Hi Vesfl,

I have had posts occasionally disappear from this site, so you're not alone.

Things were a bit chaotic in the sale of these roses last fall, as the Palatine team was trying to determine the best way to market these roses. The inventory list of roses available for sale, was not listed on the Palatine website in early December 2019. The list was posted on a different website that I believe Palatine uses for selling other products besides rose plants.

In digging the roses and getting orders ready for shipping, Palatine processed his usual inventory roses first. When he had that well in hand, they harvested the roses for this project; once he had the roses harvested, he sent me a list of the number of plants he was able to produce for each of the 62 varieties in mid September 2019. He had 5 grafted specimens of Sir Edward Elgar for sale at that time. Orders were taken on a first come, first serve basis a few days later. I presume that all 5 of these were sold, but I assume that there will be more than 5 specimens for sale at some time in late fall this year. Sir Edward Elgar is an excellent rose in our garden, and I hope it performs well for you in yours. If by chance you are not able to get a specimen, please let me know and perhaps we can trade rooted or unrooted cuttings. SEE roots very easily here.

Thank you, John! It's fantastic that Elgar made it. I'll call them in the fall to see if and how I can get it. If it doesn't work out, I'll get in touch with you and it would be wonderful to trade rooted cuttings. It's very kind of you, many thanks.

Marlorena, thank you for bringing the Dutch nursery to my attention! So much to choose from - I could hardly contain myself. I will try to limit myself to varieties that are unavailable in my own country.

The efforts of John and company are greatly appreciated, even though I am on the other side of the pond. I am thankful for the great preservation work that passionate rosegrowers do all over the world.

MetteBee... that's ok.. I thought you might already know it, being so close.. I think it's a good idea to order what you cannot get locally... I did get 9 roses from TL last winter, all doing well, at 5 euros each how can one resist such temptations ?.. and they're all grafted on 'Laxa', which is the same here,.. huge roses, big roots and well packed.. but the only Austin I got was Charles Darwin, which isn't rare, but a lot cheaper than the prices charged where I am..

Yes, great Canadian/U.S. effort.. it should be better known, internationally.. or, on the other hand, best to keep it 'quiet' too..?..

I am looking for Evelyn. Apparently K & M says that David Austin took it off the market so they no longer can grow it. My first time dealing with them. Any advice on where I can get Evelyn rose?

Tina, they told me the same thing a few days ago! I hear Otto & Sons might have it, but havent contacted them yet.

I think Austin is still growing it, but sold out, and more won't be available until next year. I read this in a recent thread, but sorry for the vague details. Have you contacted David Austin Roses? Diane

Roses Unlimited has it listed -- you could email Pat, the owner, and see what the current availability is. She's very helpful.

Seems tricky to find. Roses Unlimited emailed me earlier this fall that they're not carrying Evelyn anymore:

"We will not have Evelyn for next spring. We no longer offer this rose."

Austin told me that they're sold out until 2022 but will start taking pre-orders for her in Spring 2021 (for delivery Spring 2022). They warned me that she sells out as soon as she hits their web-site though..........which of course makes me even more curious to grow this rose and see what she's all about. I wonder if anyone has ever been disappointed with her. I'm surprised they don't have an entire farm dedicated to propagating her if she's this popular.

B-she is a beautiful fragrant rose. If you can find he, grab her. I’m a one of person, simply because sun spots are hard to come by here and there are so many roses I want to try but all this talk of Evelyn disappearing makes me want a back up. I would never want to be without her.

Tina B,

While I had 'Evelyn' in my collection at the time that I sent my list of Austins to Palatine, I failed to include it on the list, so I don't believe they have bud wood of this variety. I have added around 20 more vintage Austin roses to my collection since that time and may offer to send more of these to Rene at Palatine. But I am not sure that he will be able to accommodate more in addition to the 62 that I have already sent, on top of the 300-400 (?) rose varieties that he is already propagating.

I have also been sending Austin rose cuttings to Mindy at Hummingbird Roses, a new rose propagation enterprise, and thought that I had sent her cuttings of 'Evelyn' at one time; but she moved from Dowling, MI to Clare, MI, and so may have lost some of her roses in the move. I will send her cuttings of 'Evelyn' in my next shipment to her, so that it will be accessible through this vendor in time.

