No pic posted.

Ughh ok, I’ll try again in a few minutes. Thanks

Some questions:

1) What does the term "dream" kitchen mean to you in terms of appliances and function?

2) What is your cooking style?

3) Have you thought about having two dishwashers? We live on a working farm and since we have three meals a day in our kitchen, I'm adding second dishwasher in our upcoming remodel (part of my dream).

4) What are your thoughts on your range/ovens? Are you doing a 30" slide-in? What about a cooktop/rangetop and separate oven(s) or a 36" gas range?

5) What about a prep sink..yay or nay?

I spend A LOT of time in the kitchen. I generally cook 3 meals a day at home. I feed three bottomless pits. So I value function and space to get things done. Having said that, my current kitchen is 10 x 11 and I still manage. So this is going to be a huge upgrade to me in terms of space. Since I do spend so much time there, I’d love to bring some beauty to the space too....namely the windows. As far as appliances, I’ve never cooked with gas. I know, I know it’s supposed to be a million times better and maybe it is, but I was leaning towards an induction range, 30 inches. I would also consider a cooktop with separate double wall ovens (we host large family dinners so an extra oven would be appreciated). I also considered a regular range with a separate wall oven on the wall with the reach-in-pantry. Just don’t know if that would look weird. I’ve never considered two dishwashers but I don’t hate the idea.

Nay on the prep sink

Plot using proper wall thicknesses. When you can't, use 1/2 a square for a little bit of play. Walls are 4-1/2" minimum plus casings/trim. Older homes with plaster or plasterboard can be 1" thicker.

That powder won't work, the doors won't clear, the pantry will be significantly smaller, etc. Between the refer depth, the powder/pantry and pantry/kitchen walls you could have 2' to adjust for.

My upcoming reno will include a kitchen that will be about 17.5 by 16 but it's in the corner so windows on two walls. In terms of layout, I'm considering an L-shaped layout that would likely work well in your kitchen, too.

I don't have time to draw it out but if you can imagine:

On the back wall, put the fridge on the far right then to it's left, an upper cabinet (33"-36" wide), then a 5 ft window then more uppers to the corner. For the lower cabs, center the sink on the window with dishwasher on the right and trash on the left. Put a drawer stack between dishwasher and fridge. The left of the trash, put another drawer stack.

On the left wall, center your range/cooktop between the left edge and the corner, with a drawer stack on each side. For the corner, consider a drawer stack if your cabinetmaker/cabinet line can accommodate those. On the uppers on that wall, put cabinets on each side of the range hood.

For the island, put an undercounter microwaver cabinet (24" wide) and two wide drawer stacks.

If you decide to do the double ovens, you can certainly put them on the wall adjacent to the bedroom but I'd hate for you to get that walkway too crowded since it's a main thoroughfare through your house. However, putting the double ovens there and maybe doing a wine/coffee bar with a sink area (for the few times you might need an extra sink) with glass cabinets above might be really nice :)

I really like this idea Shead. My only hesitation would be it’s cutting into my window space but maybe a 5 ft window is still good enough? I like that the range could be centered this way. I’m going to give this a lot of thought!

You could always have larger windows on that wall but it will cut into your upper cabinet space and you can't go too far to the left and have your sink centered. What direction does that side of the house face?

It faces east

Save yourself some steps! Where is the dining room? Are all meals at the island?

Yes I’m familiar with the work triangle, but having a hard time sorting it out in my own kitchen. Most if not all meals will be at dining room table. I‘m not even 100% on the island for that reason, but an island does seem like a natural fit in this space.

Can you post a plan of the house. Hallways that long for a pantry doesn’t make an sense.

I’ve been trying to but for some reason the image isn’t uploading. Ugh. The entry to the pantry does bug me somewhat, just don’t know how to rearrange this area better. Open to any ideas.

I have a 5ft bay window in my kitchen with my sink beneath. Next to it is a door to the outside. No cabinets on this wall, but a shallow wall cabinet on the short wall abutting the sink - it's for everyday glassware. I still have plenty of cabinets for dishes and food but then my kitchen has FOUR walls as it is NOT open concept. I could not live without those 4 walls. A pantry is great to stock up on non-perishables, but one does not want to have to go to a pantry to get the vanilla extract or the cocoa, or god forbid, everyday pots and pans.

I'm not a fan of islands. I never did like sitting at the counter at the drug store unless it was for an ice cream treat. For a meal, give me a chair any day! I'd kill for a big farmhouse table in my kitchen! I could sit at it to do lots and lots of cooking chores when standing is difficult for me.

