Hello Moses !! My first very quick guess is that other countries are a little more environmentally friendly than we are with our chemical solutions to problems. I mean that as no insult as I’m glad we have options if needed but they can come with consequences. That’s just my guess ! It’s great we are able to get roses so healthy from other breeders, maybe more will catch on !

Probably what Lily said, plus maybe they dont really want to breed for disease resistance. If they die, we have to buy new ones just like everything else thats poorly made and made to break, wear out etc. Just a guess lol.

I hate to say this, but fungal disease is mostly an east of the Rockies problem. So there are plenty of areas in the arid West that don't have these issues, from near Spokane, down to Eastern Oregon and on to Boise, east to Wyoming, southeast to Utah, lots of places in California and on and on. That doesn't mean rose hybridizers shouldn't breed for disease resistance, but they have relied on Eastern gardeners using antifungal sprays to keep their roses clean. That's not going to cut it anymore. I thought of a couple of Carruth roses that are showy HTs, but I can't say how well they resist fungal disease. Have you had experience with Twilight Zone, a grandflora, or the HT Memorial Day, to name two? Diane

What Lily said. Germans, for instance, have always been way more environmentally concerned than Americans. One still hears American Rose Growers express the opinion, with regards to Rose cultivation, that "that's what the chemical industry is for". Plus, it's worth noting that at least one of the very largest Distributors / decision-makers is based in California. It takes a pretty deplorable Rose to suffer black spot there anything near what we have on the East Coast.

I was so excited by NewFlora's introductions of kordes roses, but I am, quite frankly, worried now that star has bought them out, as to whether the priorities will remain the same, and if we will continue to get good strong disease-resistant roses.

Thank you, Nanadoll, for your suggestions. Unfortunately, Memorial Day is a bad black spotter here, as beautiful and fragrant as it is.

Now, I have had my eye on Twilight Zone for some time, but no one I know of here grows it. So I will seek out intel on it. I have heard reports on the forum that it is a superior rose to Ebb Tide. Maybe it was you who said so!

Moses

TZ is a superior rose to Ebb Tide, I think, except that Ebb Tide has a stronger, lovely scent. I grow several of both roses, and won't give up Ebb Tide, in spite of its faults--mainly fading out in the heat. Diane

Several Carruth roses and a few other U.S. bred roses are fairly resistant for me. I would think that with the healthier European bred varieties being more in demand here, that would make the breeders here realize that‘s something they need to be more concerned about.

Some Western States have powdery mildew and other diseases. Ive never had PM here but blackspot does reign in FL. I remember getting PM in California, rust too. I dont get rust here in FL on roses. Sometimes the fig leaves get it at the end of the season before they drop their leaves.

Arizona (Phoenix) is probably the only place I had roses disease free. As long as they got enough sun and water they were great. The worst pest I had there was japanese beetles. Florida is a pest haven on roses and most the other plants. So was Louisiana.

I think as far as hardiness is concerned, since you mentioned winter damage, there is a mindset amongst colder zone gardeners that HTs are all too fragile and roses are out of reach for them so why bother trying? I have lost count of the number of excellent gardeners I have met who hear that I am growing roses in inhospitable sounding locations and are just amazed. "I had no idea you could grow that here!" "Oh, roses don't grow here, it gets too cold." "I would love to grow roses, but I have never tried because someone told me they would all die." "You grow roses? I bet you have a greenhouse." So they assume themselves out of success before they even try, and take themselves out of the potential market. If they would all jump in and start growing roses, a lot more of a noise would be made for a winter hardy HT, and maybe development would veer that direction.

I do agree with Lily about the chemical issue. I dearly love my adopted USA but growing up in New Zealand which is famous for its clean green image I have been absolutely horrified at the number of additives and preservatives and chemicals and poisons which are considered perfectly normal over here and can be found in everything from food to household substances to gardening products. What is considered 'normal' where I grew up, a moderately healthy, not too many chemical additives lifestyle achievable for most people, is over here a time consuming and rather expensive research mission. I am not anti spray nor completely organic, but I think there is a lot of room for improvement in the market for what is available. That is just my two cents and I hope it doesn't tread on any toes.

Nandoll.... I LOVE your Twilight Zone. I have this rose. It is an own root that got from Chamblee's several years ago. I had it in the ground but it was growing backwards. I put it in a pot and it is doing much better... but mine is not that BEAUTIFUL purple.... mine is more pinkish.... I sure wish it was purple like yours.....

Do you notice if yours turns color because of heat?

No matter what, yours sure is lovely.

Sharon

Moses, what about Hawkeye Bell.... Country Music, and Gee Whiz.... these are rated for 4b and 3a .... I would think that they would not have much dieback... I am not in your zone though.... but I just bought Hawkeye Bell because of its winter hardiness.... I hope to get a few more of Buck's roses. I think he bred them for disease resistance and for scent..... I want to get some of his stippled roses too....

Sharon, thank you so much for your comments. What zone are you in? If you are in a really hot part of the country, maybe TZ needs a bit of shade. I have two TZs, both are grafted on Dr Hewey which I think is best here for TZ. Own root roses don't grow as fast or bloom as much as grafted roses in my garden. The TZ in the photos is the darker of my two, partly because of its age (I got it the year TZ came on the market (2013?). My other TZ seems to be a little lighter, but still quite dark, and it's about 1-2 years old. They don't fade much in the heat. Diane

Seems like many of the hybridizers are in California where there is less disease pressure, and no concerns about hardiness. There’s a few new intros from other breeders, but not necessarily HT. Sorry Nanadoll, TZ is not super hardy for me, and has poor disease resistance here, much as I would love to see it look like yours!

Sharon,

I must have tried close to ten Buck roses over the years. In my garden winter hardiness, surprisingly so, was a major issue for all, but Aunt Honey and Quietness. Aunt Honey gets some black spot, unlike Quietness with its pristine foliage.

There was not total winter kill, but enough damage every winter to keep the other Buck bushes undersized, never reaching their potential. I have yet to give Jim's 'Earth Song,' a try in my garden. I should. Do you know that Carefree Beauty had severe dieback for me. Go figure!

Moses

Haven't you noticed the American rose breeding firms are going away? J&P closed their hybridizing operation in 2011. And Baileys stopped theirs before that.

Good point^^^. Who are the US firms breeding HTs today? The ones who Moses says are stuck on idle.