Needless to say, I am passionate about preserving some of the older products of the Austin breeding program, and it brings me joy to help keep them in circulation as one of my retirement projects for at least a few more years, now that many of these now out of commerce. Many of these may not be as refined as the newer releases, but still have their own special charm in plant form, floral characteristics, and/or fragrance.

I stick cuttings just one time per year from November to mid December, and can stick some cuttings of 'Evelyn' for you, if you like. I know the frustration of not being able to get a rose that you really want-it took me over 6 years to locate 'Cressida', one of my favorites from years ago.
I was finally able to get it from Hortico, but not until I was sent plants of 'Charles Austin' instead of the 'Cressida' that I had ordered for 2 years in a row. At that time, Hortico was purchasing bud wood cuttings of these Austin roses from Austin Roses USA. Hortico was sent mislabeled budwood (i.e., the budwood labeled as 'Cressida' was actually 'Charles Austin').

It was so rewarding when the true 'Cressida' plant it arrived in the third year and I first experienced the strong and unique fragrance of this beauty.

I called David Austin Roses last week. They said Evelyn was not being discontinued but would not be available until 2022 because of the demand. So there is hope for the future at least. John, thank you for all you do to preserve these lovely roses! Wish there was a nursery that devoted themselves just to the discontinued Austin roses!

John, I ordered Cressida from Palatine thanks to you and can’t wait to see how she does. Thank you so much for all your work to keep these roses in circulation!

@john_ca I just wanted to say thank you for the work you're doing! It allows those of us who love some of these (perhaps deliberately) long lost roses to continue enjoying them. I can't imagine it's easy work so your labor of love is much appreciated!!!

Alameda:

My wife and I are now situated on 2 acres of good, fertile land that is just a quarter mile from a major river, which provides us with ample high quality water via our well. We have toyed with the idea of starting a nursery, but don't want to be tied down. It is relatively easy for me to propagate 500 roses in one season by simply sticking cuttings into the ground that has been rototilled and provided water through drip lines. I have been fortunate to have traveled the world as a Naval Officer on active and in the the Reserves for over 20 years, and as a plant breeder (tomatoes and rice) for 30 years. My wife, however, has not had the opportunity to travel that much, so we want to be able to travel when this pandemic is over. I am happy to share my collection of rose with others, especially those involved in propagating, so that others can share in the enjoyment of these treasures. If there are any vintage Austins that you are 'needing' send me an email; perhaps I can help.

I am currently rooting around 30 vintage Austin roses for the San Jose Heritage Rose Garden, which has apparently lost a number of these roses from their collection; in return, they have permitted me to take cuttings of some of these rare older Austins, that I don't presently have, so that I can get them for my collection. I will be sending many of these to Hummingbird Roses (and to Palatine Roses, if Rene will accept them) so that she can propagate them and make them available to others.

oursteelers,

So happy for you that you were able to order 'Cressida' from Palatine. I received an email from Palatine in October of this year, stating that they were going to publish a list of their vintage Austin rose inventory in mid January 2021. I am surprised that they are taking orders now, but, again, I am pleased that you were able to order it. Have you grown or seen it before? The flowers here are huge and fragrant with a flower type that is a bit 'disorganized', like an old tea rose. But the fragrance is strong and very unique. May it thrive in your garden and bring you much pleasure! Actually there is another important character in the saving of 'Cressida'. It was Canadian Rick Sauder, who was the one who provided cuttings of this rose, to John V. at Hortico Roses in Ontario, Canada. So if it wasn't for Rick (now a volunteer leader at the Summerland Ornamental Gardens in British Columbia, who is working on a vintage Austin rose display at this site) this rose most likely would have been lost forever.

Aaron,

Thanks for your comment. Actually, its not that difficult or time-consuming, to send a few cuttings to propagators, to help preserve this germplasm. In retirement, we can all do some of the things that we may have wanted to do when we were working and just couldn't find the time.

Hi,

I want budwood for all type of DA fragrance roses which can grow in very hot and dry climate in India.

Is it possible to send budwood with phytosanitary and country of origin certificates.

Do let me know your thoughts.

Thanks

This is a great way to spread the joy of RRD to our neighbors.

