A delay in Biden's announcement to enter the race?

Ann

He was planning to announce Wednesday, but I heard a quick report saying that date has been pushed back. Does anyone know why?

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margievank

I think he is waiting for that Cone to be sized for his head, lol

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catkinZ8a


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margaux

Fuhgetabauti

Maybe they're going with booty gig.

Do you mean Buttigieg, who served in Afghanistan fighting for your freedom? Who enlisted because he felt it was his duty to serve his country? Is that who you're denigrating with a childish name because he's gay?

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Carro

The expedient patriotism is so cute.

Joe's lack of commitment isn't very inspiring.

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margaux

Some just wave a flag and think that's what it means to be a patriot.

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margievank

LOL- thanks catkin for the visual;)

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Carro

Ann, sounds like Biden's campaign is rethinking the launch in Charlottesville.

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Carro

catkin, we call that the "cone of shame", lol!

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margaux

His service does mean that you should show him the same respect that you show for every service member. You don't call them names, do you? Does he lose your respect as a former service member just because he's running against your candidate?

Everyone is well aware of what you mean when you call him Booty.

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margievank

Sounds like some people are just taking things to personal.

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margievank

I am really enjoying telling people things that they told me over and over and over.;))

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Carro

Sounds like some people are just taking things to personal.

Not at all personal when they use "tRump", because "rump" snicker snicker. The gay jokes about him and Putin still play well with the Left, too.

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Joaniepoanie

Fugh


margaux, we appreciate his service but that doesn't make him always right, immune to criticism or qualified to run this country. Booty gig is his name. Sounds like you filled in a lot of blanks to get the rest.

-------

Well, Trump got a doctor to write a note so he wouldn't have to serve, he's rarely right, can't take any criticism and is less qualified than Mayor Pete to run the country......where's your snide little name for him?

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Fuhgetabauti

Does he lose your respect as a former service member just because he's running against your candidate?

He loses my respect because of what what he stands for. As far as I'm concerned he's now fighting to destroy this country. And he will be dealt with appropriately.

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margaux

Booty gig is his name.

No, it isn't. Booty gig, hard G, does not sound like Buddha jedge, which is how he pronounces it.

I think Fuhgetabauti is a big boy and he can defend his use of the nickname "Booty gig" without anyone else's help.

Fuhgetabauti?

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catkinZ8a

cheeto head

orange man bad

tRump

Drumpf

cadet bone spurs

dementia don

butt judge

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Fuhgetabauti

Fuhgetabauti?

Yes?

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Carro

Funny how the left isn't at all offended by all the gay bashing jokes when it comes to Trump and Putin.

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margaux

Did you serve, Fuhgetabauti?

Did you serve, Carro? You've also called him Booty.

Did you serve, catkin? You've called him butt edge.

Did you serve, margie? You do know the sacrifice our service members make.


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Carro

Did you serve? We're so not worthy!!!

Give it a rest...


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margaux

No, I did not but I was a Navy wife for four years. I saw my husband for a total of eight months of those four years. I know the sacrifice.

So much that is morally right has been thrown by the wayside with your support of Trump. Now it's okay to attack someone who served to protect your freedoms because he has the audacity to challenge Trump. And to attack him at his core by mocking his sexuality.

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Fuhgetabauti

I'm surprised though the left is going with a veteran, they normally don't think much of them.



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Carro

I'm surprised though the left is going with a veteran, they normally don't think much of them.

They hate Dan Crenshaw. He's not gay, so...

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Fuhgetabauti

Now it's okay to attack someone who served to protect your freedoms
because he has the audacity to challenge Trump. And to attack him at his
core by mocking his sexuality.

Sorry, but again, he's not beyond criticism because he served. What he did when he served was admirable. What he's doing now running as a part of the un-american Democrat party is despicable. The two do not conflate. He'll get praise for the former and appropriate criticism for the latter.

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margievank

Hang on to your pearls margaux, you ain't seen nothin yet. We are going to let it rip after the 3 years of Trump name calling. Adjectives will fly;)

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Carro

Ooooh, military service by proxy. Impressive.

The Left is constantly pumping out homophobic memes and gay jokes of Trump and Putin, but pronounce New Pete's last name phonetically, and they're suddenly appalled! The Left is constantly using gay sex as a punchline, which is very homophobic, but the Trump haters remain silent.

How convenient their outrage.



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Carro

Where are the tapes?

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catkinZ8a


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foodonastump

Interesting, Ann, I wonder if changing his mind about running. (Running in 2020, not “having run” in the past, for those challenged with tense.)

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Carro

(Running in 2020, not “having run” in the past, for those challenged with tense.)

Because anyone would confuse Biden's changing his mind about running in 1984, 1988 and 2008 with his expected run in 2020.

Makes sense.

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Joaniepoanie

Fugh

He loses my respect because of what what he stands for. As far as I'm concerned he's now fighting to destroy this country. And he will be dealt with appropriately.

-------

Yay.....you've finally seen the light about Trump!

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foodonastump

Yes, Carro, it would seem obvious to most that I’m talking about having second thoughts about a future run than a past run, but you can never be too sure what people willfully misinterpret around here.

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Carro

I so agree food! You can never be too sure when people willfully mislead around here. But good to know that Biden isn't thinking about changing his mind about running 30 years ago.

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catkinZ8a


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Ann

Biden seems to have a big issue with decisions! He just seems to have a heck of a lot of trouble making up his mind and then executing the first step of the plan. It's kind of weird.

