid November. After I gave up and picked the green fruit before our first really cold night, I had ripe tomatoes until nearly Christmas. Between tress and my 4 dogs which love to dig, I had a hard time finding a good place to grow a couple of tomato plants, so I've grown 2 or 3 in pots for the past few years. I read about the Topsy-Turvey tomato planters that a local man had invented, so I decided to try the idea 2 years ago. For anyone that wants to grow tomatoes next year in a container, I recommend the idea highly. I don't have to stake them and the plants are clean and dry up off the ground. I'm disabled and living on social security, so I try to make do with things I can scavenge whenever possible. For my planters, I use a 5 or 10 gallon bucket. I tied a strong nylon rope around the top of the buckets, because I did not trust the handles to be strong enough to support both the bucket's contents and the plant's growth. I drilled a 2 inch hole in the center of the bottom of the buckets. When I transplant my seedlings, I sit the bucket right-side-up on the edge of a table with part hanging over the edge so I can get to the hole in the bottom. I slide the plant's roots up from the bottom through the hole in the bucket and then wedged soft sponge-like foam around the plant's stem to keep it from falling out and keep the dirt from running out when I add it next. After the tomato plant is in the hole with its foam collar, I reach in the top of the bucket and pull the plant's roots and stem up into the bucket until only the top stems and leaves of the plant are hanging out of the bottom of the bucket. I then add enough dirt to hold the plant in position. Pause before adding so much dirt that the bucket gets too heavy to lift up to hang. Warning, this thing will get heavy, so a simple cup hook screwed into the overhang will not be enough to hold it once you get it full of dirt, watered, with several feet of foliage. While it is somewhat clumsy to put together, if you have a place to hang it that gets lots of sun, it works great. I was lucky in that someone in the past had already put up a mounting for a swing on the porch. The porch is so sunny, it lends itself better for container gardening than it does for a porch swing, so I use the heavy hooks intended for a porch swing with two adults, to instead support large hanging tomato plants. After I have the pots hanging, I then finish filling the buckets with a mixture of compost and potting mix. I use fresh potting mix each year and wash the buckets with bleach each spring to avoid soil borne diseases and pests from the prior year. In full sun and heat, I water the plants each morning and afternoon. As the stems grow, they will tend to curve back upward in graceful "swooping" arcs that almost hide the bucket they are growing in. Once the plants are heavy with full-sized fruit they will hang more straight, so try to put the pot as high as you can, and still be able to reach up to water it from the top. Cherry tomatoes plants make a very beautiful hanging plant when grown this way. The graceful arcs of lush green leaves are accented so well by the clusters of ripe fruit, you would be tempted to leave then on the plant for decoration, if they weren't so tasty. They are so good, that many of them never even make it inside the house, because I cannot resist picking a few to eat fresh from the vine, every time I go outside and walk past them. While they don't produce bragging sized fruit, I always plant a cherry tomato plant because they are so predictably productive. For me, they always seem to be the most disease and pest resistant and best at continuing to set fruit during the hot summer. Greg

Hi Christopher- Yes, I am still very new to this rose-growing thing, so I know it takes time for the pest/ beneficial balance to get established. Things should be warming up soon, and I'm hoping (really hoping!) we won't see any more freezing temps. The good bugs should be hatching out soon, and I bet they'll be hungry. I was very excited to see Ladybug larvae last fall, and there were some hoverflies hovering near the roses within the last couple of weeks. No signs of hoverfly larvae yet, but I did look online so that I'll (kinda) know what to look for. I had some Nasturtiums last year that I grew from seed- the aphids didn't find them last year, but maybe they will this year. Queen Anne's Lace is pretty invasive here, but I do plant Dill and Parsley and let them bolt. This year I have bronze fennel also, so the umbellifer angle should be covered... eventually. You mention Achillea, and that's the only plant I've been thinking to buy ready-grown this spring. I just don't have the kind of budget that allows for buying lots of flowering plants in the spring, and I tend to worry about what's been sprayed on the big-box flowers. So, I'll call around to some local nurseries to see what kinds of Yarrow they have, and make sure they haven't been sprayed with neo-nics. The local Native Plant Society offers the species (if I get to the sale in time), but there are so many pretty cultivars, that I may go that route. Here's a photo of R. moschata I took today. She unfurled those charming leaves not long after her arrival, but otherwise looks just the same- I guess that's semi-dormancy? The aphids haven't found her, and hopefully won't. She'll get a larger pot soon, but it's raining again now. I'll let you know when she gets growing- it shouldn't be long now... even my 'Mortimer Sackler' that arrived in the fall already dormant is showing tiny bits of green... Thanks, Virginia