If you are referring to John distributing rare rose budwood to other areas and the risk of spreading disease. that is not going to happen. John is a very careful and knowledgeable plantsman. His career and his education were in plant science. He almost certainly knows much more about plant health and plant physiology than most anyone else on these forums. Perhaps Malcom Manners and one or two other excepted..

He has sent me rooted plants which are now growing in my garden in Canada and has more to be sent to me for planting in Summerland when the border reopens. The roses he has sent me have all been certified for export to Canada. The same can be said for the wood he has shared with Palatine. To the best of my knowledge and belief, there is no incidence of RRD in his area of California. The fact that he has on numerous occasions had plant material from his garden inspected and cleared for international and interstate shipment by the California Department of Agriculture speaks to the disease and pest free status of his home garden.

You are correct, if the average home gardener sends plant material willy nilly around to other areas and other gardens without thought, or inspection, then both disease and inspects can and will be spread. John is not someone who is going to do that.

For the record, my own career was with the Canadian Food Inspection Agency which is the Federal Authority in Canada responsible for phytosanitary certification and pest control and eradication amongst many other things. So I know whereof I speak.

Rick

100% agree with @rideauroselad OkanaganBC6a. I find the comment about RRD to be rude and inappropriate.

john_ca - It is indeed wonderful that you are able to continue "saving" these older roses from extinction.

My only trepidation with ordering these roses produced by Palatine is that they are grafted onto Multiflora root stock. My soil and tap water are both very alkaline and I have read that Multiflora root stock does not do well in alkaline conditions. Most of my roses are on Dr. Huey except for the few that are own root. I am amending with Cottonseed Meal and Sulfur to reduce the alkalinity a bit, but it is a constant thing. That said, I do have several Camellias and Azaleas that are doing fine.

If the "ca" in your name means that you are in California, do you grow the roses on Multiflora rootstock? If I were to get the roses on Multiflora would it be a good idea to amend the soil with an Acid Lover's planting mix? Would it be a constant battle that might be lost at any moment, or would it be something that is definitely worth trying?

Thank you so much for any advice...

BirdsLoveRoses, I'm in Santa Barbara, and my soil and water are both very alkaline. I've grown many scores of roses on Multiflora rootstock over the past 20+ years with great success. I've never treated them differently than any of my other roses on Huey or own-root.

I'm obviously not in So Cal, but I do have alkaline soil, and like Susan, I've never had trouble with multiflora rootstock. I do use Lilly Miller Organic Granular Fertilizer for acid loving plants on all my roses, most of which are grafted on Dr Huey. I do this as a sort of bonus for the roses. They all like it, and so do my perennials, annuals, and veggies. Diane

Hi BirdsLovesSoCalCoast,

I live in Stanislaus County in Central California, less than a quarter of a mile from the Stanislaus River. Our water and soil are probably neutral to slightly alkaline. We grow own-root roses, rose grafted onto Dr. Huey, and roses grafted onto Rosa multiflora. They ALL do very well here. The multiflora roses typically have thinner canes when you receive them, but they have monster root systems, which can be 18 inches long or longer. Those grafted on to Dr. Huey typically have much thicker canes and roots, but the roots are typically trimmed. This difference in the size of roots and canes between these 2 types of grafted roses, is due to the fact that the grafted multiflora roses from Canada are budded in the fall of year one and harvested in the fall of year two: so they only spend one year in the field. Typically those grafted on to Dr. Huey rootstock in the US, spend 2 years in the field.

If I had to choose between the 3 types of plants, I would choose own root, as they will never produce rootstock suckers; also, I have never had a problem with Rose Mosaic Virus on an own-root plant that I have purchased. Of course, if you root a plant from a virused plant, it will also be virused. Most rose varieties that I have grown, do fine on their own roots in our area But there are exceptions, such as Gingersnap and a now obscure Austin rose, Ellen.

My second choice would be those grafted onto Rosa multiflora, as they tend to be very vigorous and tend to produce less rootstock sucker than Dr. Huey-grafted plants. Also, I have never received a plant grafted onto R. multiflora that had RMV. I think that many of the growers graft the scion on to a R. multiflora seedling plants, which would make it highly unlikely to be infected with virus.

My last choice would be Dr. Huey, especially from companies that are selling them as bagged plants at places like drugstores and big box stores. Besides the sucker problem, these cheaper roses are sometimes produced by grafting onto rootstock contaminated with RMV. But if you buy plants from more reputable companies such as Weeks and Edmunds roses, you are more likely to get a healthy plant. Still, most of my Dr. Huey plants do grow quite well without problems.

