Oh Jinny that's unfortunate, I am sorry you lost it. I am nervous going into this next winter now that I have so many more tree's, I know there's bound to be a casualty. I have to agree that its a fast grower, I cannot believe how well its rebounded after I stressed it and it defoliated. I can only imagine how much nicer/bigger it would look now if it hadn't. I have to admit I was a little disappointed in the size of the tree when I first saw it but now I realize that it doesn't really matter that much, I got a few other varieties in the same size from One Green World and don't mind waiting a little longer for bigger crops. I haven't had the pleasure of ordering from Stan yet but everyone I have seen buy from him has a good experience.

Too late now for charts. I have most of the trees I want to have. lol. I am familiar with the chart and referred to it many times for other things. When people see "dwarf" anywhere, common sense is that they expect a tree to top out around 6-8' max., and I see there is a disclaimer on the chart that if the tree is containerized and pruned, the tree can be maintained at that heighth. Here is my background. I have been growing citrus since 1984 or so and always believed dwarf trees topped out around 6-10' depending on pruning habits. I have grown semi-dwarf stone fruit trees in CA and they were about 12-14' tall with pruning. Computers were not invented then so I believed whatever FW advertised because I had no way to dispute it at the time. No Google when computers first came out either. To find out 40 or so years later that the root stock used by FW is not a true dwarf as advertised is shocking. My trees from them have always been small. The first group I had were either in wine barrels or planted in the ground and they grew slowly. After planting some in the ground, a few years later I moved to another house so I really did not get to see the inground trees mature. I took my containerized trees with me to the new house and 3 years later again had to move across country and left those trees behind. At no time, did I ever have a tree get older than 5-6 years old due to moves. Because of short-term ownership of FW trees, I believed all my trees would remain small. The Owari and Meyer I currently have are 3.5' tall x 4' wide right now. They are 15 and rarely pruned. After joining citrus forums and FB pages for the past 6 months, I see now that I have not been caring for them as I should by changing out the soil annually or fertilizing monthly. I did fertilize quarterly as commonly instructed. I am embarrassed by that but it wasn't done intentionally, just out of ignorance. Now that I see everybody else's trees in comparison, I feel bad for my trees and have seen the errors of my ways. I am 57 years old and my husband is 60. We do not want to deal with huge trees in large containers because of the weight factor as the trees mature and the trees need to come inside the house for the winter. The more you prune, either the canopy or the roots, the trunk stem is going to get bigger and heavier with age. That is my major concern. The majority of the members here are young and have a long time ahead of them before walking in our shoes. Dummy me didn't check the tags when buying from the big box stores either. I just focused on the varieties available. lol. That is the citrus addiction which I suffer from. lol. Anyway, that is why I am so focused on root stock now. Hindsight is always 20-20. I really need a dwarf root stock to continue enjoying this hobby as I go further into my senior years. Suzanne, I was composing this as you posted. No I have not seen a 100 year old bonsai.

Bob I think that most people get to many varieties and burn out on the associate problems and end up quitting. I know of several past people who lost power to their green house and lost 30 to 40 trees. They looked for more trees with advice from us and then left. These trees are expensive. If I decide to quit citrus I will let you all know and why. When I first started I posted a lot with picture and a lot of other people got mad and they let me know in very rude ways. I am still here and Better than 15 of them are gone. It is too bad because they were a real asset to the group Jay We eat them like an orange or mandarin. Gave away 1 each to 4 closest friends. It is well worth growing. I have eaten 45 fruits total from 3 different trees. Steve

Update. My NZL seedling has seen more than 30 hard frosts with lows of 25F, 22F, 22F, 20F, and now it is going to get a 15F tonight. The tree is kept out of sunlight to insure full dormancy for this test and will be placed after sunset in this insulated doughnut hole so the roots mimic an in ground mulched tree. This is to determine the limits of an NZL tree to a rare hard freeze. How long can I leave my potted citrus trees outside before they absolutely have to come inside. Steve