Moss on trees....watering moss.....moss and ferns....moss and bonsai... Whether a moss will grow on a given tree depends on the moss and depends on the tree. Some mosses are very selective on what they will grow on. Grimmia, the moss that grows on rocks, I doubt will ever grow on a tree. Brachythecium the common branched spreading moss will often grow on anything. Next is whether the tree will allow the moss to grow. Some tropical trees I believe can discourage growth. George Schenk in his book Moss Gardening said to transplant moss from like surfaces to like surfaces. If a moss is growing on a tree it will probably transplant to growing on another tree. Watering moss oftentimes implies drenching the moss and thus flooding the substrate. On a cool morning with the dew on the ground look at some moss. That may be all the moisture the moss needs for that day and the next. I mist use hand misters or pump sprayers when I get the inclination to "water" the moss. Yet if you want to water the tree and not the moss just pour water in a few areas, or pull aside the moss and then later replace it, or immerse the pot in a saucer of water. In theory you could grow tropical moss on the soil surface in a planter with cactus. Aesthetically pleasing- no! But easily done. Misting daily for filmy moss with no drenching of the soil would work. Generally a slight misting for many common mosses every two to three days with no other moisture would suffice for most common mosses. Last summer I kept several species on grit or dirt in clay saucers on my enclosed back porch in south facing window. If I wanted good growth I misted daily but generally misting every two to three days was all I did. Fertilizing every two to three weeks one quarter strength acid fertilizer was given. I cannot use my municipal supply water so I use distilled or rain water. Works great. Moss and ferns are related and very compatible. If you choose to grow the filmy ferns and need a high humidity green house there are many filmy mosses that will do well there. Yet some arid mosses like Grimmia cannot tolerate extended periods of high humidity and that is understandable. Schenk mentions this and gives several examples in his book including the Royal Botanic Garden in Edinburgh. Moss and bonsai. Chapter eleven in Moss Gardening is titled "Bonsai Mosses". Schenk gives several species he recommends. What he doesn't do and what drives me is to answer the twin questions; A, how do you identify them and B, where can you find them. His bonsai pictures with moss are great but it is very difficult to identify a moss from a picture. Just as even the best seamstress would be hard pressed to identify different fabrics from pictures. I have said it before and I mention it again; some of the best and easiest bonsai mosses to acquire are the sidewalk mosses; Bryum caespiticium the deep green sidewalk moss and the other Bryum argenteum the silver sidewalk moss. Sunday my wife and I went to a large horticultural greenhouse operation. The owner and I have talked before. He said he gets requests for moss but can't fill them I said "Quit killing the moss you already have and it will grow wherever you want". He uses an algacide in his water. I went outside and returned with B. caespiticium and another Bryum I found on the west side of his greenhouse. I then led him to a common pathway inside his greenhouse at the edge of which was growing a 1/16" upright, very thick green moss that had a nap softer than velvet. I do not know the type of moss but I told him that he obviously is able to grow it. Look around in the environment that is compatible with the plants you want moss to grow with. Look carefully! Last Friday May 4th I spent the day in the field with my bryologist friend. Literally at the end of the day we went into untilled fields looking for moss growing among last year's corn or bean stubble. What we found was amazing. I am leaving next week for a six day bryology seminar. After that I will start posting pictures with more information. Rick

cat beat me to the punch. What you've got there is a big hump with a big stump. In its present state, I don't see a satisfying incorporation of the two elements with additional plantings to create something architecturally anchoring. If you like the stump and want it to stay in its present state, well, I'm stumped. There's rot in the core which could easily be whacked away with a hatchet in order to snug in a pot or to fill with soil for a plant or two. Be tempted to go with a vine that'll drape rather than anything that adds additional height. And over time, it will just rot away more from the inside out - woody layers will go first eventually leaving you with a raggedy bark shell. But contemplating alternatives... do you know anyone with a chain saw who could take the stump down further? Have you called around to see about stump grinding fees for a 15", 20", or whatever stump? (It wouldn't be anywhere close to hundreds of dollars here, especially if they left the chips for you to use elsewhere on the property.) I've had lots of trees cut down - obviously location dictated grinding or not. Most were in mixed tree and shrub or fern bed locations so were just cut as close to the ground as possible.

Your thread title wasn't very interesting but your problem certainly is. It is much better to have terraces on steep hills as you thought but with established trees you can't scrape up the roots on one side and bury them on the other and expect good results. If you were cutting through a lot of roots when you pulled soil from above that would have been your clue to proceed very gradually over several years. A few inches of mulch would have accomplished much of what you were trying to do anyway. If the lower roots haven't been buried too long you may be able to uncover them to original level and cover with mulch and pray to the citrus god for forgiveness. Unfortunately, according to citrus god laws, ignorance is no excuse. I don't think the acidity of the peat moss would much affect the pH of the soil beneath but it is not the best mulch to use unless your soil is excessively alkaline. Even in that case I'd mix it with something that stops and holds water like arborist wood chips.

Well, there is always a difference from one area to another, John, there is no denying this. In general, grass, which demands HUGE amounts of nitrogen (and water) will always be the first to grab nitrogen from the soil (and your fertilizer), thus not leaving much for your citrus tree. Mature trees can usually manage, due to their extensive feeder root systems, but a young tree is going to struggle in having to compete for both nutrients and nitrogen with grass. No matter where you live. Plus, lawn usually means lawn sprinklers, and this is also something citrus just don't tolerate universally - constantly wet trunks. So, I would respectfully disagree with him on this. I also believe you should not amend your hole you dig, either. This is current thinking for all trees. Instead, I agree with Howard Garrett in supporting your soils by applying compost and composted manure, as well as trying to use organic or semi-organic products if possible, all to help support and develop the soil microbes. I think there are some universal "rules" for citrus, and then of course, you'll have to modify things based on where you live, what soils you have, amount of rain, sun, temperatures, wind, etc. That's pretty standard with any gardening recommendations :-) Universally, citrus and grass are not a good combo. This is not my philosophy, but that of much more learned folks than I, and I have certainly seen this borne out with young citrus. Now, that being said, I have a neighbor that has about an 8 year old citrus tree sitting in his lawn. It's in the corner, doesn't really get hit by sprinklers, BUT, the tree is very small. No doubt having to struggle to compete for nutrients with the grass. But, it's alive, it's bearing fruit, and well, it's working for my neighbor. I mulch my trees. Now, someone in a heavy rain area would probably not need to do that (unless they're trying to keep weeds down). Interestingly, the "mulch" philosophy is changing here in California, with regard to citrus. If you go to UC Riverside Citrus Variety Collection, there is no grass, no mulch under their trees. I, however, have to watch my water bill (not that UCR doesn't), and for me, mulching under my trees accomplishes several great things - it adds organic materials in my very thin DG soils, it keeps weeds down, and it also helps to retain moisture, so I don't have to water as much. It works well for me, and in some experiments here in the state of California, there are very favorable returns for mulching under citrus. So, I would suggest mulching under your trees, topping with some compost once a year, and some composted manure, and see how that works for you. Texas can get awfully hot and dry during the summers, and I know many parts of Texas have been under severe drought, so I would think anything to help retain moisture under your trees would be a good thing. Just want to make sure if you're on clay, you've planted on a mound system, and if it's really bad, a french drain system is not a bad idea. Patty S.