Kitchen layout - wall oven, rangetop size, counter space, sink, trash?
Hi, we are doing a 12x12’ kitchen and decided to forgo the regular oven. Will use an XXL Miele combi steam oven and a Miele speed oven on the wall as we want them to be at higher level so we can save our knees and backs in the near future. Space is really limited as we would like to have a 36” range top and a 36” fridge/freezer. Please see drawing below. Here are some questions. I would love to hear your thoughts/comments/suggestions/advice.
1. Is counter space next to the stove too narrow at 12” + 18”? On the left side of the stove particularly, it’s only 12”. Would it be OK since the L shaped counter next to it could help a bit?
2. Would you recommend a 30” range top instead of 36” to give more counter space?
3. If we go with the 12” L + 18” R counter space, how should we design the upper cabinets? Would 18”wide cab + 12”wide cab + 36"range hood + 18”wide cab look too strange and unbalanced?
4. At the current design, the distance from the center of the main sink to the center of the range top is at ~ 7ft, is this too far?
5. Where would you put the trash bins?
6. Position of the sinks? I am a righty and prefer to work on the left side of the sink so that I can easily sweep/dispose any unwanted parts to the sink while chopping:
a. Bar sink: where should I put the bar sink?
b. 30" main sink: should I switch it with the DW?
Many many thanks for your help!
Comments (14)
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terrible kitchen layout needs more counter space.
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Comments (10)Ovens that are part of a range are designed to be accessed at their low location. Even then, some people dislike having to bend down to get to the oven. On the other hand, wall ovens aren't really designed for under-counter installation. They frequently feel too close to the floor. They also often vent hot air just where you are standing (although that can differ between models). If you have a wall oven, I would normally recommend installing it at about counter-top level or no more than a couple of inches lower. You could also install it a little higher, but if it is too high, again, it becomes difficult to access. On the other hand, if you think that you only use your oven very rarely, then obviously none of these considerations matter much. For the once-a-year turkey, it really doesn't matter if the oven is somewhat less convenient to access. On the other hand, if you do have an easily accessible oven, you might realize that it can be used for a lot more than just roasting turkey. Many commercial kitchens use ovens for the bulk of their cooking. It's a great option for slowly braising foods. Much better temperature control than using a stove top. It also can be used to keep dishes warm before serving. Personally, I find that after having learned about the usefulness of an oven, I actually need more than one oven to efficiently cook larger meals. Of course, for simple everyday meals, all of this is moot, and I can do with whatever limited tools I have access to....See MoreExtra large kitchen sink vs counter space
Comments (27)So now that all appliances besides the dishwasher have moved away from my primary wash sink, and I also now have the option for a 12 or 14 inch diameter prep sink in the corner of the peninsula, I am again looking at the primary sink dimensions. I originally planned for a 36 inch sink cabinet centered in the window, now I could still do that and fit a 33 inch wide sink (looking at Create Good Sinks single bowl options). But instead I could go with one of their options with an integrated drainboard and opt for a smaller sink (looking at their 45 inch model which includes a 27 inch sink basin and 15 inch drain board). Doing this would only require a 30 inch sink cabinet since the drainboard fits over the dishwasher to the left. That then lets me have a 36 inch wide cabinet on both ends, but would also no longer perfectly center the sink in the window. My thinking here is since the drain board is off centered anyway I could center the faucet in the window and that might fool the eye enough to even it out, but would appreciate to here anyone else's thoughts. So in summary, option 1 is a 36" centered sink cabinet with 33" sink and a 30" drawer cabinet to the far left side: https://www.creategoodsinks.com/collections/ledge-sinks/products/1-2-radius-ledge-33-single-bowl-with-offset-drain-left-5ls33l Option 2 is a 30" off centered sink cabinet with 45" sink plus drainboard (27" sink basin + 15" drainboard) and a 36" drawer cabinet to the far left side: https://www.creategoodsinks.com/collections/drainboard-kitchen-sinks/products/45-ledge-sink-drainboard-single-bowl-reversible-5lps27c...See More
mama goose_gw zn6OH
3 years agoI would make the island shallower and move the sink run out to give you a deeper counter between the sink and cooktop. Move the DW to the left of the sink, and keep dishes in drawers in the island. The bar sink wouldn't be necessary, unless you want to keep it for handwashing, or a second prep area for a helper. Definitely go with a 30" cooktop.
