Summers, I discovered Peter is just 5miles off the road on my way to visit my Dad in Maine. I had hoped to visit him(Peter) when I went there this past Fall, but came back through a different route. This summer I will plan it better with the hopes of having another birthday there! I ordered a few roses and have another I'd like to see in person so I could just pick them up then. I'm usually focusing on the garden when I'm there and get too flustered to get any roses while visiting. I hope to get a lilac this year also. I should pm you as I'd love to know what roses you have gotten from him since I think we have similar BS pressure and zone.

roseseek, I think the anti-gmo fever is high in Europe and its use not nearly as prevalent as here, especially as RU use is restricted (if not banned). I find it hard to believe they would market this rose there given that sentiment.

Summers, Please reread Kenneth's posts. In his *first* post on the matter he said, "Do you know I inspect all my neighbors knock out yearly searching for rrd if I spot it I make them remove them . Yes you hear me." He has several times clarified that he helps to enforce the HOA rule that *diseased* roses be removed. I envy him that ability. I will have to watch large swaths of commercial plantings die-off one by one over the course of several years knowing that the virus is being spread the entire time. I dislike HOAs, but in this context they are probably saving other people's Gardens. You think that's an overstep. We get it.

We are back.

Sorry about that.

The cat must have been chewing on some wires.

Well, isn't THAT "interesting"....? Don't look at me. I have NO cat, simply three "tiny, tyrant Goddesses". The only Internet time they log is either sitting on the lap top keyboard to DEMAND attention or pushing it off my lap as that is THEIR spot. Plus, they like the warmth. When I'm irritated at them and wish to insult them, I call them "cat".

I would be thrilled if RRD afflicted roses were forced to be removed. This is an epidemic of serious proportions. It is an emergency and affects others. One has to look after plant populations health as well as people. So sad. Thank you Kenneth for doing that.

@Sheila “I would be thrilled if RRD afflicted roses were forced to be removed. This is an epidemic of serious proportions. Thank you Kenneth for doing that.”

Agreed. If Kenneth is helping police this issue on behalf of his HOA, then he is to be congratulated. It’s not difficult to see that not everyone understands such efforts, let alone appreciates them. It can be a thankless task at times, I’m sure, and it can expose him to harsh (and dare I say unwarranted?) criticism. If only everyone who encountered an RRD infected rose made a similar effort we might actually have a hope of reigning in the disease. As it stands, however, it’s unlikely we will halt its spread. We’re looking at a future in which public display rose gardens will be a thing if the past. So be careful what you ask for. I believe this is an instance where “the greater good” is worth the price.

So kudos to Kenneth for making an effort. I’m certain he would make the same effort to destroy infected roses no matter what the variety - his agenda is the eradication of RRD, not eradication of any particular cultivar. (Not intending to put words in anyone‘s mouth, of course)

There is also a sister thread on the Rose Hybridizers Association I started the same day. You might find Don's comment added today at 7:55 AM about the merits of the utility patent application rather interesting.

Here is the utility patent. http://appft.uspto.gov/netacgi/nph-Parser?Sect1=PTO1&Sect2=HITOFF&d=PG01&p=1&u=%2Fnetahtml%2FPTO%2Fsrchnum.html&r=1&f=G&l=50&s1=%2220190380294%22.PGNR.&OS=DN/20190380294&RS=DN/20190380294

Thank you for the link. From that it's also apparent that they lay claim to any sports that spontaneously arise.

Does anyone know what role, if any, the hybridizer and his family/company played in this plan?

Was he/ were they the architect/ originator of the plan? Or a willing participant, if not the mastermind?

Or was he/were they blindsided by the plan, and powerless to stop it?

Or something else?

I do not know how the Rose industry works. I certainly know nothing about the arrangement amoungst Ball, CP and Meilland.

Does anyone know? Who is involved; who is innocent?

The hybridizer applies for the patent in this case may Lan. I believe that star roses is that us distributor.

The utility patent is American. Apparently, there isn't this type of patent available for plants in Europe. It would be Star's decision. Also, apparently, this Meilland either had no knowledge of it or feigns ignorance. Per what was posted to Face Book by a Dutch nurseryman who spoke to the Meillands..." I spoke with Mathias Meilland. Absolutely not true. It impossible to protect the genes. Bollox! "

On Wikipedia, “ bollox” redirects here

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bollocks

You for that clarification thank you. I didn't think it was possible that someone that didn't hybridize the plant would be able to patent it. Who applied for the original patent in the United States. Isn't that Mayland? Excuse my voice recognition spelling.