Be sure your range can have a real vent hood over it - no microwave vent. They're worthless.

Thank you! Any ideas of a way to make this kitchen work WITHOUT an island? I don’t think that adding a wall between living and kitchen would be out of the question.

You need an architect before you need a kitchen designer. This house won’t live like you want it to, and that’s all due to the design. It’s a boneheaded ninnymuggins false economy to try to save money by not spending it on proper design up front. That is what saves you money in the long run.

We don't have a door between our mudroom and back hall where we also have a powder room but if you decide to do so, I would use pocket doors. We have an outswing door on our powder room and I dislike it. I would also put a small window in the powder room.

I second the two DWs as shead suggested. There's many threads discussing this which convinced me to install two and it is one of our best decisions. It has saved us countless hours - a true time, energy and water saver.

Since you live on a farm, do you also have a large garden or can/freeze vegetables? An island is a HUGE lifesaver for that. I get why some people prefer a table but give me an island any day in the kitchen :) We had a 4.5x10ish' one in our last kitchen and LOVED it. The new one will be about 4.5ish' x 9ish' and I cannot wait :)

The pantry/powder room situation is very dysfunctional and should be changed if you can. Have you tried to reduce the jpg size to upload?

To upload, make sure your image is a jpg. Nothing else will upload.

We recently moved in and have our own dream kitchen that is very similar to your drawing... we have a 9 foot island with no appliances or sink (love it). We wrapped the island seating around one side and can seat 6 people. The end of the island nearest the stove has the largest deep drawers where we keep pots and pans (it's great). I am jealous of your pantry. If I had that, I might have even stuck the microwave in it (finding a spot for that interrupted our cabinetry...but I'm used to it now). Our architect wasn't the most helpful( should have found a new one, but he owned our plans so we couldn't take them elsewhere...we were very inexperienced). I wish we had had a designer work along side us with the architect...perhaps there are some designers out there that work in the blueprint development stage. Our first kitchen design attempt was at a building supply chain. They do the plans for free so you will purchase their cabinetry. We were able to see the spacial issues we would have and ended up with a custom build because our space wasn't standard. If you are interested, I can share some pictures. We have sort of a transitional style, but it is a bit similar to your layout.

cp artist, it is a JPEG. I don't understand what I'm doing wrong.

Chris, I'd love to see photos if you are willing to share. We had planned on putting the microwave in the reach-in pantry.

Silly question I know, but I have kids that tend to generate a lot of TRASH- so where to put the trash can? In the pantry? I don't think the under the cabinet garbage cans would cut it for us, honestly. Where is yours?

Try emailing the photo to yourself and see if you can receive and view it correctly. Also make sure it is .jpg as the file name extension. I had trouble uploading once and even though it WAS a jpeg file, Houzz wouldn't upload it because I'd accidentally renamed the file not keeping .jpg at the end of the file name.

Silly question I know, but I have kids that tend to generate a lot of TRASH- so where to put the trash can? In the pantry? I don't think the under the cabinet garbage cans would cut it for us, honestly. Where is yours?

Mama of 6 here.

We created a 3-tiered trash system. One small trash under (or near) the sink. One medium trash *just* outside the kitchen (ours is in our garage; I cross an 8' foyer from the kitchen to reach it, so it's totally convenient). One large bin outside for hauling to the curb.

When the small one is full, it gets dumped in the medium one. Larger items automatically go into the medium and/or large bin. Medium gets dumped in large.

I know lots of folks do it, but trashes in pantries give me the heebie jeebies. :-O Your mudroom may be a good place for a larger can, if you like the system I described.

I'm happy to share. After all the stress we've been through, I'd like to make things less stressful for others. our kitchen isn't perfect by any means. I know the experts out there will be able to tell me what we should have done. I'd definitely go back in time if I could And start back at the blueprint phase where most of the issues began. But it functions very well for us And i am just glad we are finally in.

We have kids and the pull out trash below works fine. It's half way between the sink and the stove which is handy. I liked this one because it hangs and is easy to clean.

We have a drybar/ butler area in that hall behind the fridge. With the walkin pantry behind the stove wall. You have the advantage of a wall pantry as well That is going to be awesome! I included the pot drawer (which I love) and the drawers by the stove which are the perfect depth for tin foil, zip locks and the like. We are far from done with furniture and decor. hope this helps!!!

