Only invite the cousins and their kids that you WANT at your wedding. It's likely the estranged ones won't hear of it anyway. In my world there are no consequences from excluding people who are not an active part of my life, (by choice and not by circumstances/distance).

And, this is YOUR day, a day to celebrate you and your SO's relationship and commitment to each other. There is simply no way I would invite your dad to the ceremony. Since he has badmouthed your groom, why would you subject your SO to that on his wedding day? (Mental illness or no). And quite frankly, if your father finds out and becomes angry about being excluded, exactly how much worse could your relationship with him become? Not much of a risk from what you've written here. Even with (maybe especially with) people with mental illness, you have to learn to have firm boundaries and not feel guilty for enforcing them. You deserve your happiness, you're coming into this life passage at a later age than most do, so make the most of this time and the time you have left with your SO. He's the one who is going to be by your side for the rest of your life.

Elope.

^^^

Took the words right out of my mouth.

Use the money saved for your new life together.

Yeah DT, we've thought about that. We'd still like to have something more community/family oriented, but then when I try to choose who to invite and who not to, the list just gets big. I am an extrovert, and actually have a LOT of very close friends. Dad will get invited, we're used to his carp and know about boundaries. That's why we have to move now. We set the boundaries but he keeps pushing them. We know about that too. Like I said, friends and family already have volunteered to help "manage" him. My dad is sick and he tortures himself as much or more than he does us. We try to be compassionate but also detached. Not easy but I can't totally cut my dad off, he doesn't deserve that treatment at 86. He tried as best he could with the disabilities he has. Who knows what will happen by the wedding date. I'm trying to get him into treatment. Hard to work with his primary care doctor, who is a bit of a quack but in our poor area, not many good doctors.

The real issue is how to manage the guest list. The other factor is that actually I am part of a large extended group of friends who are like a family/tribe. We all keep in touch. I know some that are overseas or in other parts of the country will understand why we didn't invite them, but those within driving distance are already wanting to come and help just when they found out we were getting married. Date not set yet but soon.

What would your guest list look like if you invited only the people you really wanted at the wedding?

Hard to parse. There's the people you really would WANT at your wedding, and then there are the people who might actually COME. The problem is, you never know how many that you want there might totally come. I'm thinking close to 100 if I chose the ones I want. I could probably cut that in half, but by what criteria? So far I am going with family, folks that have invited me to their weddings with whom I am still close, and best friends and a few pretty good ones that live nearby the wedding site. We're at about 60-70 right now, but if I add some more who might be willing to fly or drive, then we're getting close to 100. But if they fly and drive, then I feel obligated to have a pretty big blowout for their troubles. Like I said, I think ones that live far away might understand that since the wedding is going to be so modest, no reason for them to travel so far.

You have so much on your plate. Health is an issue, money is an issue, your dad is the biggest issue.

Yes to having something very small and elegant. What is most important? Getting married or having the party?

You can't count on who will or won't come. Sometimes the outcome is very surprising.

I say have an intimate wedding with the promise of coordinating a family reunion in the future.

Your father is a lucky man to have such a compassionate daughter. And an understanding future son in law!

Eld has the answer!

Yeah, do an intimate/elope/destination type wedding now and then have a big house warming once you get your new home. Time to parse what's on you plate and make it all more sequential than concurrent. Otherwise you can be so frazzled by it all that you won't enjoy any of it.

You have so much on your plate. It does not seem like the time to add the stress of a wedding. But if you want one, be totally selfish about it. There are enough non-traditional elements to this that you don't need to worry. I mean cousins' children have no reason to expect to come, and so you should only invite the ones you like.

Other than immediate family, I would take a Marie Kondo closet-cleaning approach. Only invite those that "spark joy"

ETA: But if they fly and drive, then I feel obligated to have a pretty big blowout for their troubles. No, no, no. That's just like, oh they spent $$$ a plate, I have to give $$$. This is not an event with a balance sheet. No side has a right to breakeven or profit! If they only care about surf and turf --- stay home!

