Forum discussions frequently center on the question of adding dilute coffee/tea or grounds to plants as a 'tonic', but Arabica (coffee) and Camellia (tea) are known for their toxic alkaloid (caffeine) content and their allelopathic affect on plants as well as autotoxic (poison to their own seedlings) effects on future generations. Caffeine interferes with root development by impairing protein metabolism. This affects activity of an important bio-compound (PPO) and lignification (the process of becoming woody), crucial steps for root formation. We also know that the tannins in both coffee and tea are known allelopaths (growth inhibitors). There are ongoing experiments to develop herbicides using extracts from both coffee and tea that cause me to want to say they might serve better as a nonselective herbicide than as a tonic. I would not use either (stale coffee or tea) by applying directly to my plants - especially containerized plants; nor would I add tea bags/coffee grounds to my container soils. I look at nutrition methodically. I prefer to use the least number of nutrient mixtures that will ensure my plants are getting all the essential nutrients they normally take from the soil and in the right proportions. The reason is, supplying more of any one element than a plant can use can be as limiting as supplying too little. 'How did he get THERE?' you might ask. What is in water left over from cooking vegetables - anyone know? So - you use it ..... then what? Obviously, it is going to be entirely inadequate in supplying the major elements, N P K Ca Mg S. So what do you do .... you fertilize anyway - because you have no idea what you supplied with the fish emulsion and you still need to be sure all the bases are covered. The point is, if you're using fertilizers that only cover a few of the elements required for growth, additional fertilizers are required to fill in the gaps, Almost always, there will be overlaps, where you are supplying the same element in both products, or the same element will be missing from both products - gaps. Why not choose a fertilizer that supplies ALL the elements required for normal growth, and in a ratio to each other that is favorable, thereby eliminating gaps, overlaps, and potential antagonisms? (Antagonistic deficiencies occur when an excess of one element in the soil solution prevents adequate uptake of 1 or more other elements. Common antagonisms exist between Fe/Mn, P/Fe and Mn, Ca/Mg, others.) I'm not saying the veggie water is particularly harmful, only that if you're employing a fertilizer like Foliage-Pro 9-3-6, it's probably redundant. This question in another form often comes up when discussing the use of aquarium water as a nutrient source. We know the aquarium water is not a complete fertilizer, and since you have no idea what you DID supply when you used it, you will certainly need to fertilize anyway - thus making the aquarium water (or manure) of little or no value. The easiest and most efficient way to supply nutrients to your plants is with a soluble synthetic fertilizer that supplies nutrients in a ratio the same as the ratio at which the plants actually USE the nutrients. The only reliable way to do that is by using a fertilizer like I just described. When you depart from that plan, there can be no potential for benefits - only limitations that arise from either to much or too little of one or more elements essential for growth. Even if the residual veggie water supplied a nutrient necessary for growth, it would not help with growth unless it was supplying the single nutrient most deficient. Al

I looked into the product some more on other forums and it seems the best part is the the root fungi. There are a ton of mycorrhizal fungi products available, are these products worthwhile or do they also fall under snake oil category? My biggest current need was a fertilizer for sweet potatoes and regular potatoes I have coming and the only one that looked promising was a 8-20-30 from Steele Plant company, yet I was looking for an organic equivalent. I liked the idea that the root fungi supposedly increase fertilizer uptake since none I have found are close to that 8-20-30 value. As for the super tonic product above, I never noticed it initially but when looking for more info last night, all the comments are on marijuana growing forums. Kinda weird. I found a thread here on how to make compost tea with a bubbler over 3 days which sounds familiar to above product, so maybe that's all it is with some fungi added? PS- I apologize if I offended anyone but I was highly insulted when I finally make an account here to ask two questions, soil info for sweet potatoes and thoughts on a product, and one goes unanswered and the second get me someone calling me a moron spammer. Kinda made me regret even posting in first place. Thankfully, I got some good info from Al in container forum earlier today that made me happier!

Bit of a bump (felt that extra info wouldn't hurt): In response to the aquarium salt question, it is not necessary. It 'can' help with disease and some fish-keepers use it as general maintenance (1tbs per 5 gallons). I wouldn't bother, I've used it a few times for 'aiding in treatment' with no confirmed results. Certainly don't use a 1tbs/5gal mixture of aquarium water to water you plants. Most aquatic plants thrive on NitrAte, which is only present in an established (and HEALTHY) aquarium after it has become cycled. Fish waste (Ammonia) is eventually converted to NitrIte after beneficial bacteria has established in the filter. Both are poisonous to fish and some plants help in absorbing these harmful chemicals (java moss to name one). After a bit more time, another type of beneficial bacteria will establish itself in the filter converting NitrIte in NitrAte. Nitrate is what aquarium plants thrive on (as well as most common forms of algae). Given this, well established aquariums should ONLY have NitrAte present. As with aquarium plants, house plants tend to thrive off of this nutrient. I can only speak for aquarium plants, but I would suspect that some "easy to care for house plants" would only need aquarium water as a fertilizer if the nitrate levels are at a moderate level. As far as backing up the "propagating plants in fish tanks", I've started a few spider plants by floating the roots in my aquarium water with VERY accelerated results. The roots are present within 24 hours and within a couple of days the roots are around 2" long. Plant in soil watch em grow. I water all of my plants with aquarium water.

Jerry Baker needed a fact checking. On page 94 of the Tips and Tonics Book: Q. Can I use maple leaves to mulch my rhododendrons? A. Yes, they make a great mulch because they are very alkaline. I know he must have meant acid. Rhododendrons only like acid soil. I don’t use leaves to mulch away because they would blow away, at least in San Francisco on the western exposure garden. I use homemade compost and then if I want more mulching I would use something like Black Forest Sheared wood on top of that to keep the compost from getting washed away. But, I usually did not even bother to mulch with soil as good as I had going there with my coffee ground composting. I would use Starbucks grounds to make the compost, but never used straight grounds. But, using a mulch of leaves I think that would foster fungal diseases. I always pick up the leaves right away, if you leave them on the ground that is supposed to cause fungal in the leaves to fester, and I need them for my compost. This book has been really fun to read but some of it is just weird, like run your sprinklers for four hours a day on page 97. In fact, it was for AT LEAST four hours a day, not just four hours a day maximum, but not to do it very often. Four hours a day would create thousands of dollars in a water bill and not only that most all of the water would just drain away. It would be insane, your neighbors would turn you into the water police. They are the people in California who enforce drought regulation. There even have an app here so people can go around and take photos of others wasting water and upload them to the app and click a button called report. I guess it works like that I never tried it. Consider what he said about deep watering vs. light watering. I think light watering is not so bad. It can create root system that are close to the surface right? But if you plan to be there and water it often does it matter that much? On page 96, “he says water deeply because if there is a prolonged drought the plants will be healthier with a deep root system.” There is always a prolonged drought, but if you water lightly instead of deep there won’t be. In sandy soil with compost, deep watering just runs down in the soil and is not saved for the plants. If you don’t have compost the water will actually not sink into the soil at all. I have to water just a little bit and wait for that to sink and then water just a little bit more and repeat again and again. It just runs off of sandy hard packed soil. He should of divided the book up into watering for sandy soils vs. clay soils. I don’t know about the clay soils, I am just getting started with those.