What about a layout similar to below. It allows more adjacent location for the pantry and gives you a usable 1/2 bath size. The images below show some ideas for a built-in refrigerator. Microwave drawers are more easily accessible and eliminates potential burns that may occur with the microwave above the range. It also allows for a more decorative range hood. You generally want the dishwasher adjacent to the sink base cabinet since that is how it is typically plumbed. You can always add a pull-out garbage base cabinet maybe to the left of the dishwasher (location optional). You could always put the freezer on the left wall and put a window in there, however you will lose storage space.

L behrens, that layout kind of blows my mind. I had never thought of flipping it like that. It really gives me a lot to think about. Thank you!!

Chris, BEAUTIFUL kitchen. Wow!! What would you change if you could go back? Curious since our layouts are similar! It really is stunning. Love the functional space.

Devoted dame, YYYYYESSSS you get me. That sounds like a great system. Great idea.

Shead, yes we have a large garden and can all summer it seems. The walk in pantry will primarily be used for our canned goods and our canning supplies.

Chris, can you share the width of your island?

Are you sure you don't want a second sink somewhere in the kitchen or the pantry? Or maybe make the pantry like a scullery with a separate sink and extra DW in there for overflow?

Sure.... the cabinetry is 42" and the countertop is 62" wide.....

Shead, no not sure at all!! It’s definitely something to consider, especially if I can make the pantry more accessible like L behrens suggested!

Ideally, I'd want that shortest wall a few more feet longer and not have to put the range and sink on the same run. L Behrens idea is interesting but it leaves you with such little space on that wall. I think it would look odd having just a fridge in that space unless you did something like a hidden pantry door so that, when closed, the kitchen looked like it made an L shape.

I hope you can get your plan posted soon.

As for changes....the drawer panels at the top of some of our cabinets are very narrow...when you grab them in a hurry...you scratch the wood. I would fix that. I would have had a bigger pantry and move the microwave in there....freeing up the cabinet design. I would have thought about where the pendants hung and had them line up better with the windows ( of course that would have meant making the kitchen longer). Mainly more symmetry. A nicer fridge(taller for sure). Handles not knobs in the butler pantry at the top. I wouldn't let the builder talk me into the sideways plug-ins again; they may look better with the backsplash, but they are a pain for me to use with some plugs. A little more thought about the bottom corner cabinet...it's a tight space, but I really don't need that space. I wish I'd put another pan cabinet....I'll send a picture of that when I can...I enjoy that. I love the deep drawers...very glad I have 6 of those.

still trying without success to get plans posted....I’ve tried multiple computers, my phone, tried emailing it to myself....ahhhhhhh. It will let me attach it then when I click submit, the button goes light green, as if it’s uploading....but then refreshes the page with no uploaded picture.

Computers are frustrating.

Here's our pan cabinet..... wish I had more of these

Oh I love that!!

Well since I CANT POST A PICTURE, you’ll have to use your imaginations, but what about... building off the plan l behrens suggested, what about the range in the center of short wall with cabinets on either side, then moving fridge to long wall, either all the way to the left near pantry opening or all the way to the right? I drew it out and think I am liking it.

Huh, I’ve seen every picture you posted on my iPhone? Seems to work.

Very Nice!

Thank you guys so much! This has been so helpful to me. The only thing I dislike about that plan is the refrigerator being on that short wall basically by itself. I think I could get on board with it if, as someone mentioned, I could do some sort of hidden pantry door so it doesn’t look like a random fridge on a wall, but I’m not really finding any photos with a similar set up. Anywhere else I could put the refrigerator, other than that wall? Or any alternative pantry set up that would allow more space on that short wall?

The first picture L Behrens posted is the fridge alone on the small wall. :) I like it!

Here is what my hidden pantry looked like:

Made a few revisions. Moved the appliances as suggested by Mama Goose! Centered the Island on the sink and windows. Kept the tall cabinets flanking the refrigerator. Added a window in the pantry if desired. Included an image for an example of a 'Hidden Door' to the Pantry. We have used these in many residential projects (ie: into wine cellars, kids play rooms, pantries, etc.)

thank you so much for these! I do think that seeing it like this, the hidden door might ease my hesitations about the refrigerator placement. Please help me reconcile the range placement! I know I want a range hood. Was leaning towards wood and more of a statement piece. But the whole time I’ve been working on the kitchen, the #1 thing I wanted was a huge bay of windows. I will attempt to attach a couple of inspiration photos. I just cant really wrap my head around how the range and the hood would look and if it would bother my that the windows would be smaller and/or off centered on that wall to accommodate for the range hood. Any “real life“ pictures of a similar set up?