S + U thanked mama goose_gw zn6OH
Buehl
3 years agolast modified: 3 years agoYou're getting good advice. If you'd like us to help you, then please provide us with the following measurements. I included the ones you provided, but please verify as many have +/- and/or ~, meaning you don't know for sure -- inches add up and they can make a difference in what you can/cannot fit.
Note the comments & questions on the image (e.g., asking about a Powder Room on the right, what is/is not a wall, what the top is, etc.).
S + U thanked Buehlmama goose_gw zn6OH
3 years agolast modified: 3 years agoIf that's not a wall (or a pony wall) to the left, I like dan1888's ideas. You'd need to watch the pinch-point (36"), but you could make the aisle on the right wider. That would set the island out farther from the perimeter, but dan's suggestion of making the perimeter counters deeper (light gray line) would help close the gap. Until exploring his ideas, I hadn't noticed how narrow the aisle to the right of the island is in the original plan.
Is that a bathroom to the right?
S + U thanked mama goose_gw zn6OHS + U
3 years agoI attached the entire floor plan here. I have also made 3 more alternatives per everyone’s suggestions. Please keep giving me your valuable advices!. I will try to answer each question. But first and foremost, I want to thank everyone who is reading my post and trying to help me with my questions. I am so grateful for you all!
1. To Diana Bier Interiors, LLC : I am not a designer, I wish I was though😉 We have worked with an architect firm for quite some time for the entire house renovation. We have tried everything to make the best out of the limited space for the kitchen and a powder room (a must for us) on the 2nd floor. Finally, we came up with this general idea. I would love to hear from our Houzz community. BTW, venting the range hood is not an issue per our contractor. My main concerns are those 6 questions listed in my first post.
2. To Lisa Dipiro : the reason for 36” walkway to the right side of the island: there is really not much traffic going on as all action is taking place on the other side of the island. So, we chose to give more space to the island. As for the fridge, we are using Sub-zero and its doors can be opened 90 degree, so no space needed for that part of the wall. Would you think this still works (walkway)?.
3. To clt3 : we cooked one turkey in the past 25 years. So, we decided to go with XXL Miele Combi-steam oven (24”W x 24”H) which can fit a 15 -20 lb bird if we really want to cook another turkey in the next 25 years. Heard that the combi-steam oven is amazing:)
4. To mama goose_gw zn6OH : wow, amazing mind. Shrinking the island, moving the peninsular to give a full counter around the corner wall! Should I try to put the wall ovens against that wall? I did a few more drawings. Your thoughts? Agree with no bar sink and a 30” range top.
5. To dan1888 and mama goose_gw zn6OH : great thinking! We have tried to turn the island by 90 degree again and again in the past. But the distance btw the range and island is at 5 to 6ft, even if the main counter row is deepened. We are afraid 5-6ft is too wide. I am only 5’2” and plays the main chief in the house currently.
6. To live_wire_oak : love your philosophy. Yes we wanted to have EVERYTHING in this small kitchen don't we? We will have to give up something here in this space, you are right.
7. To Buehl l: many details I left out at the first post. My bad. Please see the entire floor plan. The walls are pretty much fixed. The “+/-“s or “?”s are due to uncertainties as the entire house is to be rebuilt. We are a family of two, just myself and the hubby. But I am a mother who is longing for her grown up children to come back home on weekends or one day perhaps with their wives and my grandchildren too. Food prep/cooking, entertaining is all in our plans when we retire. I do not like people watching me to cook. The husband wants to learn baking when he retires but that may never happen as he loves his job too much. Thanks for all the links on kitchen design! Very helpful.
Diana Bier Interiors, LLC