Employees of Meilland bred the rose, which means Meilland "owns" it. Star is their US agent, therefore Star has the right and responsibility to protect it as they feel appropriate in the markets they control. The breeder assigns rights to whomever they create contract rights with. If you read old registrations in ARS annuals, you will see MANY "patent assigned to J&P, Armstrong, etc.".

I've never been drawn to the knockouts. In my weird brain they are to vuloptuous antique roses as koolaid is to 100% real juice (or wine). I'm sorry if that offends anyone. There are just so many others I'd pick first.

Lesli, I don't think anyone should be offended.

I don't have any currently, but I like them a lot because they are essentially bulletproof.

If my roses don't do well this spring, I'll get a few knockouts just to get SOMETHING that has color and foliage.

JC, if you want bulletproof Try Pink pet.

Thanks vapor, it is now on the list haha

Well they, Knock Outs, are not "bullet proof" in Huntsville, Alabama. They are essentially an annual that lasts for two or three years before getting the virus and dying.

tigereye, I don't think there's any rose verifiably immune to RRD nor all fungal diseases, unfortunately. : ((

JC, I'm glad you'll consider PP! I have 5 and am adding 2 more this year in my "hell" spot where they get minimal care and most other roses have died. I have many others that may be as healthy, but do not bloom as constantly.

that's exactly what I think I'll end up with.

If I'm being honest, I really won't devote as much time to growing roses as everyone here does.

I think I planted close to 60 last spring and got very little out of them. Most are still alive, but very few are in ideal conditions.

If I don't see some major improvements this year, I'll go after pink pet and other "easy care" roses.

Sorry the knockouts don't work for you, tigereye. I think I had 18 at my previous house (which is how I ended up on this forum) and they all grew like gangbusters and bloomed continuously from April through October.

So strange, I'm less than a 2 hours drive from Huntsville.

JC, I think the point is that there are many rose that should do as well for you as KOs that are "prettier" in form and fragrant, not that I'm "knocking" KOs. I have a double pink KO myself, but that is the nicest of the lot, IMO. )) I'm very curious as to what other roses you have and in what conditions they grow. Do you have this info on HMF? 60 is a lot, but I wouldn't expect much in their first growing season, anyway. For me, shade is the killer and I'm gradually narrowing down which will actually do well with less than full sun.

JC im in your same zone and look at what my gardens look like mid summer ..... and lilyfynch had a beautiful rose garden . I find that comment interesting ... if you don’t want to work I would stick to kolorscapes , belindas , earth kind because the other gorgeous ones do require more maintance .

vapor and kenneth, shade is my biggest problem.

I have maybe 20 own root david austin's in my foundation beds and those definitely get way less than ideal sun. I planted them late march or early april of 2019.

Additionally, I planted a bunch of own root climbers at the base of a lot of trees that are also shaded and have lots of root competition.

I currently have 1 rose that gets full sun.

I knew it would be challenging to get them to do what I wanted, but almost all have survived so I'm going to be patient and keep working with them this year.

I'm also planting 7-10 new ones in ideal spots so I won't have to wait so long.

I'll also say that I'm tree trimming this winter so hopefully can get these guys some more sun throughout the day,

Keep us posted. Are you growing any once-bloomers up your trees? Some get 6 weeks of bloom I've read, which is quite long IMO. I would recommend Ceske Praci Cest which may get some rebloom when established. PP does do well with shade. For the Kolorscapes, I'd recommend Fire Opal. Both Lilyfinch and I love this rose. Milano Kolorscape BSs terribly for me. Both Pink and Red Drift are excellent here with Pink being the more constant bloomer. For climbers in the shade, my best have been Ghislaine de Feligonde and Peggy Martin. New Dawn and Awakening will stay healthy in dappled shade, but the bloom is much reduced compared to those I grow in full sun. Chuckles and White Meidiland are also outstanding bush forms in the shade/part sun as are the Hybrid Musks Belinda and Bubble Bath. I'll have to report back later about others I planted last summer and fall. I probably already wrote this for you on another post, but maybe it can help someone else. : D

JC do you like rugosa's, Gallica's, Hybrid Musks are supposed to be shade tolerant, Gallica and Hybrid China will take filtered sun IMO, but we have strong sun. Once bloomers tolerant it better than some repeat bloomers.

Jc I have a kardinal kolorscape im removing from a prime spot to make room for evelyn . You can have her if you like .....

Healthy bush its to right of Charlotte .