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foodonastump

Ann I’ll agree it’s not a good look.

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catkinZ8a

Maybe he's skinny-dipping that day.

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cattyles

Oh goodness, no! Please don’t take your vote away from Biden!

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mrskjun(9)

Wow margeaux, my dad fought at the battle of the bulge, my brother spent nine years in the Navy, my husband served during Vietnam. Does that mean I have the right to call or not call anyone anything I choose?

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Carro


Ann

Biden seems to have a big issue with decisions! He just seems to have a heck of a lot of trouble making up his mind and then executing the first step of the plan. It's kind of weird.

This is coming across as hesitation and trepidation, which feels cold and clinical. Biden seems afraid of the extremists in his party, and too old to go up against them.

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Carro

mrskjun(9)

Wow margeaux, my dad fought at the battle of the bulge, my brother spent nine years in the Navy, my husband served during Vietnam. Does that mean I have the right to call or not call anyone anything I choose?

Why yes. We are military by proxy.

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foodonastump

Free passes are only handed out to “thrice amputeed” servicemen.

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chase_gw

Evidently there was push back from a group of residents of the city who felt that the kick off in their city was political exploitation of the tragedy that occurred there.

The kick off had been approved by city officials but a vocal citizens group protested and the campaign deferred. He will now go to Philadelphia.

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paprikash

foodonastump

Free passes are only handed out to “thrice amputeed” servicemen.

———

gee, that zinger is really funny food - just about as funny as Biden getting a free pass for a dead son

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Carro

C-ville was a really terrible idea for Biden's campaign launch. Philly is much better. Surprised it took getting push back from C-ville for his campaign to realize how opportunistic he would look.

I wonder if and when Obama will support or endorse Biden.

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margaux

The difference between you and me is I respect anyone who has served in the military. Once again, you've shown that you really don't value what you say you value.

I can see now that we Americans are still too immature to elect a gay person president. Those who claim they never see or judge someone by their race sure can't see past someone's sexuality. They're just being good Christians I suppose.

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Carro

There's Pete's True Scotsman!

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chase_gw

Paprikash, I don't believe in name calling so I don't do it and I have no intention of doing something I don't agree with just because others call those I support names.

Then again I don't believe in abandoning long held values and principals to support a politician.

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haydayhayday

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joe_Biden

Biden attended the Archmere Academy in Claymont where he was a standout halfback/wide receiver on the high school football team; he helped lead a perennially losing team to an undefeated season in his senior year. He played on the baseball team as well....

He earned his bachelor's in 1965 from the University of Delaware.... he played halfback with the Blue Hens freshman football team. In 1964, while on spring break in the Bahamas, he met and began dating Neilia Hunter, who was from an affluent background in Skaneateles, New York, and attended Syracuse University. He told her that he aimed to become a senator by the age of 30 and then President. He dropped a junior year plan to play for the varsity football team as a defensive back,enabling him to spend more time visiting out of state with her.

He then entered Syracuse University College of Law,...

Biden received student draft deferments during this period, at the peak of the Vietnam War, and in 1968, he was reclassified by the Selective Service System as not available for service due to having had asthma as a teenager. He never took part in anti-war demonstrations, later saying that at the time he was preoccupied with marriage and law school, and "wore sports coats ... not tie-dyed".

Hay

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haydayhayday

https://www.newsday.com/news/nation/biden-got-5-draft-deferments-during-nam-as-did-cheney-1.884250

"According to the documents, Biden, 65, received several deferments while he was an undergraduate at the University of Delaware and later as a law student at Syracuse University. A month after a physical exam in April 1968, Biden received a Selective Service classification of 1-Y, meaning he was available for service only in the event of national emergency.

"As a result of a physical exam on April 5, 1968, Joe Biden was classified 1-Y and disqualified from service because of asthma as a teenager," said David Wade, a campaign spokesman.

In "Promises to Keep," a memoir that was published last year, Biden never mentions his asthma, recounting an active childhood, work as a lifeguard and football exploits in high school."

Hay

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paprikash

I’ve not abandoned my values or principles — I didn’t vote for Hillary

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Ziemia(6a)

Darn, is this "Ground Dog Day"?

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Fuhgetabauti

The difference between you and me is I respect anyone who has served in the military.

He lost all my respect when he started espousing anti-American views like gun control, socialism, open borders and unlimited abortion.

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Ziemia(6a)

Again the insistence on using one's own definitions.

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Carro

The Left's tactic is to use identity politics as an aegis against sincere ideological disagreement, rather than defend one's positions. Pete seems like a nice guy, a really smart guy and even a patriotic guy. But I reserve the right to disagree with this politics without being attacked for being anti-LGBTQ and anti-military, just because he happens to be a gay veteran.

I thank him for his service and wish him and his husband all the happiness in the world.

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Kathy

Gun control is pro-life. Social programs are pro-life. Open borders and unlimited abortion are not on the agenda. Immigration reform and Women's rights are. Misinformation is the Republican platform.

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Ann

"Then again I don't believe in abandoning long held values and principals to support a politician. "

Oh boy, the judging of the values and principals of American voters by a Canadian participant again, and simply based on a binary decision/vote. Is this the hundredth time or so? I'm curious, what "values and principals" in specific do you feel 60 million American voters abandoned? Also, curious to know if you think voters who voted for Hillary abandoned values and principals?

