Undocumented immigrants paid $117B in state and local taxes

sherwoodva

States will be losing revenue if all of the undocumented immigrants are deported.


"But it’s also worth noting that undocumented immigrants are paying billions of dollars in state and local taxes each year — in all 50 states.


While it’s impossible to get the exact numbers because of the limited data available, researchers at the left-leaning Institute on Taxation & Economic Policy estimate that undocumented workers paid a total of $11.7 billion in state and local taxes in 2014, the most recent year of data, according to their 2017 report.


That includes $7 billion in sales taxes and excise taxes, which are those paid on specific items like gas sales and vehicle registrations. Undocumented immigrants, like everyone else, pay for highway repairs, state courts, police, and firefighters. They also paid about $1.1 billion in state income taxes and $3.6 billion in property taxes that year — money that funds public schools, garbage collection, and other city services.


Undocumented workers contribute the most tax dollars to states with the largest populations: California, Texas, and New York. Yet some states that benefit the most from their tax money are red and blue states that Trump won in 2016: Florida, Georgia, Texas, North Carolina, and Arizona."


https://www.vox.com/2019/3/1/18241692/undocumented-immigrants-pay-state-local-taxes?utm_campaign=vox&fbclid=IwAR1yLCLdCFO82rg_xtTtOlmLFnNe_85_RF0DbyjKre97pGYeaK9EKrTn7UY

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SoFLUSA

that's 117B more that Trump has paid.

Let's export him and melly

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miss lindsey (still misses Sophie)(8a)

If there is still time, the OP title needs a decimal point :)

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sherwoodva

Miss Lindsey, you are right. My goof. How do I delete this? The RW won't read it anyway. Thanks!

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miss lindsey (still misses Sophie)(8a)

For a limited amt of time there is a "delete" button at the bottom of the post, next to the likes and comments buttons. It might be gone by now.

You could always just note it here in the comments :-)

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Kathy

Wait for it———

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foodonastump

11.7B divided by estimated 11MM undocumented immigrants in 2014 comes to $1064 per person.

I wish I could compare like years but I didn’t find that quickly. Here’s what I could find:

https://www.taxpolicycenter.org/briefing-book/what-breakdown-tax-revenues-among-federal-state-and-local-governments

So in 2016, 35% of $5.3T, or $1.855T state and local taxes. Divided by a population of 323MM averages $5743 per person.

So... the average undocumented immigrant in 2014 paid just 18.5% of what the average person paid in 2016. I realize this isn’t quite apples to apples, but regardless, the $1064 in my first paragraph doesn’t seem like a notably high number.

Open to mathematical corrections and counterarguments.

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elvis

While it’s impossible to get the exact numbers because of the limited data available, researchers at the left-leaning Institute on Taxation & Economic Policy estimate that undocumented workers paid ,,,

IOW, it's a huge guesstimate.

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grace_harper

How much are the US Taxpayers paying for services such as detention centers with TV, soccer fields, emergency medical care, anchor baby deliveries, education, housing, welfare, judicial and on and on. Why that is left out in this report. How much federal and state funds are spent on such resources ? California Gov signed a bill funding medical care for illegal aliens, who is paying for that?, NY singed a bill of 27$ Million funding tuition aid for illegal aliens, who will pay ? This is simply 'penny wise pound foolish'; banking on the taxes the illegal aliens pay which is a paltry sum compared to what US taxpayers pay to foot the bill for all other resources illegal aliens use and abuse.

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nancy_in_venice_ca Sunset 24 z10

California taxpayers are paying for the bill signed by Governor Gavin Newsom.

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Delilah66

How much did DC citizens pay for the last inauguration and July 4 celebrations? How much did the nation pay for all the legal wrangling about the census (oh we already have that data? Ok never mind)? How much will the nation pay for the upcoming frenzied assembling of the existing data? The US government’s spending has always been a boondoggle, but we’ve outperformed boondoggle under this administration.

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sherwoodva

All, it should read 11.7 billion. My typo. Plus, don't forget that they do the jobs Americans don't want to do, like picking crops.

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nopartyghost

How much have US taxpayers paid for donnie's golf weekends, his adult childrens' trips, mellie's extended stay in NY city after that loathsome clown moved to the WH? Talk about waste.

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cattyles

Trump costs us more and contributes way less. No comparison.

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elvis

...don't forget that they do the jobs Americans don't want to do, like picking crops.

True, serfs aren't really free, are they? In any sense.

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leona_2008

Yeah, and trump pays no taxes. One person costs us so much, not counting the collateral damage that will take years to undo.

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foodonastump

Deflecting from the topic at hand does not change the fact that they’re contributing far less to state and local taxes than the average person. If there is work for them that Americans can’t or won’t do, fine, let them come in under a guest worker program or similar. Let them be here legally because they went through a legal process. Not because they overstayed a visa or snuck past security.