! Go get it JC! Lol! :-)

I also have lemon fizz ....

That is cheery Kenneth! Does it have any fragrance at all?

Kenneth, I'm sorry I know I've asked you before- where are you located?

I'm not above coming to take that off your hands for you.

Jen actually dropped a couple of roses off for me last year!

I'm growing 6 Veilchenblau and 1 Chianti as my once-bloomers.

They are less than 1yr in ground as own roots so not a whole lot of progress just yet. If they do well this year, I may add more of them.

Veilchenblau is one of my favorite ramblers. I am going to try to root mine so I can have one up front too. It should do awesome for you . My Chianti is new, so can't comment much on it yet.

Alana, if I remember from a couple of years ago, I think you are the poster who grows more once-bloomers than anyone.

I would not mind trying some next year if these don't work out.

I do grow more once bloomer, than repeat. In the summer, it's hot, and to get rebloom, I would have to supplement lots of water and time. So since I generally shut down with the plants , I love the once bloomers, plus I love their habitats, fall color, fall canes, and I grow a few repeat bloomers, so get to enjoy bloom in the fall from them. Win win. I really recommend them to anyone with the room, and a cold winter. To me since we do get hot in summer, I know the gallicas especially love a good soil, and afternoon shade, I even grow some in filtered sun/shade, and they do great there. with anything, it's location, location, location. I finally have some Teas growing up front, where there is more sun, goodluck, with whatever you choose, and share pictures!

This 4th of July, the nightmare begins....

...Petite Knock Out comes to a nursery near you! I must say, even without RRD it’s an ugly little urchin.

OMG. Who would buy such an ugly thing?!

...it's pretty much the abomination I was expecting...

I agree with you all, especially considering there are so many lovely charming smaller roses that already fill this niche.

I tried one Knock Out rose once ( I think it was the blush one) and I was astonished. In my garden in Northern CA, with mild wet winters and sunny, dry summers, with not much BS "pressure", it got mildew and BS. I do not spray, so I waited several years to see if it would "grow out of it". No luck, so I eventually had to shovel prune it, which I almost never do. I have over 150 roses of several different types, mostly older, which are happy here. I was so surprised that the KO rose, which of course was rather blah looking, did not even do what it was advertised to do - stay healthy! I presume that they do stay healthy somewhere, perhaps where they were developed, but not here. Again a problem of a rose which does well in one place being universally advertised as doing great everywhere. An old, old, story.

Jackie

Jackie -- SOMEONE -- I don't recall who, but it was long ago -- told me that the reason we don't typically see Knockout roses for sale here in CA is that they mildew here like mad.

I guess they blackspot, TOO? That would say to me, they are resistant to the strains of BS typically seen in the East, but not resistant to those we have here.

That information promptly ended any desire I might have had to grow a Knockout rose. ANY Knockout rose. (I don't even like the name! I wouldn't mind growing 'Happy Butt', but no Knockouts need apply.)

You Californians are so lucky, I wish all the Knock Outs here would mildew themselves into oblivion, too.

ew. I wonder if there is going to be another wave of rrd, because the people that buy these, won't know what it is. Again. Things that would have helped me before I ever bought a rose - Two stickers on the plant. One explaining what grafted is, if it's grafted. One explaining rrd. I know some people don't read labels, but a lot of people do. I think the knockout makers have given me the motivation to rip out these knock outs that were here when I moved in. There are at least 6 of them out front, and they are getting burned. I suspect that's where the midge came from, because the plants I bought for here were not infected. So long, and I will also tell people about the new monsanto.

Knock Out is healthy here in Sydney, Australia. A lot of california bred (ie Carruth) get spotty here so possibly some overlap with east coast USA and Au, regarding BS strains.

Can anyone confirm if the utility patent was granted? I know it was only applied for at the time this thread started.

Witchy

I totally agree you, when buying roses in stores, there should be an educational flyer attached explaining RRD. I’m of a mind to put my own warning label at my local HDs , Walmart’s, Lowes and Costcos myself, lol. I’m also concerned that people will replace their dead knockouts with the new petites, plant them en masse and then leave them to develop into RRD breeding grounds once again. I’ve already seen masses of drifts replacing dead knockouts in shopping plazas, and you already know the fatal cycle of disease will repeat itself!

Which of these beauties will be coming home with you for $29.99? My only hope is nobody will buy these awful plants!

Sorry (not sorry), those travesties are just ug-er-ly. Who could even TELL if they were diseased or not? lol.