Then, how are liberal Canadians doing with their own values and principals with Canada's current political situation and Canada's arguably corrupt leader who voters happened to elect within the parameters of the Canadian voting process.

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Carro

Ann, a government that screws over the little guy with taxation of darn near everything, and then turns around and forgives billions in loans to corporations.

They're no different.

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Fuhgetabauti

Gun control is pro-life. Social programs are pro-life.

More like pro-tyranny.

Open borders and unlimited abortion are not on the agenda. Immigration reform and Women's rights are.

Right, immigration reform to allow for open borders and women's
rights to unlimited abortion. You're just putting lipstick on a terd.

Misinformation is the Republican platform.

Truth about the democrats un-american shift to the far left is the Republican platform.

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chase_gw

"Then again I don't believe in abandoning long held values and principals to support a politician. "

My statement was about my personal beliefs and what I would do or not do, I made no mention of American voters.

I will not be voting Liberal specifically because I will not abandon my values in support of a politician who has shown himself to be unethical. If the Liberal Party changes their leader I will reconsider.

ETA It's one thing to elect someone based on ones political views, quite another to continue to support that politician when they show themselves to be unethical .......which is why I will not support nor defend Trudeau even though I voted for him.


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Fuhgetabauti

Awww, no more pajama boy?

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Ziemia(6a)

"Oh boy, the judging of the values and principals of American voters by a Canadian participant again,.."

So, so, just do what one claims to object to. So judgemental while "seeing" judgementalism. Interesting? So

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Carro

Do they have impeachment in Canada?

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chase_gw

That is disgusting

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Ann

"I can see now that we Americans are still too immature to elect a gay person president. Those who claim they never see or judge someone by their race sure can't see past someone's sexuality. They're just being good Christians I suppose."

I guess gay is fine if the person is in your own party and doing well. But, yet, the Trump/Putin gay joke delivered lots of liberal HT laughs and there have been quite a number of derogatory liberal HT comments and jokes about Lindsey Graham over the years regarding rumors of the same nature. But, Mayor Pete is in the race now. Time for everyone to get mature, right?:)

In reality, since it seems to be the norm to analyze a politician's sexual past in great and descriptive detail, I guess that's precisely what should happen with all candidates, right? Including Mayor Pete. If the "locker room talk" tape of Trump should be replayed and discussed over and over on HT (and still is), then as a group, we should certainly be fair. My guess is Mayor Pete's bedroom now and in his past won't be any more off limits than Trump's or Harris's or Kavanaugh's.

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Fuhgetabauti

You don't think they'd get along well chase?

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Ziemia(6a)

Really? Missed them (maybe a scattered few exist....

"..there have been quite a number of derogatory liberal HT comments and jokes about Lindsey Graham over the years regarding rumors of the same nature .."

If there were quite a number should be easy to find ...

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Ann

"You're just putting lipstick on a terd."

My thought exactly!

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Carro

Mayor Pete is in the race now. Time for everyone to get mature, right?:)

We'll see if the leftists continue to taunt and bully men they suspect of being gay by outing them on Twitter.

We'll see if the Trump and Putin as lovers memes continue.

We'll see if Colbert makes **** holster jokes about Pete.

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margaux

But I reserve the right to disagree with this politics without being attacked for being anti-LGBTQ and anti-military, just because he happens to be a gay veteran.

As you should. I agree with that right 100%. I hope I made it clear that my objection was to those who call him homophobic names. Yes, attack him for his beliefs and policies. I'm not trying to put a protective shield around him like you all do for Trump.

I don't care if you call a candidate or the president names if those are your values. Call Obama BO. Call Trump Cheeto. But find a name for Buttigieg based on something you don't like about him. Don't hit at the core of a person's being by mocking them for those things that we can't change about ourselves. Calling Buttigieg Booty Gig is the same as calling Corey Booker a name that denigrates his race. Would you do that? As for him being a veteran, that you would direct a homophobic name at someone who enlisted out of DUTY to his country and who served with HONOR is beyond distasteful.

Now if you're juvenile enough to continue to use Booty or Butt Edge or Booty Gig because Oh Boy! It triggers a liberal!, don't waste your time because I am already scrolling on by your posts.

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Carro

Good to know.

Now let's hear how offended you are by leftists and the MSM making homophobic jokes and slurs which denigrate ALL gay people, not just Pete.

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margaux

In reality, since it seems to be the norm to analyze a politicians sexual past in great and descriptive detail, I guess that's precisely what should happen with all candidates, right? Including Mayor Pete.

Yes, if he had had a promiscuous past. Did he? Or did he behave like any heterosexual male, fall in love with someone, married them, and is true and faithful to his marriage?

Now if you feel the need to "analyze" what he and his husband do in the privacy of their own home in great and descriptive detail, have at it.

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Kathy

The lipstick on a tree is Trump claiming he is building a wall when all he is doing is normal repair and replace. More lies for the gullible/

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haydayhayday

My only two posts aren't showing.

I'd love to know why. I can't even imagine what filter would have caught them. Could well be the two least innocuous posts in this thread.

If you can, Emily, please let me know.

Thanks.

Hay

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margaux

Carro

Good to know.

Now let's hear how offended you are by leftists and the MSM making homophobic jokes and slurs which denigrate ALL gay people, not just Pete.

I grew up in a time when gay jokes were the norm and everyone laughed at their expense. I didn't really know any gay people then because gays weren't out. But then I took a class in college with a gay professor, and he became my most influential and most beloved teacher. After that, those gay jokes weren't sitting so well anymore.