Thank you Susan, Diane and John - It's great to know that I shouldn't have any problems with the multiflora rootstock! Now I really want to try some!

Happy Gardening!

How are the scents of Cressida and Lordly Oberon like .... compared to St. Cecilia, and Mary Magdalene? THANK YOU.

I have St. Cecilia and Mary Magdalene and I consider these 2 myrrh scents as best ever among my 140 fragrant own-root roses. Comte de Chambord is nice to perfume the entire room (same with Firefighter), but it's pure heaven to stick my nose into Mary Magdalene's bloom, even bottled Frankincense can't measure up. I hope to find more enchanting and elating scents like Mary M. and St. Cecilia. Thanks for any info. on the scents of Cressida and Lordly Oberon. Below white is Mary Magdalene bloom, it gets pinkish if fertilized with biochar:

Mary Magdalene is a constant bloomer as own-root & worth buying for the blooming power and health, mine is 11th-year-own-root:

Below St. Cecilia scent is more floral than myrrh, and it lasts 5+ days in the vase:

St. Cecilia is very small as own-root, and the blooming is one-fifth of Mary M. Long pause in between flushes due to more petals in St. Cecilia & also chlorosis & pic. taken when it was 1st-year-own-root.

Thank you in advance for any info. on the scents and growth habit of Cressida and Lordly Oberon.

I know this thread is old but just in case: I’m unable to find any Austin Roses on the Palatine site. Is there another way to find them?

Straw - your MM rose is fabulous!!! I find it stunning in your bouquet!! :)

http://www.combinedroselist.com/freedom-gardens.html

@Vaporvac Z6-OhioRiverValley Nice to see you here! How have you been doing? I just think of you and your Paul Jerabek recently. Hope both of you are doing well.

For those who grow older Austins, which roses impress you the most with their scents? Thanks for the info.

Evelyn Evelyn Evelyn. And Abe :p

Abraham Darby

Cressida

john_ca THANK YOU for your hard work and passion in preserving older Austin roses.

Rosa M and Tina_Dallas and BirdsLoveRosesSoCalCoast and alameda/zone 8/East Texas and Bc _zone10b

From StrawChicago (Teresa): If anyone is interested in below rootings, please let me know which one, so I can start rooting indoor for you, instead of letting my zone 5a winter zap roses to below ankle.

Out-of-patent rootings that I sell to donate to charities are Evelyn, Dee-lish, W.S. 2000, Spirit of Freedom, Christopher Marlowe, The Dark Lady, The Squire, Augusta Luis, James Galway, Mary Magdalene, Abraham Darby, Sonia Rykiel, Dee-lish, Golden Celebration, Gertrude Jekyll, Radio Times, Pat Austin, Well Being, Tchaikovsky, Crown Princess Mag., Purple Lodge, thornless Yves Piaget child.

I also sent 3 Evelyn rootings, W.S. 2000, the Squire, The Dark Lady, Christopher Marlowe, and James Galway rootings to Mindy of Hummingbird roses. Austin scents are too precious to be extinct, plus it's good to pass on healthy Austins without RMV.

From the money I got from the above, I chip in my own money to Carmelites nuns in NY ($500 to orphanages oversea), and $300 to Missionaries of Charity or Mother Teresa nuns in Chicago with their homeless shelter for women and children.

Below is a tax receipt and a thank you letter from the nuns in Chicago for this year donation, haven't gotten the tax receipt from the Carmelites nuns in New York.

Abraham Darby is very healthy in my heavy rain & heavy clay if dug deep for fast drainage. Below are cuttings from Abe. Darby taken today 11/5/22 in my zone 5a. Note the 100% healthy & dark green and glossy leaves, plus I love its grapefruit scent. It roots easily like Evelyn.

Straw, I just PM'd you @ roses.

Sunny

Chaucer. Fair Bianca.

@john_ca

Hi, John,

I think it is amazing and wonderful you are assisting nurseries growing vintage DA. I have heard winderful things about Evelyn toderose. I looked Evelyn up and it is a bright Apricot pink. Is that the Evelyn mentioned on this thread? It looks lije it is available to order at DA Nursery, Texas?

