That’s an interesting layout, not just the kitchen but the whole house. Can you tell us a bit about your vision for the house, what you told your architect or draftsman? How many kids will live here? And, now I’m intrigued, where is the screen porch you go up a set of stairs to? And, if there is no room for a garage, where will you park and keep bikes?

Appreciate the quick response. We have 2 kids and plan to have 1 more, which is the basis for bedroom count upstairs. The existing house sits parallel to the street but at an acute angle to the property line, which is the main reason for the irregular shape of the house. Also, the rear of the house sits ~8 ft lower than the front ground floor. We will most likely add a screened porch above the garage, which would be in the back of the house and connected to the kitchen (see "possible garage location").

We asked our architect for - 5 bedrooms (4 upstairs), kitchen facing the back yard, screened porch in the back yard, play room for kids, and a reading room ("living room" in pic).

We are definitely open to any feedback on the design, thanks.

Wait. I don't understand. This is a design your architect came up with to presumably fit your site but then, at least in what appears to the first rendition, the garage is WAAAAY over the property line?

Are you remodeling an existing house?

@Architectrunnerguy I understand the confusion! We asked a designer to offer input on the first architectural design and she suggested a garage on the right. Our architect, in this design, was showing that it would not fit. I posted the existing house footprint below.

Have you considered an L or T shape house for this lot?

Is there a yard you want to have access to?

If the garage is at the back, and sounds like it will be lower than the kitchen, well, that changes everything, everything, for the kitchen and entry from the garage to the house.

The passage from the living room to the back of the house looks like it’s only 2’ wide?

Perhaps you need a different architect.

For me, mom of three kids, this layout would t work. The playroom is too far away from where I would be much of the time, when my kids were little anyway, and too close to the dining room when I wouldn’t want kids close lol!

We also have a change in level within each level. Our house opens to an entry where there is a powder, office, mud/laundry and closet. There are four steps down to an open living/dining/kitchen.

We opted to forgo the formal living and dining and have one big open area. That said we also have a basement with playroom there. Now that our kids are older (12,10,7) they easily play downstairs alone.

A friend of mine who built a house has a playroom directly off the family room. It has a barn door on it so can be closed and separate easily. It means they see the kids nearby but keep kid clutter out of family room.

Pro Source I 100% disagree. As kids are a playroom changes but it’s a dedicated kid space and if you have the space it’s wonderful to have. What goes in the room ebbs and flows but having it is awesome

Is this a massive addition or are you tearing down the current house and building new on your existing lot? It's not clear from your posts.

@Denita This is a massive addition. This is the existing footprint (one floor with a basement and an attic):

Too confused to comment, other than rely on the architect and stay away from the designer.

@bpath - this is an addition. Please see my previous post with the existing floor plan. We have about .3 acres behind the house. I've asked the architect to see if the garage can go in the front of the house, but most likely it cannot due to set backs. That space between the "living room" and back of the house is incredibly small and needs to be addressed.

I believe the kids will spend most of the time in the family room when they're young and need to be watched. I doubt we/kids would use that dedicated play room often.

Make sure the architect is licensed and proficient with structural design.

Evaluate the possibility of tearing it down and starting new.

@Mark Bischak, Architect Mark, does showing the existing floor plan help? I posted that a minute ago. I would love feedback from an architect on the flow of the house.

@Mark Bischak, Architect He's a licensed architect with 30 years experience. His admits his strength is on the analytical side and not so much on the creative.

It might be a happy circumstance that your garage can't go in front. It will keep the front from being dominated by a garage.

Does your lot have enough room to have a detached garage in the back?

Unless I missed it I only saw a portion of your lot where the designer tried to ignore lot lines and easements :(

You have some significant constraints. I agree with Mark Bischak, having a good, creative architect with the skills he mentions on your actual site is best. I would be interested in seeing what your architect proposes for your unique situation.