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Ziemia(6a)

"Now let's hear how offended you are by leftists and the MSM making homophobic jokes and slurs which denigrate ALL gay people, not just Pete."

Hunh?

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Ziemia(6a)

How do you know they are "leftists" if their work is on Twitter? Or, just using your own definitions?

"We'll see if the leftists continue to taunt and bully men they suspect of being gay by outing them on Twitter."

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mudhouse

But find a name for Buttigieg based on something you don't like about him.

Okay. I don't like the way he's using the fact that he's gay to beat Pence over the head, even though Pence has never attacked him for being gay. I don't like the way he's trying to use the fact that he's gay as a reason for people to vote for him. That's just my own response. I don't think people should vote based on gender or sexual preference, I think they should vote based on the ability of the candidate, and based on their policies. Not everybody agrees with this. That's fine too.

The guy has a very problematic name. I can't remember how to spell it, I can't remember how to say it. Phonetically, Booty Judge is pretty close, and that was the first phrase I could use to remember it. If the guy is going to keep using his sexual preference as a way to differentiate himself from the other candidates, he's opening the door to this kind of humor.

“I’m from Indiana, I’m gay as a — I don’t know, think of something
really gay — that’s how gay I am,” he said in an interview with TMZ’s Harvey Levin.

I have gay people in my family. I don't denigrate gay people. But I doubt that Buttigieg himself is as offended by some of the names people use for him as some on the left will pretend to be, in order to further the narrative that anyone who doesn't support a gay candidate must be homophobic.

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Chi

I wish I could be surprised that the right has sunk to the level of using homophobic slurs against candidates, but I'm not.

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numbersjunkie
"If the guy is going to keep using his sexual preference as a way to differentiate himself from the other candidates."

LOL. I watched the interview posted. When he's asked about how he expects his sexual orientation is likely to affect his candidacy, what would you prefer he say?

The think about Pete that Trump supporters don't seem to appreciate is that he's honest. He tells it like it is. He's not pretending to be something he isn't. He's not a liar.

He's not flaunting it. He's not saying you should vote for him cause he's gay. He didn't bring it up. He was just answering the question honestly.
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Kathy

How about Mayor Pete? Can the RW remember that?

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margaux

I don't like the way he's trying to use the fact that he's gay as a reason for people to vote for him.

Source?

The guy has a very problematic name. I can't remember how to spell it, I can't remember how to say it. Phonetically, Booty Judge is pretty close, and that was the first phrase I could use to remember it.

You could remember if you tried. Butti-gieg. We learned i before e in grade school. No one pronounces the i as a long e in the middle of a word. Stop making excuses.

If the guy is going to keep using his sexual preference as a way to differentiate himself from the other candidates, he's opening the door to this kind of humor.

Source?

But I doubt that Buttigieg himself is as offended by some of the names people use for him as some on the left will pretend to be, in order to further the narrative that anyone who doesn't support a gay candidate must be homophobic.

Wow. I am pretending to be offended because I want to further a narrative that non-Buttigieg voters are homophobic? Boy did you get it wrong. Maybe this shouldn't come as a surprise from someone who just said it's too hard to remember how to spell Buttigieg.

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margaux

Sorry, Ann, maybe we're just not that interested in Biden's candidacy. Of course we went through all the hugging and kissing jokes weeks ago so what is there left to talk about?

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cattyles

They can call Buttigieg whatever they want, as far as I’m concerned. It’s not going to change any minds about Buttigieg or Trump. Mayor Pete doesn’t care, I’m sure. We all know that some are here only to incite divisiveness. If Margaux’s articulate explanation of the pettiness doesn’t penetrate their perception, so be it.

They’re just after those librul tears. It’s their only pleasure now that trump’s going down, down, down.

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foodonastump

gee, that zinger is really funny food

Pap - Go back and see how many times that was mentioned in defense of Kolfage and his stupid GFM campaign and maybe you’ll know why I said it.

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mudhouse

LOL. I watched the interview posted. When he's asked about how he expects his sexual orientation is likely to affect his candidacy, what would you prefer he say?

numbersjunkie, that's a fair point. It would have been better if I'd posted more context. I grabbed that to make the point that he's being open about being gay; he's not redirecting those questions back to policy. I am NOT saying he should, either! Just because I point something out doesn't mean I'm saying it's bad.

(I've been gone from HT for about four months, and I think the tendency for people to assume that any kind of a statement is automatically a negative judgement, based on "which side" is posting it, is worse than ever.)

I like Buttigieg's openness, honestly. If you guys think I'm saying he shouldn't talk about his sexual preferences, I'm not. I'm saying for me, as an individual, it's not a plus, when it comes time to vote. I didn't find it effective when Hillary's campaign said people should vote for her because it was time for a woman to be president, either. I vote based on the policies the person supports. Personally, speaking for me, mudhouse, I don't think gender or sexual preference should matter at all when you're making a decision about who should run the country. That's just me, though. I think lots of people, men and women, based part of their support for Hillary on the fact that she's a woman. I just don't vote that way.

I do think that Buttigieg is using his sexual preference to bring in votes from people who view the issue differently from the way I do. I think that's what the attacks on Pence were about. It may actually be a very intelligent move on his part. Heck, he might win. Who knows.