I am excited to look at these vintage DAs. Do you have a list if the most disease resistant varieties? I have to be care because of rain & humidity in the Fingerlakes, NY where I live.

Regarding my virus free older Austins such as Evelyn & Abraham Darby & W.S. 2000 & others:

I don't sell to nursery, except to Hummingbird Roses in zone 5a since Mindy sells Austins cheap at $20 to cold-zoners who can't grow anything except for Austin and OGR.

I see it as spreading the joy of fragrant roses to modest income folks who can't grow anything besides Knockouts in brutal winters.

My entire endeavor is based of giving to those who need it the most. All the money goes to charities. I don't sell my roses to LARGE NURSERIES who already have tons of roses and want MORE profit.

I give priority on those who need Evelyn the most. The first choice goes to those who lost their ONLY Evelyn after years of growing. I understand that loss well, after losing $3000 worth of roses through my zone 5a winter for the past 3 decades.

The second choice goes to cold zoners who can't grow anything except for hardy Austin roses, they are desperate for roses that can survive brutal winters. I know zone 4 and zone 5 friends who lost newer Austins that can't survive winter as well as older Austins.

It's based on giving to the needy, rather than to those who already have lots, and want more out of greed. I don't sell my viruse-free Evelyn to any nursery who already has tons of roses to make a profit from. Doesn't make sense for me to sell Evelyn or older Austins cheap at $20 to a nursery, then they turn around and sell it for $60.

The older Austins are hard to root, they have such thin stems that for me to get a decent rooting, I have to cut so close to the crown, practically wiping out the mother bush. Rooting INDOOR through zone 5a takes a miracle to succeed. Tonight 11/7/22 I'm shopping at Walmart and other stores to get fish-tanks & grow lights to root roses.

@strawchicago z5 I didnt know you propogate roses. Is Abe & Evelyn really virus free? How many roses fo you sell? Do you sell to us privately?

I have Abe and it had the worst BS for 2 yrs.. I planned to remove Abe. Do you have any suggestions to make it virus free? I did spray and defoliated it…. leaves growing back & has no BS now. I’d keep it if it would grow normally!

Hi KittyNY6,

Like several other David Austin roses, such as 'English Garden' and 'Ambridge Rose', the color of 'Evelyn' in our garden is variable: from yellow apricot to apricot to pink, perhaps in response to temperature or other environmental factors. Some time ago, this rose was deleted from DAR's US catalogue, but I see that it is now back in their product mix, likely due to an increased demand for this rose. This IS the 'Evelyn' mentioned in this thread. Besides DAR, you may be able to get this rose from Freedom Roses (I just sent Peter Schneider 2 plants of 'Evelyn' and 10 cuttings, as he wanted to produce more plants of this variety than he could propagate from his mother plant. It may also be available through Hummingbird Roses-I just tried to get onto this website, but it is apparently down today.

I live in an area with a very dry climate, so it is hard for me to judge which Austin roses are the most disease resistant. Here is a link to the varieties that David Austin believes are the most disease-resistant in his product mix:

Disease Resistant Roses - David Austin Roses

I do remember when 'The Mayflower' (pink flowers) was released years ago, it was noted to be particularly disease-resistant, as would its white color sport, 'Susan Williams-Ellis', which just appeared on one of my plants of 'The Mayflower' last week! I have tagged the branch with the white flower and will be rooting it this week.

KittyNYz6 I grew 2 Abe. from tiny rootings. They were 100% healthy in fast-draining pots. Then I planted in my heavy clay. The 1st one I spent 2 hours digging until 3-gallon bucket of water drains INSTANTLY. The 2nd one I spent less time, and the water was slower to drain at 2 feet deep.

The 1st Abe. has 100% healthy and glossy leaves leaves as of 11/7/22, see below:

The 2nd Abe. in slower drainage lost leaves due to blackspots. When I dug it up, roots were very shallow in wet heavy clay.

The key to having healthy roses in high-rain climate is to dig down to 2 feet, then pour a 3-gallon bucket of water. If it doesn't drain instantly, then one will have blackspots.

Roses with DARK GREEN leaves like Abe. Darby bloom well with alkaline tap water, but they are prone to blackspots in acidic rain UNLESS the drainage is fast.

