Selling arms to a known human rights abuser

tony jelly

Saudi arabia has one of the worst records on human rights abuse and are busily heaping more dead bodies on the tragedy they created in Yemen with our help, To sell arms, as Trump is doing in a new billion dollar deal, is at least immoral, but is it illegal, against congress, against American ideals?

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chase_gw

We'll see what Congress has to say after demanding sanctions against SA in response the murdering of the reporter. I'm quite sure Jared and the Prince are in cahoots on this no doubt lining their personal pockets along the way.

ETA Wasn't there an existing thread on this? Wonder where it went....well I know where but why?

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Sofia

Here's the one I posted yesterday. I guess the RWingers didn't like the pictures of Trump, and flagged it.

I can still see it, but you can't.

Trump to invoke emergency authority to sell arms to Saudi Arabia

Secretary of State Mike Pompeo notified lawmakers Friday that President Trump is invoking his emergency authority to sidestep Congress and complete 22 arms deals worth approximately $8 billion that would benefit Saudi Arabia, the United Arab Emirates, and other countries, despite lawmakers’ objections to the transactions.

Both Republicans and Democrats urged the Trump administration this week not to take the rare step of declaring an emergency to push through arms deals that lawmakers have blocked, including a controversial sale of precision-guided munitions to Saudi Arabia that some lawmakers fear may be used against civilians in the war-torn country of Yemen.

Senate Foreign Relations Committee ranking member Sen. Robert Menendez (D-N.J.), who had been blocking that sale, said in a statement Friday that in making the move, Trump “failed once again to prioritize our long term national security interests or stand up for human rights, and instead is granting favors to authoritarian countries like Saudi Arabia.”


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jerzeegirl(9b)

I am more worried about bypassing Congress on this. The US is now a monarchy.

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F.M.

That's it Jerzee.

Obama sold more weapons to SA than Trump has (so far), but he went through congress to do so.


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chase_gw

......and now he has his own official King maker running the DOJ and controlling all the other agencies and thwarting Congresses Congregational responsibilities at every turn. Let's just hope the third Branch can get this back under control.

Edited

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sunflower_petal(5a)

What, we lost the other post? Snowflakes.



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lurker111

I wonder how many Americans will fall for this garbage.

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lurker111

lol Jane (oops, delete) :)

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Sofia

Yup

I am trying to decide what you consider garbage - that Saudi Arabia is a known human rights abuser, or that Trump is selling them arms?

Your comment doesn't make sense, at first glance or with a second thought

Did you actually read about this arms sale?

Or is this the "garbage" part?

Both Republicans and Democrats urged the Trump administration this week not to take the rare step of declaring an emergency to push through arms deals that lawmakers have blocked, including a controversial sale of precision-guided munitions to Saudi Arabia that some lawmakers fear may be used against civilians in the war-torn country of Yemen.

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lurker111

From your deleted comment, I'm pretty sure you know what I was referring to. :) Carry on.

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Sofia

No, I don't. That's why I deleted it. But you just keep on believin'


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vgkg Z-7 Va(Z-7)

Let SA duke it out with Iran with their new toys and their own military forces, not US. Wasn't trump against US being the policeman of the world? Oh that's right, he lacks principles but loves slogans.

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sunflower_petal(5a)

Another middle finger to the legislative branch of our democracy (or is that republic).

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catticusmockingbird



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woodnymph2_gw

What jerzee said. Trump has learned he can bypass congress and get away with it. America is now ruled by an autocrat taking pages from the playbooks of other world autocrats.

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mrskjun(9)

Maybe we should send them pallets of cash instead, in the middle of the night.

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tony jelly

Saints preserve us, not the pallets of cash again?

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elvis

sunflower_petal(5a)

Another middle finger to the legislative branch of our democracy (or is that republic).

The text of the Pledge of Allegiance words are as follows: "I pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America, and to the republic for which it stands, one nation under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.".

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leona_2008

If Congress doesn't override this, they are ceding all control to trump. They better consider the consequences not just of this particular EO, but of the truly unlimited power they are giving this unprincipled and immoral imbecile.

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tony jelly

It is extraordinary that he has support for this on HT, or anywhere for that matter

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Zalco/bring back Sophie!

I detest Saudi Arabia. However selling arms to human rights violators is something we do one way or another. As the great Humphrey Appleby said once, Either you sell arms or you don't. It's a very ugly business.

Disregarding legislation, that is a biggie, folks. Truly terrifying, because I believe we have four more years of this mad grifter coming up.

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mrskjun(9)

You don't like that Tony? The worlds state sponsor of terrorism, and Obama shipped them 1.7 billion in cash and congress knew nothing about it. So Trump sells arms to Saudi Arabia for 8 billion and now it's time for the vapors?