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lurker111

And keep an eye on your property taxes.

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elaineinnj

They pay 11.7 Billion in taxes, but the taxpayers pay 18.5 Billion for their health care, it's not exactly a win-win.

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Joaniepoanie

elaineinnj

They pay 11.7 Billion in taxes, but the taxpayers pay 18.5 Billion for their health care, it's not exactly a win-win.

————

Source?

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Kathy

US needs the workers and Immigrants need work. Why can’t Congress work out a plan that benefits both. Making immigrants a political football doesn’t benefit anyone except the companies who are hiring them and the politicians using them as scapegoats for America’s problems. The blame goes to Congress and it has historically been the Republicans who want use it as a wedge issue.

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jerzeegirl(9b)

They pay 11.7 Billion in taxes, but the taxpayers pay 18.5 Billion for their health care, it's not exactly a win-win.

They do jobs that Americans won't do and that has a value that needs to be added to the equation.

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SoFLUSA

elaineinnj

They pay 11.7 Billion in taxes, but the taxpayers pay 18.5 Billion for their health care, it's not exactly a win-win.

————

Source?



------------


Lies and more lies of the far right wing.

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Ann

FOAS, I appreciate the time you took to provide the calculation which brought the topic into better perspective.

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Ann

Grace, I would imagine a very paltry sum in comparison!

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Ann

Joanie, FOAS just provided the source you requested of Elaine, in case you are checking back to read it.

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Joaniepoanie

That 18.5 figure is misleading I think. According to the Forbes article, In terms of what it actually costs taxpayers federally and locally the total is 7.4, while undocumented pay 11.7 in taxes. The article even states that hospitals charging the rest higher prices is very low, and of course that only pertains to people that are hospitalized. That, and physician charity does not impact all taxpayers. I also don't think you can factor in tax exemptions or exclusions because they are the same for all whether you're a citizen or not. And charity does not just go to undocumented. Many citizens cannot afford to pay or don't have insurance. Plus the article states that only 1/3 of of undocumented have no insurance where 2/3 have some sort of coverage.

It states that each person is paying $34 a year in healthcare for the undocumented. To me, this is a small price to pay for the people who serve me in some capacity throughout the year.......in the field picking my grapes, washing my dishes at the restaurant, cleaning my hotel room, painting my house, laying tile for me, mowing my lawn, etc..

I’d rather pay healthcare for these people than for Trump’s trips to MAL or NJ, his obscene July 4th spectacle, his kids flying around the world acting like dignitaries. I’d rather pay healthcare for these people than pay the salaries of such incompetents like Betsy DeVoss, Ben Carson and most of the Cabinet as well as total scumbags Mitch McConnell and Bill Barr.


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elvis

From Food's link:

All told, Americans cross-subsidize health care for unauthorized immigrants to the tune of $18.5 billion a year . Of this total, federal taxpayers provided $11.2 billion in subsidized care to unauthorized immigrants in 2016 .

Food, I posted this article last year. It killed the thread, as you can imagine!

This time I'm saving the link in my outside files. I'm sure it will come in handy down the road.

Again.

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elvis

To me, this is a small price to pay for the people who serve me in some capacity throughout the year.......in the field picking my grapes, washing my dishes at the restaurant, cleaning my hotel room, painting my house, laying tile for me, mowing my lawn, etc..

Fine, feel free to pay my share also.

Anyone else? jp is buying...

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Joaniepoanie

Fine Elvis....you pay my share of Trumps trips to MAL, Nj, ego July 4th spectacles, flying his kids around the world and salaries of all the useless Cabinet and senators like Graham and McConnell. Deal! And I’d have the bargain of the century in more ways than one!

ETA....Using your figures, taxpayers put in 11.2 for healthcare but undocumented pay 11.7 in taxes according to the OP so........that’s a $5 bil surplus after we’ve paid for healthcare, no?

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elvis

Using your figures, taxpayers put in 11.2 for healthcare but undocumented pay 11.7 in taxes according to the OP so........that’s a $5 bil surplus after we’ve paid for healthcare, no?

No.

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Joaniepoanie

Care to explain? Looks like simple math to me....they pay in 11.7 but use 11.2....that leaves a + balance of 5.0.

ETA....I didn't realize you were using FOAS’s Forbes article.....your link sent me to Twitter.

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foodonastump

JP are you implying that as long as they cover their own healthcare all’s well? What about all the other costs associated with being a member of our society? Educating their kids comes to mind as another big ticket item.

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Prim Rose

They are people, right? Not flies or gnats? Investing in people and expecting there will be a payoff, such as those jobs that USians can't or won't do, immigrants will do.