Brendan in Malibu, CA has 19.8 inch of annual rain, that's much less than NY annual rainfall of over 50 inch. plus tons of snow. Brendan informed me that his Abe. Darby is THE BEST BLOOMER, compared to stingy Jude and Golden Celebration (both have paler leaves).

My Abe pumped out 15 buds as 1st year tiny rooting in a dinky 3-gallon pot, with frequent topping of dolomitic lime to UP the pH after heavy rain. It takes 2 TBS of Garden Lime to raise the pH of 4.5 (acidic rain) to 6.5 per 12" diameter pot. This was Abe. with many buds after 3 months grown from a tiny rooting.

Yes, I sell older-Austin rootings to anyone. It's a lot of work in rooting roses to donate to charities. 1st priority is for rose-growers who lost roses and want to replace them. 2nd priority is for cold-zoners or extreme hot and dry climate who can't grow other roses besides older Austins.

Straw, I see! Wonderful! I probably need to dig, dig, up my garden-2 ft down or more!!!! I think next soring I’ll dig up a few roses & see that water drains in their holes better! EXCELLENT! Thank you! I will save Abe! They all have good soil, but I can improve on giving them drainage. Sometimes it’s rains a ton, though, for weeks in end of summer/fall whete everything never can dry! I am removing bottom leaves…. cleaning out around them to get them to air . It has helped, too.

I sm excited to see you propogating! May ai ask you to propogateca rose for me in the future? A rare one such as St Cecelia? st Cecilia looks like Earth Angel. Is it disease resistant?

KittyNYz6 St. Cecilia is NOT suitable for rainy climate. The first one bought as own-root from Roses Unlimited died in spring flood. The 2nd one, also from Roses Unlimited gives me endless pain. I dug it up 4 times to fix drainage or to change the soil, and it doesn't help.

St. Cecilia always pale, even in a pot. It's prone to blackspots as own-root, not sure if I have a healthy version. I grow it for its heavenly myrrh and floral scent alone.

Roses with RMV may not show the zigzag or yellow blotches, but are prone to diseases and stingy, such as my Gruss an Teplitz (only see the yellow blotches ONCE in its 12-years life span).

Below is what I notice in my garden of 150+ fragrant own root roses:

1) Own roots that can take high humidity with healthy leaves in my rooting bin, even with constant condensation (water) on leaves & stems. These can take extreme humidity yet have 100% healthy leaves, even with poor drainage if the soil is NOT acidic. Evelyn, W.S. 2000, Mary Magdalene, Christopher Marlowe, Pat Austin, Queen of Sweden, James Galway, Dee-lish, the Dark Lady, Spirit of Freedom, Tchaikovsky, Purple Lodge.

2) Own roots with healthy leaves with humidity, if the drainage is fast, plus liming on top to neutralize acidic rain: Abraham Darby, Crown princess Magareta, Tess of d'Ubervilles, A Shopshire Lad, Radio times, Well Being, Augusta Luis, Sonia Rykiel, Yves Piaget child.

3) Own roots that blackspots with high humidity despite fast draining or liming, and need constant potassium fertilizer to stay healthy: Golden Celebration, Carding Mill, the Squire, Gertrude Jekyll, St. Cecilia, Firefighter, Comte de Chambord.

4) Own roots with THICK LEAVES which rabbits don't eat: Evelyn leaves are thicker than Abe. Tchaikosky leaves are thick like Augusta Luis, Christopher Malowe leaves are thick like James Galway and Purple Lodge. Crown Princess Mag, Strike it Rich and About Face have thicker leaves than Cading Mill.

Never see blackspots on Chris, Evelyn, Tchaikosky nor James Galway.

5) Own roots with THIN LEAVES which rabbits devour: Abe. Darby, Munstead Wood, W.S. 2000, Sonia Rykiel, Well Being Golden Cel., Firefighter, Boscobel, and Comte de Chambord.

The above are my observation with own-roots in my garden plus rootings in humid bins of Evelyn, Dee-lish, W.S. 2000, Spirit of Freedom, Christopher Marlowe, The Dark Lady, The Squire, Augusta Luis, James Galway, Mary Magdalene, Abraham Darby, Sonia Rykiel, Dee-lish, Golden Celebration, Gertrude Jekyll, Radio Times, Pat Austin, Well Being, Tchaikovsky, Crown Princess Mag., Purple Lodge, thornless Yves Piaget child.