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tony jelly

Saudi Arabia is the biggest sponsor of terrorism, including 9/11 kJun, the smear on Iran is part of a build-up to war that we have heard before from the same source.

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miss lindsey (still misses Sophie)(8a)

This is terrifying. Of all the things I've said about Trump and this administration, I don't think I've ever used the word terrifying (though I could be wrong).

Arms deals are made all the time. Sometimes arms deals are made with disreputable (to put it mildly) parties.

What doesn't happen all the time is the President of the United States declaring an emergency need to make an arms deal in order to circumvent the will of Congress, who are elected to represent the best interests of the entire United States.

And that is the terrifying part.

How is the need to make this deal an EMERGENCY? Who is in immediate danger if the US does not make this deal?

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mrskjun(9)

If you are terrified over 8 billion in sales from Trump, I imagine you have never recovered from this.

"WASHINGTON (Reuters) - U.S. President Barack Obama’s administration has offered Saudi Arabia more than $115 billion in weapons, other military equipment and training, the most of any U.S. administration in the 71-year U.S.-Saudi alliance, a report seen by Reuters has found. "

https://www.reuters.com/article/US-usa-saudi-security-idUSKCN11D2JQ

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mrskjun(9)

squeal!! That would be the sound of the end of this thread.

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tony jelly

Obama sold weapons to SA, therefore there is no problem at all if Trump does so too, is that how the logic runs?

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miss lindsey (still misses Sophie)(8a)

Sorry I wasn't clearer.

What terrifies me is the bypassing of Congress with the declaration of an emergency, and the lack of clarification as to why this particular arms deal constitutes an emergency.

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mrskjun(9)

Need help with that goalpost?

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sunflower_petal(5a)

" and Obama shipped them 1.7 billion in cash "

So you're saying that your side is no better than the other and you're fine with that approach?

Sheesh.

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mrskjun(9)

Nope sunflower, I'm saying hypocrisy wins the day.

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chase_gw

Why can't the right just tell the truth...they know what it is.


The money was legally Iran's. Frozen by the Americans as a negotiating tool.

According to the Iran agreement ALL Iranian assets frozen by the countries signing on to the deal would be returned to the Iranians

It would have been breaking the deal and going back on your word if it wasn't returned to them....

That's it, now I get it !!!! Trump supporters don't think keeping your word and following authorized treaties is important !

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Sofia

I wonder how many Americans will fall for this garbage.

You still haven't told us what the "garbage" is.

Saudi Arabia violates human rights,

Trump made an end run around Congress to sell weapons of mass destruction to Jared's BFF.

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vgkg Z-7 Va(Z-7)

Again - let the Saudies fight the Iranians, why sell them weapons if they want us the fight for them? No more US blood spilled nor treasure spent (our debts) for these Middle East bums.

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sunflower_petal(5a)

" Nope sunflower, I'm saying hypocrisy wins the day. "

Sounds a lot more like 'well, you did it so you can't complain when we do it!'

Perhaps it was just the way you phrased it.


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mrskjun(9)

Nahh sunflower. Seems when Obama did it, bigley, it wasn't even a blip on the radar of the left. But now?




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chase_gw

Some Republican Senators are very unhappy with this. He deliberately did this when they were going on their week long recess. We' ll see what they say when they get back.

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tony jelly

The point is kjun that Trump is reckless in his foreign 'policy,' so moves like this are done without any foresight putting lives at risk as a result. You may see this as hand-flapping but a war with Iran would be a catastrophe on an unimaginable scale, you might want a new meme for that.

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mrskjun(9)

So selling arms to SA means going to war with Iran? Did we win the big one when Obama was prez?

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tony jelly

You might want to try and keep up before saying something you may regret.

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chase_gw

Those weapons are being used against civilians and children in Yemen..........

Not sure how any decent person can be supportive of that. I worry that America has lost her soul..........and that way too many are OK with that in defense of Trump...in defense of Trump.....in defense of a politician.

How does that happen ?

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cyn427 (z. 7, N. VA)(zone 7, Northern VA)

We are watching the "death by a thousand cuts" of our republic.

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tony jelly

There has been talk of a war with Iran for forty years, mainly because it stands in the way of US hegemony. We now have a strong ally in Israel and Saudi: we sell arms to both, big time. Yemen is a trial run that all three above mentioned have tried to tie Iran to, so the selling of such huge quantities of weapons with no pre-conditions and a common enemy can only mean one thing.

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sunflower_petal(5a)

mrskjun, why do you keep using an image that was watermarked expressly for the purpose of not being used for free?

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vgkg Z-7 Va(Z-7)

"Some Republican Senators are very unhappy with this....... We' ll see what they say when they get back."

Yeah Chase, I can see & hear them now....

Susan Collins : "Well...I Never....

Lindsey G. "Well...I Declare....

and McConnell, oh he might snap with a wink, but never bites donald.

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