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Izzy Mn(4)

Pete B. Probably has heard every joke in the book about his name. I would guess to the point he pays it no attention, especially since they are trying to get a reaction to it. My great father's last name is a huge source for jokes. I've a second cousin who grew up with the name. I asked her if she was teased. OMG, yes she said, you either just learn to live with it, ignore, or play along. That side of the family have a great sense of humor, probably because of growing up with the last name forced you to almost. Family reunions they would try and out do( without being vulgar) with custom t-shirts. Although some were pushing it. Last family reunion she wore a shirt that said, I'm a Dick, are you?

Sorry for going off topic, got caught up with all the name calling stuff.

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mudhouse

You could remember if you tried. Butti-gieg. We learned i before e in grade school. No one pronounces the i as a long e in the middle of a word. Stop making excuses.

Nope. Buttigieg is difficult to pronounce. Stop being so offended you can't see an obviously true statement. Saying he's got a problematic name, from a political point of view, isn't saying anything good or bad about his qualifications as a presidential candidate.

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mudhouse

I hadn't read about the reasons for the delay in Biden's plans to announce, or that the initial plan was Charlottesville. Yup, I'm behind the times. Thanks for the thread, Ann, and thanks to whoever posted the info above, before we derailed to Buttigieg.

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Izzy Mn(4)

I am wondering if maybe he is having second thoughts about running. I'm not sure if his heart is really in it and he is seeing others who's are. He has been pressured into running also. If I were him I would enjoy my life and leave the politics behind.

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Ann

He always seems to be having second thoughts, doesn't he? I think it might be best to leave politics behind if the decision is really hard. I think one would have to be highly motivated and tough as nails to handle all that would come with being POTUS.

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Kathy

It doesn’t matter as much when he announces if he is the last one standing.

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woodnymph2_gw

Maybe he has noted the large array of so many far younger candidates joining the fray and is having second thoughts. I admit that maybe I would, too, were I in his shoes.

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mudhouse

To be honest I'm impressed with all of the candidates on either side that are willing to take on the huge job of president at a very late stage in their lives. It's hard to ignore the level of commitment that takes, no matter which party they're in.

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Carro

Thursday, announcement by video.

Appearing in Pittsburgh on Monday.

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Carro

Maybe he has noted the large array of so many far younger candidates joining the fray and is having second thoughts. I admit that maybe I would, too, were I in his shoes.

Maybe, or the radical, progressive faction of the Dem party is overstating the enmity towards Biden being an older, white male. He's also Catholic and hetero, so that gives him zero intersectionality points.

But I think most of America disagrees with that polarizing stance and as polls show, are supporting Biden before he's officially thrown his hat in the ring.


I'm very interested to see how he frames his candidacy, with his announcement.

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Carro

Family reunions they would try and out do( without being vulgar) with custom t-shirts. Although some were pushing it. Last family reunion she wore a shirt that said, I'm a Dick, are you?

Great attitudes and sense of humor. You have to be careful what you name your kid when your last name is Trickle or Hertz.

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haydayhayday

My missing posts are back.


Hay

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haydayhayday

"Biden attended " is how my first missing post starts. The second one follows immediately after that.

Highlights:

...a standout halfback/wide receiver on the high school football team; he helped lead a perennially losing team to an undefeated season in his senior year. He played on the baseball team as well....

....he played halfback with the ...freshman football team...

...He dropped a junior year plan to play for the varsity football team as a defensive back,enabling him to spend more time visiting out of state with her...


Biden received student draft deferments during this period, at the peak of the Vietnam War, and in 1968, he was reclassified by the Selective Service System as not available for service due to having had asthma as a teenager.




Hay

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chase_gw

Maybe there was just a delay in them posting.....happens

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haydayhayday

Highlights from the second post:

A month after a physical exam in April 1968, Biden received a Selective Service classification of 1-Y, ...

Joe Biden was classified 1-Y and disqualified from service because of asthma as a teenager,"

...


In "Promises to Keep," a memoir that was published last year, Biden never mentions his asthma, recounting an active childhood, work as a lifeguard and football exploits in high school."

Hay

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haydayhayday

Bone Spurs versus The Asthmatic Kid.


That would be an interesting debate.


Hay

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margievank

LOL Hay.

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haydayhayday

Regardless of how it happened, it's unfortunate. It needs to be read in context and that will never happen. Do go back and read the entire two posts and the context of the thread at that time.

He's going to have to answer about just how he managed to avoid the draft if he commits.


I'm only giving you the highlights of my posts. Lots of good stuff there.


Hay

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althea_gw

Hay, maybe Mike Gravel will ask him if Gravel gets in the debates.

I don't think Buttigieg is having second thoughts about running but, reacting to criticism since the NYTimes outed him as an operative for the right of center wing of the party last week. It explains why his policies are lacking.

https://www.commondreams.org/news/2019/04/16/sanders-2020-campaign-gains-steam-corporate-democrats-reportedly-growing

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althea_gw

Here is Gravel at the 2008 debates.



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haydayhayday

Bernie?

https://abcnews.go.com/Politics/bernie-sanders-applied-conscientious-objector-status-vietnam-campaign/story?id=33434041

"As a college student in the 1960s he was a pacifist," Michael Briggs, campaign spokesman added in an email. "[He] isn't now."


Too funny!!!



In his own words. Start at about 23:00. Stop when you can't stand watching him any more.

Hay

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haydayhayday

"Hay, maybe Mike Gravel will ask him if Gravel gets in the debates. "


I love it.