*** Princess Anne is touted as very healthy, but as its roots mature in its 5th-year, it's prone to blackspots in my poor drainage clay. Some Austins have chunky & woody root that rot fast in standing acidic rain water like Princess Anne.

Some own-root starts out as healthy cluster roots, then matures to chunky & woody (like Dr.Huey-rootstock) and become more Blackspot-prone in later years like Princess Anne.

Other Austins like W.S. 2000 have cluster-root (similar to multiflora) that does not rot in acidic rain, thus zero blackspots even as 12th-year-own-root. Leaves of W.S. 2000 and Evelyn have NO blackspots in high humidity rooting bin.

Evelyn can take high rain and poor drainage clay better than Abraham Darby (best bloomer for hot & dry and alkaline climate). A

Abe. Darby & Sonia Rykiel & Well-Being need a higher pH and all 3 bloom well with my alkaline tap water at pH 9, thus best for hot & dry climate.
Below are pics. of W.S. 2000 being healthy, it's right next to the rainspout dumping tons of acidic rain at pH 4.5, note the pale leaves:

Below pic. of Evely was taken July 24, after week-long rain, I never see blackspots on it in its 12 years as own-root, if biochar at pH 8.6 is given before a rainy month. Note Evelyn's paler leaves than Abe. Darby:

Straw, Thank you very much! That is the most helpful info on BS & drainage/rain I have wver seen! And wobderful list of DA! i maybneed to order a few new ones!

i just ordered for spring : Eutasia Vye, Emily Bronte, Queen of Sweden, Roald Dahl, & Conte de Chambord. Now I’d like Evelyn, Spirit of Freedom, & WS2000. They are on my wish list! (skip St Cecilia, thank you.) I am keeping all your info above for future reference-great varieties of disease resistant roses!

I have a few of the disease r varietiesthem: James Galway, Dee-lish, Abe, Yves Piaget reordered. Princess Anne is healthy so far 2 years-we will see in future.

Your knowledge is outstanding in these rose varieties! Thank you, again for your thorough work and assistance in helpung me with more healthy roses!

@strawchicago z5 Would you be interested in growing me an own-root Evelyn rose? Or know where I may acquire one?

KittyNYz6 From your list I have Eutasia Vye (gets blackspots as grafted on Dr.Huey), Abraham Darby (the one in fast drainage is much healthier than the one in poor drainage), Dee-lish, and 100% thornless Yves seedling (hardy in 10 years in my zone 5a).

Dee-lish is super easy to root at 100% success, Abe. Darby and Evelyn at 50% success, Yves seedling is only 10% success, finally succeed in rooting Yves-seedling after 10 years of failure.

I can start rooting an Evelyn THROUGH the winter for you, the chance of success is much less than rooting in the summer. For that reason, I start rooting for warm zoners INDOOR through my zone 5a winter (send out early March).

If not enough Evelyns take root through indoor winter, then I start rooting Evelyn in late May and send out in August for cold-zoners with cooler summer. Spirit of Freedom is easy to root, but I start in summer with cuttings from a friend in TX. I sold a few W.S. 2000 that my tiny bush is cut down to the crown, so it needs one year to grow back the canes.

Rooting is a chance for me donate to charities. When folks are generous in payment, it motivates me more in rooting indoor (much harder with zone 5a winter). Received this tax receipt this Nov. the $500 I donated to Carmelite friars in NY. They wired the money to Catholic priests who work in orphanages overseas.

The money also goes to Catholic nuns who work in orphanages overseas:

I specify on my donation that the money goes to toothbrush & toothpaste for dental care of orphans overseas. Receiving below pic. is the reason for my rooting roses:

@strawchicago z5

How Sweet! You are the best! $500 will buy a lot of toothpaste for a few children! How wonderful! Please send me a message in Houzz w/ your address and I’ll send you funds to grow me an Evelyn. Wouod you like a check or debit card number? I’ll wait patiently for whenever it roots spring or summer. Thank you, Kitty

Oh, Straw...the world needs more people like you! Well done :) :)

Well done, Straw! Evelyn is on my wanted list, but I have to put my garden in order and not overspend on buying roses hoping it will survive in our z4 frozen tundra central WI weather. And I couldn’t agree more @rosecanadian that we need more people like Straw. ❤️