You're changing the goalposts. Like it or not, some "others" will end up in this country and be a part of our society. And like the rest of our society, they will have certain benefits.

When the wingers figure out how grapes will get picked from our 1%'rs vineyards - that's a different discussion.

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foodonastump

I have no problem with immigration. At controlled levels deemed appropriate by a hopefully generous nation. I have a problem with illegal immigration.

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miss lindsey (still misses Sophie)(8a)

Umm, just to break in with some math here.

$11.7bil-$11.2bil=$0.5bil

$0.5bil=$500,000,000=$500mil

Carry on.

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Joaniepoanie

you are correct lindsey......i had my decimal in the wrong place....oops!

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studio10001

For comparison's sake, the president cost us 11 billion w his last government shutdown. He does not pay taxes, speaks English as a second language, and has broken the law repeatedly since coming in to office. Please send ICE.

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cait1

I highly doubt that 11 million number. They've been using it for at least 10 years. For some reason the media snatches a number and can never let go of it.

And what is this nonsense about all illegals coming in to pick lettuce? Are you telling me the illegals from India, China, the Congo, Angola etc can't wait to pick lettuce?

No one will convince me that they are coming to labor in the fields; they come to reap the fruits of the welfare baskets hard working citizens slave away to fill.

When you come from nothing the so-called paltry welfare benefits feel like riches.

If these criminal freeloaders possessed any intelligence whatsoever they would be working to improve conditions in their own countries instead of coming here to sink ours.

And thank you, food, for taking the time to do the numbers.

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Ann

Like FOAS mentioned, controlled legal immigration is the only way this can work. What does the left want? You are on this thread arguing for the benefit of illegals and illegal immigration. Is that what you want - to allow illegals to enter at any rate and then to say for as long as they choose?

What the left doesn't want has become clear. No wall, no deportations. Can we get back to the discussion we used to have. Rather than criticizing any moves the Trump administration is making (like deportations), just for the sake of an understanding, what do you want in regard to the situation of so many illegals entering each day and then staying? Is that exactly what you want - for people to be able to enter per their choice and then stay per their choice? In other words, should the entire decision be up to those entering and none of it up to the U.S.? If you want any restrictions or removals, please explain under what circumstances you'd support a restriction or a removal?

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Carro

Ann, America is not allowed to arrest anyone entering illegally. We're not allowed to detain them. We're not allowed to put them through our due processes to determine if they meet asylum. We're not allowed to have ICE deport them if they've been through due process and have no asylum claim.

It's open borders because of "basic human rights".

Add on top of that giving anyone who wants to come here all the welfare they need from licenses to housing to food to healthcare to education to passive income to childcare.

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Carro

cait, immigrants can find work in Mexico. Conditions are better, much better. But Mexico isn't what they want. It's America and the promise of welfare which you really hit the nail on the head-- our welfare is comfortable living not just for them, but for anyone.

That's why they're bringing the whole family. Used to be the men came to work and send money back. Now why would they? America will support everyone-- the whole family and the more kids they have, the better.

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Ann

Carro, to me it seems that's what the left does now support, entirely open borders, no consequences for entering and staying, and support of every type once here.

But, frankly, I'd love for an HT participant on the left to correct that if it's wrong and if they say it's wrong, what do they want and what do they support. Every discussion has become what they oppose in terms of what is proposed to be done. I want to hear the other side, what they want. Is anyone on the left still saying you don't want open borders? If yes, please outline how that would look in terms of stopping anyone from entering or deporting anyone who shouldn't be here.

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Carro

Ann, if they don't support ICE deportation after due process in accordance with our laws, I'd like to know what they support, too.

Every single day, criminals are separated from their families. What I see is them caring about illegals' children and not American kids who are going through the same trauma due to the criminal actions of their parent.

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Ann Gale

Yes, Ann. We have repeatedly said that we are not in favor of open borders.

I guess y'all missed this thread.

https://www.gardenweb.com/discussions/5743696/whats-the-update-about-border-control-legislation#n=3

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miss lindsey (still misses Sophie)(8a)

Carro

2 hours ago

Ann, if they don't support ICE deportation after due process in accordance with our laws, I'd like to know what they support, too.

-------

Rather than rewrite it, I'll just copy and paste it from my response on another thread:

"Speaking only for myself, and using caps for emphasis not to shout:

I SUPPORT THE DEPORTATION OF PEOPLE WITH ORDERS TO THAT EFFECT.

I BELIEVE THAT GOVERNMENT AGENTS AND LAW ENFORCEMENT OFFICERS MUST OBEY THE LAW WITH REGARD TO SEARCH WARRANTS."

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Ziemia(6a)

Agree with miss lindsey's statement.