Wikipedia:


"Maurice Robert "Mike" Gravel is an American politician who served as a United States Senator from Alaska from 1969 to 1981. A member of the Democratic Party, he was a candidate in the 2008 U.S. presidential election and is a candidate in the 2020 U.S. presidential election.


...


Gravel has announced that he is running in the 2020 Democratic primaries in order to bring his long-held policy goals to the debate stage. He officially filed to run for president on April 2, 2019."


I hope he makes it at least to the debates.


Hay



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haydayhayday

The best place to see what's about to happen is the betting markets. I just checked.

https://www.predictit.org/markets/1/US-Elections



So I go looking:

"1 hr ago"

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/live/2019/apr/23/trump-news-today-latest-impeachment-mueller-report-2020-democrats-live-updates

"Joe Biden to announce presidential bid on Thursday – live news

Biden to announce Thursday

Sabrina Siddiqui

The Guardian can confirm reports that former vice president Joe Biden will launch his 2020 campaign this week.

Sources close to Biden said he will make his announcement in a video to be released on Thursday and plans to hold an event in Pittsburgh on Monday. "

Hay

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catkinZ8a

“My campaign will start on Monday, on Monday.
A Monday is very, very good.

Or I start it all on Tuesday, on Tuesday
A Tuesday. In fact I think I should.

But never, never on a Sunday, a Sunday
A Sunday, although I wish I could!”

Melina Mercourri approves this msg.!




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Ziemia(6a)

The following can be successfully argued to be untrue:

"even though Pence has never attacked him for being gay. "

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HU-87154335

How juvenile are the right?

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Tilly Teabag

The Rock for President.

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paprikash

HU-87154335

How juvenile are the right?

————

gee, what do you think of the maturity of those using “tRump”?

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Stan Areted

Biden is a flouncer, you know the people that make a big deal about leaving and then don't?

The people that talk about doing something to get your attention and then delay it?

It's an attention getting tactic and arrogant to do it repeatedly.


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Carro

Maybe Linda Sarsour's thinly-veiled, strong-arm threat telling Biden not to announce today caused him to delay? Lest he incur the wrath of the Muslim Brotherhood and anti-Semites who follow Sarsour and her "women's march" leaders?

Can you even imagine the cajones it takes to threaten a 8-year VP of America like this???

I hope at some point, Joe finds out what happens when her "advice" isn't "on the house". I wonder what retribution she's got planned if a white, male, straight, Catholic, centrist Democrat has the temerity to throw his hat in the ring and start beating her radical, socialist, intersectional gaggle of candidates.





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catkinZ8a

Sarsour's a Sharia law loving a cockroach masquerading as a feminist

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mrskjun(9)

Of course Biden may have been waiting for his dear friend who called him the best vice president ever to endorse him. Don't hold your breath Biden. He said no. I think you call that a fair weather friend, or no friend at all.

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catkinZ8a

I don't think Creepy Joe Biden's up to it.

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heri _ cles

Creepy Joe Biden ?

Trump talk. My God have some of you been brainwashed by this guy. Listen to yourselves.

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catkinZ8a

So, will it be Mich or Crooked?

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catkinZ8a

Creepy Joe Biden's been his standard name long before Trump declared his candidacy. SMH

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heri _ cles

You mean when tRump was swindling people and washing out debts he owed to them in Bankruptcy, having unprotected extra marital sex with porn stars, or when he was a Democrat who favored abortion?

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haydayhayday

EDIT:

This post won't post. I don't understand why. I wish I did.



(Just so you'll understand... Back in the days of Vietnam, AVOID the draft was what clever people like Biden and Bernie used to not have to go die. DODGING the draft was what people who actually got DRAFTED had to resort to if they didn't want to go die for Nixon.)

Slick Willie used every trick in the book to AVOID the draft.

https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/clinton-draft-pardon/

Snopes gives you the details. The article is debunking the idea that Slick Willie was a DRAFT DODGER, but, in doing so highlights the convoluted trail he left behind in order to AVOID the draft.

He didn't get the name Slick Willie for nothing.

"The arc of future President Bill Clinton’s controversial (in retrospect) activities in avoiding the military draft during the Vietnam War years of 1968-69 are difficult to trace with certainty in regard to all the details.

...

... the one person who knew the whole story, Bill Clinton himself, often responded to questions on the subject with misleading or inaccurate information.

...

In mid-1968 Clinton, who maintained that although he was not opposed to the military or war in general he was morally opposed to the Vietnam War in particular, began to seek ways of avoiding the draft. His first opportunity was provided through the political and social connections of Raymond Clinton, his uncle, and Henry Britt, a Hot Springs lawyer and former judge, who made arrangements with the commanding officer of the local Naval Reserve unit, Trice Ellis, to secure a billet for Clinton in the naval reserve:

...

As Clinton headed home for Arkansas from England, his options for avoiding the draft were limited. He likely would not qualify for conscientious objector status because he did not have a history of opposing military service or war in general, only the Vietnam War specifically. The local Army National Guard and Reserve units were full.

...

Clinton’s only available out seemed to be joining the advanced ROTC program at the University of Arkansas, which had no quotas and was open to graduate students, but....Clinton’s draft notice was nullified...

...

The details of Clinton’s subsequent actions and decisions are murky, but...

...

A few days later, Clinton sat down and wrote the now-infamous letter to Colonel Holmes explaining his reasons for reneging on his agreement to enter the University of Arkansas and its ROTC program.