@ProSource Memphis We realize this is a big project. These initial drawings are for a contractor to provide us with a quote to determine if it's feasible.

@Denita Well said...it's what we were thinking, too. Yes, the majority of the .5 acre lot is the backyard.

I appreciate everyone's concerns - I share the same! My main objective was to ask the community for input on the floor layout, specifically the kitchen and family room design.

I did see the existing plan, and that is what sparked my concern about the structure. Some of those walls have to be bearing walls.

There are a lot of factors involved in remodelings and additions, most of which are difficult to communicate without being physically in the structure and on the site. Small decisions may have monumental ramifications.

Will you do this project if it costs as much as building a completely new to you house? Or more? Because that’s likely going to be the case. Remodels cost double plus per square foot as new construction. Or more, if it’s really difficult transition between the two. Like yours. You don’t need to take up a contractor’s time to do a quote to tell you that. All you need is a working knowledge of construction.

I’d suggest stopping right now, before you get lost in the weeds on small details. Pay a couple of contractors a couple of thousand to sit down with you for a gut check on the rough concept as it exists, and costs. That should have been done before hiring the architect.

If you are really interested only in the kitchen/family room, then I’d suggest moving the kitchen to the right-hand wall, wrapping towards the dining room, and have the family room move back into where you were thinking of moving the fridge and pantry. That way your family room gets some natural light. And, I’d move the door to the master bedroom over to next to the stairs. That way you go through the serene reading room, but you are also closer to the foot of the stairs for easy access to the kids. Honestly, I’d have the stairs land in the awkward middle space, not where they are now, and move the dining room door to the right.

But, you still have to do something about the narrow passage from the reading room to the rest of the house, it just doesn’t make sense. And the garage entry, if you build a garage in back. And you may as well rework the upstairs so it flows bette without a bathroom smack dab in the middle of the floor.

Perhaps you should listen to your architect, and find someone with a bit more creativity?

@Mark Bischak, Architect Understood, thanks.

@live_wire_oak Thanks for the advice. In the debate of renovating v new build, we would opt for new build if the price were the same or close so we're not adapting to an existing layout. We have only paid a small amount for these construction drafts. We may decide to tear it all down depending on the contractor's quote for the renovation.

@Mark Bischak He's a licensed architect with 30 years experience. His admits his strength is on the analytical side and not so much on the creative.

What this shows is you need an architect with creative skills more than analytical. Your original layout works. The new one has massive flow problems, especially the upstairs with those bedrooms and the hall bath. Just poor.

And the master bath with a toilet room that is about 10' long and 3' wide?

Let me give you a hint. Your original house works because all major rooms have windows on 2 walls. This "architect" wound up putting working and non public rooms on the outer walls and leaving the public rooms in the middle with bad flow.

Please do yourself a HUGE favor and find a creative architect and start over.

And yes depending on the age of the house and whether or not it has any historical significance, you might be better off knocking it down and building new. Or moving.

When we were looking to build we were also open to buying a house with a decent footprint/bones and adding on to it. Our builder gave us sample budgets of similar projects to compare. Yes renovations have surprises that come up that adds an element but it was going to be about 300k less to add a floor than it would have been to build new. He said it was because foundation and some framing done already. Makes sense as tear down and excavation are substantial costs

@cpartist I appreciate the candid feedback and agree with everything you said. Do you believe we can use the existing space with an addition to accomplish ideal flow or is the existing footprint sub-optimal for an addition?

Will are you adding a floor? If so this is just a shell and the layout of existing is somewhat irrelevant in a major renovation.

Yes, we are adding the upstairs. Currently, it's an unfinished attic. We're knocking down most of the walls downstairs so it is basically a shell.

You could simplify by placing the master suite where the original dining and kitchen are. Build a new kitchen at the back, where the two bedrooms are. The den? porch? off the living room would make a lovely reading room, and the living room could be a family room or dining room. The third bedroom, dining? Playroom that will eventually by a sitting/tv room?