If you google 'range hood between windows' you will find many examples, including these:

I'm not necessarily suggesting locating the range under a window, but you will also find examples of that:

Thoughts on this drawing:

- Is that half-bath 4 1/2 x 4 1/2? If so, it's too small. I strongly suggest you drop a tape measure in your purse, and every time you use a bathroom -- at the dentist's office, in your friend's house, where ever -- measure it. Develop a sense of "just right". I promise you, it won't be 4 1/2 x 4 1/2. Consider grandma using this space with a walker. If you go with a pedestal sink, it'll be a space-saver (and you don't need to store much in a half bath), but it'll still be too small.

- Still on the half-bath ... go with an in-swing here. This door, as shown, can block your hall traffic.

- While we're talking about doors, the pantry door will stay open most of the time, so I suggest a pocket door here ... if you're able to "park it" in the wall by the fridge. Why? Same reason as the half-bath: as shown, it's a traffic blocker, and with only a 3' walkway into the pantry, you don't really have room to comfortably "park the door" in that pantry entry.

- I'd like to see a pass-through door between the pantry and the kitchen. Imagine how convenient it'd be to walk into the pantry, pick out your cans and "set them through" to the kitchen countertop rather than carrying them.

- Beware of placing the freezer against a wall. Be sure you'll be able to open the door all the way.

- Will you have a cabinet near the fridge in which you can store glassware? You know you want these things close together.

- You have 4' between your island and your cabinet runs. I know this is what most people consider "just right", but I find it a little wide (then, again, I am small). Go down to Lowes with the aforementioned tape measure, and you'll see that most of their stuff is 3 1/2' apart. Decide for yourself whether you find this comfortable.

- What's the cabinet between the sink and the dishwasher?

- Your "serious cooking zone" seems to be angled towards the crook of the "L" ... as such, I'd be tempted to bump the dishwasher to the other side of the sink ... or to flip-flop the dishwasher and the sink. This would give you more storage /drawers in the spot where you'll cook most.

- In a dream kitchen, in a kitchen this big, I'd want a bigger sink. Seriously, it's the most used appliance. Go big.

- Where's your microwave? coffee pot? trash can?

- I see you have a second reach-in pantry. Unless you have some very unusual needs, I don't see the point in BOTH large pantries.

- I'd extend the mudroom wall so it "touches" the refrigerator space. This would hide the exterior door, and it would place the half bath and pantry door IN the mudroom.

Can you swap the mudroom and the pantry? A mudroom would benefit from
windows - and maybe you could even put a door to the back yard in there.
Of course without seeing the rest of the plan, I have no idea if that
would make sense.

Yes! Mudroom on the corner would be nicer ... and windows in a pantry are a negative (light is the enemy of food storage).

I spend A LOT of time in the kitchen ... So this is going to be a huge upgrade to me in terms of space. Since I do spend so much time there, I’d love to bring some beauty to the space too....namely the windows.

Red flags ... a bigger kitchen is not automatically a better kitchen. What you want is an efficient, well-designed space. Who says this? A person with a very large but poorly laid-out kitchen.

No one ever says, "This room has too much natural light." Love big windows in a kitchen.

As far as appliances, I’ve never cooked with gas ... but I was leaning towards an induction range, 30 inches.

I have only limited experience with gas, but I'm not overly impressed.

I would also consider a cooktop with separate double wall ovens (we host large family dinners so an extra oven would be appreciated). I also considered a regular range with a separate wall oven on the wall with the reach-in-pantry. Just don’t know if that would look weird. I’ve never considered two dishwashers but I don’t hate the idea.

Before you start adding in extra this and oversized that, consider that all these extra appliances drive up your space requirements ... especially since you've already said you want the large windows /thus will be giving up some upper cabinets. How often will these things really be used? Will they "earn their keep"? I doubt it.

but maybe a 5 ft window is still good enough?

A 5' window is nice, but it isn't going to give you the sweeping views /light that I think you were pining for earlier.

Are all meals at the island?

No love for your island seating. Take the family down to Waffle House for a meal and sit at the bar. Did you interact much? Did you enjoy this seating pattern? An island is a great place to sit while you work, and it's a great place for a child to sit ... but it's NOT a great place for family meals.

I like this pantry /half bath layout better than the OP's original. I'd put a pegboard for storing cast iron pans and utensils on that blank pantry wall.

I only have 1 comment. I find that adjacent seating at an island is more conversational than lining up diner-style.