Oh boy, can I relate. My dh and I spent hours going over guest lists. We knew many of his family and some friends wouldn't make the trip as the wedding was in Central New York, and he lives in Philly. But we invited them anyway and penned a post script on the invitations to those we 100% knew couldn't make it (health reasons, etc) saying we just wanted to share our joy with them and to let them know they would be in our thoughts that day. We also added a "please, no gifts--we have everything we need." They felt happy to be included in a small way.

What really helped me get over the guilt of not inviting someone, was to sort of reverse the question: would I be surprised to receive an invitation to that person's wedding? If the answer was an honest "yes", then they were not invited. And after it was all over, I would run into some of my friends who hadn't been invited. (not super close, but friends in a very small village). It wasn't the least bit awkward. They were just genuinely happy for me.

As for relatives, I invited my first cousins, but not their children. As far as attrition, we invited 150 people and ended up with 101. It was a perfect size.

Listen to your heart.

I am really happy for you. The next chapter is remarkable.

jo

I like jojo's litmus test!

Me too!

I know the feeling of wanting to put on a blowout for people who travel far. What about having a bbq the night before for out of towers? But informal, like, byob. Or, have a really nice party with your friend group that lives close to you and then do not invite them to the wedding, but with the understanding that you are celebrating your marriage with them in a special way.

My bff’s brother just got married. He’s 62. He and fiance went alone to the courthouse for the ceremony. Afterwards, immediate family only went to a unique bar for a pre-arranged signature drink and light appetizers. They then went to an upscale restaurant across the street where they had a private room for dinner with a champagne toast, small wedding cake and the table dressed in flowers of her choosing. I love this idea!

If you want a big party, limit your guest list to 100 with the idea that 75-85 will show. Then keep everything low key and casual since you’re on a budget....simple decorations, bbq or picnic fare, flowers from Costco in mason jars, a sound system with a four hour playlist of your favorite songs instead of a dj, self serve soda/wine/beer.....you get the idea. Low cost and low key doesnt have to mean “low rent.” Lots of great ideas for everything on the internet.

I don't have any better advice. Just wishing you all the best as you mark this special milestone. Everyone passes through difficult phases in life. I am sorry one of your more difficult times coincides with one of your more important joys. I am sure you will navigate this with tremendous grace.

I have dealt with mental illness my whole life. First my parents and now my sister. I walked away from my parents because I was afraid for my children's health, happiness life Etc. It took everything I had not to become completely twisted around by them. All of this to say I understand why you are consumed by your father's narcissistic personality.

I cannot know exactly how difficult it is for you I can only truly empathize.

If it were me I would find a good friend with a backyard and invite as many people as could fit. Or I would elope. And have a barbecue type party or celebration after all the dust has settled. Best of luck in your choices. And congratulations on the upcoming nuptials.

Running, that is an amazingly insightful, well stated, and compassionate post. Wish I could "like" it more than once.

The house was in my mothers name and was left to both my father and I equally. He no longer lives there but yes, due to having previously lived there considers it "his" and uses that card a lot. I am only staying in the house until I finish going through the things in it but even that may have to take a back seat to getting OUT of it. SO and I had been considering taking full ownership of the home but now due to my father's increasingly strange behavior, that is off the table. We will be out as soon as we find a suitable house to buy. We were sort of looking anyway but will now pick up the pace. My father is not a complete monster but he is very disturbed. I have actually been just going over to his apt. for short visits once a week to check for any clear signs he was not able to take care of himself. Anyone who has dealt with a combative mentally ill person knows it is not that easy. They continually push boundaries even if you are strict about setting them. Dad lulled me into complacency by being docile for a while. I will be making some changes. But one cannot snap fingers and it is done. As I mentioned that entails moving and getting a new job, two of the most difficult and stressful things you can do other than suffer a death in the family or health crisis. I've had some deaths and health issues to deal with so was trying to pace myself! Stay tuned I guess!