Must add that I expect the government to properly prioritize efforts to deport those with removal orders.

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Prim Rose

The "law" is becoming this thing with the right wing. They see it as flexible and there for them when they like it and dismissable when they don't.

We're a nation of laws. Too bad you don't like that they apply to EVERY person in this country.


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Ann

I'm very glad to hear that some liberals support the deportation of people with orders to that effect! That's good news and while I've not heard agreement on the steps Congress should take to change asylum loopholes, we have 1 million people in the U.S. with deportation orders, so agreement on what should happen with those million is a good start.

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Ziemia(6a)

This isn't new news about 'liberals' and deportations. It's been said numerous times the last two years.

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Joaniepoanie

carro


Add on top of that giving anyone who wants to come here all the welfare they need from licenses to housing to food to healthcare to education to passive income to childcare.


It's America and the promise of welfare which you really hit the nail on the head-- our welfare is comfortable living not just for them, but for anyone.

That's why they're bringing the whole family. Used to be the men came to work and send money back. Now why would they? America will support everyone-- the whole family and the more kids they have, the better.

-*******

-—

More of the same RW BS about migrants getting all manner of freebies. Try doing some legitimate research.

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foodonastump

I’m glad to hear that the left is supportive of deportations; like Ann I must have missed those threads myself but I’ll take Ziemia’s word for it. “Glad” might not be the best word though, because in the case of many of the stories we read about here, it’s deportation of people I feel should not be ordered deported in the first place. I cannot be happy about a woman being deported after spending all 16 years of her adult life in this country, after bearing and raising three American kids here. Just one of many examples. If I’ve missed the “equal enforcement of our laws” from the left in those conversations, then I apologize for singling out the right in my disappointment.

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Ann

FOAS, my hope is these deportations, some which will be much more difficult than others (someone like the woman you described vs a male criminal gang member without children), might go a long way in preventing the appeal of these caravans and the use of the loopholes. If there becomes a big fear that the trip here will ultimately result in a difficult deportation (for the illegal), then the appeal becomes far less appealing. Legal immigration is a wonderful thing, with a needed degree of certainty for the immigrant and a needed degree of security, orderly process, and management of capacity and resources for our country.

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Ann

I think the powerful anti-Trump sentiment (almost a mandate for some) has made it so even reasonable activities like deporting people who have received deportation orders, has become an unnecessary battle. There was nothing wrong with previous presidents (including Obama) processing deportations - in fact it was very much the right, proper, and lawful thing to do. Trump doing it should be viewed the same. I think too much anti-Trump sentiment is a detriment to Dems on this topic. There are some ways in which Trump, like presidents before him, is just doing his job. This is one of them. Trying to oppose any and all efforts to secure our border, eliminate or reduce illegal entry, and remove those that should be removed is a losing strategy for logically thinking people. If all that opposition is based on a strong dislike of Trump, it looks and feels illogical and anger based rather than sensible, practical and logical.

I know how much Dems don't want Trump to have any wins, but trying to force a Trump loss on a single topic to the great detriment of our country, will be a failing tactic IMO. I think Trump will keep up this illegal immigration fight, he's right in doing so, and Dems could easily lose 2020 on just this issue alone. All my opinion, of course.

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Ann Gale

Ann, it is entirely possibly to be supportive of our laws AND be dismayed by the mistreatment of migrant children, saddened by the prospect of families being torn apart and disgusted by the administration's gestapo tactics. It's called empathy.

And once again - broad-brush support of open borders? Not a thing.

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Joaniepoanie

These “raids“ are a total joke. Who announces a raid? Did the FBI announce the raid on Manafort’s house? And according to reports they are only targeting Dem cities that didn't vote for Trump. Why is that? It’s just another PR publicity stunt for the base.

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foodonastump

There’s some truth in that Ann but blame falls squarely on Trump. Especially WRT this topic.

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Ziemia(6a)

FOAS,

First, there may be some liberals against deportations. There has been so much broad-brushing about those opposed to much of Trump's policies and rhetoric that I feel this has to said every so often.

And immigration and deportations are *very* complex issues.

You give a perfect example. Which is why I have added qualifiers about prioritizing deportations.

Too often Trump supporters say they want all undocumented people removed. And that is something that most informed 'liberals' are against.

And, I have said this countless times. I used to give details but that never seemed to change the knowledge here. So, I rarely bother any longer. But when a serious, nonpartisan discussion occurs, then I see the value in digging up the supporting info.

Thanks for giving cred.

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Ziemia(6a)

If Trump truly wanted to address the issue, he would have backed off from "The Wall" argument long before now. It is a solution that *might* work some if 100% of it were in Mexico.

He would also work to have McConnell back down from his play book.

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