...

Although what he did may not have been against the law, Clinton’s broken promises and contradictory statements about his efforts to avoid the draft were prime examples of the kind of self-serving doublespeak that later earned him the sobriquet “Slick Willie,”

https://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/shows/clinton/etc/draftletter.html

First, I want to thank you, not just for saving me from the draft.

...

From my work I came to believe that the draft system itself is illegitimate.

...

Because of my opposition to the draft and the war, I am in great sympathy with those who are not willing to fight, kill, and maybe die for their country,...

...

I decided to accept the draft in spite of my beliefs for one reason: to maintain my political viability within the system. For years I have worked to prepare myself for a political life characterized by both practical political ability."

That's Slick Willie: War Hero. My Hero.

Hay

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Ann

I guess Biden's in the race. I was surprised to see there wasn't enough interest to post a new thread when many others who have entered have prompted an active thread.

It seems Biden and Bernie aren't favorites of too many on HT. I get that. I've always thought Biden is a McCain type candidate (and I've heard comparisons to a Hillary or Jeb type candidate in recent days). I thought Bernie would have had an excellent chance of beating Trump in 2016, but he's really struggling with questions now, IMO. It's not that he's lost his authenticity, but he's stumped when questioned.

Mayor Pete is looking good, but he's playing the gay card too hard IMO. Most don't care and playing victim makes him look weak rather than strong.

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numbersjunkie
"Mayor Pete is looking good, but he's playing the gay card too hard IMO. Most don't care and playing victim makes him look weak rather than strong."

I never heard him sound like a victim. Also, he doesn't play the gay card. Not even really sure what that means, so it might be helpful if you could explain what makes you say that.

He is asked questions, and answers them directly and honestly, and then moves on. He's honest and open. That's what I see. How refreshing.
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haydayhayday

(Just so you'll understand... Back in the days of Vietnam, AVOID the draft was what clever people like Biden and Bernie used to not have to go die. DODGINGthe draft was what people who actually got DRAFTED had to resort to if they didn't want to go die for Nixon.)

Slick Willie used every trick in the book to AVOID the draft.

https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/clinton-draft-pardon/

Snopes gives you the details. The article is debunking the idea that Slick Willie was a DRAFT DODGER, but, in doing so highlights the convoluted trail he left behind in order to AVOID the draft.

He didn't get the name Slick Willie for nothing.

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margievank


heri cles

Creepy Joe Biden ?

Trump talk. My God have some of you been brainwashed by this guy. Listen to yourselves.

***heri cles

You mean when tRump

********************************************

LOL heri- you sure got brainwashed fast lol lol

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haydayhayday

Although what he did may not have been against the law, Clinton’s broken promises and contradictory statements about his efforts to avoid the draft were prime examples of the kind of self-serving doublespeak that later earned him the sobriquet “Slick Willie,”

https://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/shows/clinton/etc/draftletter.html

First, I want to thank you, not just for saving me from the draft.

...

From my work I came to believe that the draft system itself is illegitimate.

...

Because of my opposition to the draft and the war, I am in great sympathy with those who are not willing to fight, kill, and maybe die for their country,...

...

I decided to accept the draft in spite of my beliefs for one reason: to maintain my political viability within the system. For years I have worked to prepare myself for a political life characterized by both practical political ability."

That's Slick Willie: War Hero. My Hero.

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haydayhayday

"The arc of future President Bill Clinton’s controversial (in retrospect) activities in avoiding the military draft during the Vietnam War years of 1968-69 are difficult to trace with certainty in regard to all the details.

...

... the one person who knew the whole story, Bill Clinton himself, often responded to questions on the subject with misleading or inaccurate information.

...

In mid-1968 Clinton, who maintained that although he was not opposed to the military or war in general he was morally opposed to the Vietnam War in particular, began to seek ways of avoiding the draft. His first opportunity was provided through the political and social connections of Raymond Clinton, his uncle, and Henry Britt, a Hot Springs lawyer and former judge, who made arrangements with the commanding officer of the local Naval Reserve unit, Trice Ellis, to secure a billet for Clinton in the naval reserve:

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haydayhayday

As Clinton headed home for Arkansas from England, his options for avoiding the draft were limited. He likely would not qualify for conscientious objector status because he did not have a history of opposing military service or war in general, only the Vietnam War specifically. The local Army National Guard and Reserve units were full.


You get the idea, I hope. If you want a military hero, Clinton's not your man.


(Sorry, everyone for the disjointed posting. I'm trying to understand why my posts aren't posting.

It's not at all clear what's allowed and what's not. Makes posting extremely difficult and awkward. It's hard to play by the rules when you don't know what the rules are.)


Hay

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Ann

Numbers, I think trying to turn his previously good working relationship with Pence into a "thing" when it wasn't, is both an attempt (not a very good one either) at playing the gay card too hard. There was no need for him to use Pence to take him to his creator line and really no need to go there at all. As I said, I think he's playing it too hard and "looking" for a past criticism narrative that really didn't even exist. I have yet to see one tape or article where Pence was anything but respectful of Pete and vice versa. Trying to make a thing out of nothing (and for some political game) is looking like just that, a game.

He's not a victim and he shouldn't try to become one just because he's a Dem. He's actually led quite a good, productive, and successful life and was lucky to also be filled with nice opportunity/advantage in his life. Good for him for putting that opportunity to good use. He and his parents are American success stories - not any kind of victims.