Adding a simple upstairs, but might not be that simple depending on the current elevation of the house, it might not turn out well.

@mama goose_gw zn6OH that upstairs flows a lot better, thanks. If there's not an attached garage in the back, stairs would be involved from the basement. Not ideal.

For everyone, this may help show the entire yard, existing footprint, and possible expansion.

There have been many comments since I started working on this version, and I will admit to being as confused as others--but I'll post it anyway. Maybe it will help you visualize a family room, or spark another idea (or further confuse you). I kind of rearranged the back stairs, mudroom, and back door, but it seems that might have not been necessary?

Rearranged upstairs super-imposed on rearranged first floor to compare bearing walls, drains, etc.:

@cpartist I appreciate the candid feedback and agree with everything you said. Do you believe we can use the existing space with an addition to accomplish ideal flow or is the existing footprint sub-optimal for an addition?

I think if you add an L it might work or just build up and reconfigure the downstairs without adding on.

@mama goose_gw zn6OH I like this direction. I appreciate the constructive feedback and drawing ideas. FYI - the steps to the right of "dishes" are no longer needed as the garage and screened in porch will not fit in that area - sorry for the confusion.

Any comments on @mama goose_gw zn6OH's design?

This is the whole lot using the designers initial idea of expanding over the lot line, right?

I assume you don't own the lot next door so that makes that part of the expansion unfeasible.

As to the garage, I can't think of a worse location than where it is shown on the lot. It serves as a huge block to any view of the yard. I'm not a designer. I'm a Realtor. But I can see with the location of the garage that way it would be a deal killer for most buyers. Even if you plan to stay there many years, who wants no windows for the first floor for a large proportion of the planned expansion. I'm just looking at it through 'buyers' eyes. Light and view are also as important as privacy and functional access. To me you would be building in "functional obsolescence" with this layout. JMO. Take it for what it's worth :)

If I were in your shoes, I would look for a different architect as others have indicated. You really need someone creative and onsite. I would also detach that garage and set it back so you get windows on the expansion that have a view. You appear to have enough room from the little bit of info provided.

Without the back door, I extended the cabinets on the range/fridge wall, and moved everything down far enough to expand the pantry. The mudroom door now aligns with the stairs (green line).

I also adjusted some of the walls upstairs to better correspond with the walls below, in the plan I rearranged. There is space on the pantry wall for shallow storage, book cases, entry table, or another piece of furniture. I want to make it clear that I am just throwing out ideas, and will defer to architects and designers.

Again, super-imposed:

Did the term "load bearing wall" or "point load" ever come up?

Mark if they are keeping the shell of the house and redoing it all then wouldn't they frame the new walls as needed to be structurally sound?

No. That’s not how that works. Load paths of the old and new are critical intersections. It’s usually where all of the trouble and a lot of the money is. The old bearing walls will need to be engineered with a completely new foundation for the new heavier point loads that will carry the new beams needed to change the load paths and open up the space. That’s why this is a very expensive proposition.

I’ll echo getting a builder on board as a paid consultant now. What usually happens is the clients think the plans will cost 1M, but the remodel plans come back from the builders as 2.5M, and the clients can buy a new home just down the road for 1.5M.

Thanks Cook’s Kitchen! The price difference you give was nowhere near what our builder suggested adding a floor would be. Our new build was substantially more, in the end, than the budget for adding a floor.

I genuinly appreciate everyone’s input and time they spent responding. I’ll return to the thread once we have updated plans to share for further critiquing.

What Cook's Kitchen said.

@Will Lucas -- At least please consider the layout of the two upstairs bedrooms to have closets on the separation wall, as shown on your existing plan:

Instead of:

Bad flow and wasted spaces. how do you get from the garage into the kitchen? An architect or designer drew this?

Totally agree with MammaGoose about moving that upstairs jack/Jill bathroom over against the wall.