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Ann

"You mean when tRump was swindling people and washing out debts he owed to them in Bankruptcy, having unprotected extra marital sex with porn stars, or when he was a Democrat who favored abortion?"

My goodness and to think of the upset recently at the idea that I'd dare call our feckless former president by his initials of BO. But with that said, I meant it this morning when I said Heri tends to be a step ahead of other Dems in noticing Dem realities vs Dem wishes.

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Carro

Ann

Numbers, I think trying to turn his previously good working relationship with Pence into a "thing" when it wasn't, is both an attempt (not a very good one either) at playing the gay card too hard. There was no need for him to use Pence to take him to his creator line and really no need to go there at al

Ann, I agree about Pete going on the offense and attacking Pence, when Pence has been nothing but collegial, supportive, respectful and kind.

Pete miscalculated that one. Pence is going to stick to the high ground and not respond in kind. Pete will look mean, petulant and more to the point in a Presidential election, intolerant and bigoted towards Christians.

He just announced that he plans to take the fight to them.

"Make me a cake or else".


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Carro

Ann, Biden's long-anticipated announcement was nothing but an attack on Trump and his supporters, based on the lie that Trump called neo-Nazis "fine people". He also basically lionized Antifa and called them "courageous".


That's the best Joe could come up with?

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margaux

Aaand, we're back to Pete.

What Pence doesn't understand is it's not Pete v. Pence on a personal level. It's about ideology.

“I wish the Mike Pences of the world would understand, that if you have a problem with who I am, your quarrel is not with me,” Buttigieg said. “Your quarrel, sir, is with my creator.”

Pence responded:

“He said some things that are critical of my Christian faith and about me personally. And he knows better. He knows me."

....when I was governor of Indiana, we fully implemented that decision in the law. But, Joe, I have my Christian values. My family and I have a view of marriage that’s informed by our faith. And we stand by that. But that doesn’t mean that we’re critical of anyone else who has a different point of view."

Pete's response:

People will often be polite to you in person, while advancing policies that harm you and your family. You will be polite to them in turn, but you need not stand for such harms. Instead, you push back, honestly and emphatically. So it goes, in the public square.

And here is Pence's record on LGBTQ issues. Why should Pete "tolerate" this "bigotry" toward people like him?

2000: During his congressional campaign, Mike Pence said, “Congress should oppose any effort to put gay and lesbian relationships on an equal legal status with heterosexual marriage.”

2000: Pence also supported the reauthorization of the Ryan White Care Act only if federal dollars were excluded from organizations who “celebrate” and “encourage” behavior that facilitates spreading of the HIV virus. Further, Pence supported this reauthorization only if “those institutions provided assistance to those looking to change their sexual behavior”, an off-the-cuff endorsement for ex-gay conversion therapy.

2004: Mike Pence co-sponsored a proposed amendment to the U.S. Constitution that would define marriage as solely between one man and one woman.

2007: Pence voted against the Employment Non-Discrimination Act (ENDA).

2010: Mike Pence voted against the “Don’t Ask, Don’t Tell” repeal which allowed LGBT Americans to openly serve their country in military service.

2012: Pence refused to say on the record if he supported a same-sex couple raising a child together.

2014: Gov. Pence supported HJR-3, a bill to add an amendment banning same-sex marriage to Indiana’s Constitution.

2015: Governor Pence signed the Religious Freedom Restoration Act in a closed-door ceremony surrounded by special interest lobbyists.

2015: Governor Pence said on ABC’s “This Week” that it was “absolutely not” a mistake to sign RFRA, throwing Indiana into a $250 million economic panic and putting Indiana’s “Hoosier Hospitality” reputation in jeopardy.

2015: Even after his approval rating plummets from RFRA, Mike Pence on July 22 told the media he is “studying” the issue of LGBT rights and whether or not he’d support across the board protections for the LGBT community.

https://www.cnbc.com/2019/04/10/mike-pence-says-pete-buttigieg-knows-better-after-criticism.html

https://www.indems.org/a-timeline-of-mike-pences-discrimination-against-the-lgbt-community/

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catkinZ8a

pb knows the left hates Pence, that's why he's fabricated the whole imaginary rift/tension between them.

pb's has now shown himself to be totally disingenuous.

Oh, and did everybody know pb's gay? He makes sure to mention it frequently.

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haydayhayday

Once again, with delay, my post is back. You can read it in its entirety if you want. Use your "find" button to find these words:



This post won't post


Hay



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haydayhayday

Emily, it sure is hard to follow the rules if you don't know what the rules are. Tell me. Just me. I won't use it against you and I won't tell anyone else.


Hay

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patriciae_gw(07)

Starting with Buttigieg to get it out of the way, Pence has publicly stated he believes that being gay is a choice, he does not believe in gay marriage saying it will destroy the nation (Buttigieg is married to a man) he has been against any and every policy to make being gay mainstream and unremarkable hence getting it back from a man born gay, married to a man, has served openly in the Military and if the nation is being destroyed which it well might be it is Pence who is part of that dynamic. I think he is just getting the gay bashing out of the way so he can concentrate on running on what he believes politically.

For Hay, my brother had asthma as a baby and lettered in track in high school. When his number came up in the lottery the only branch of the military willing to overlook the infant asthma was the army.

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nancy_in_venice_ca Sunset 24 z10

I agree with patriciae; Pence is against any granting of equal rights to LGBTQ persons, including marriage.

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catkinZ8a



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