I Love Red - If possible, I would highly suggest that you have your kitchen designer drop the 15 inch high uppers in on your drawings and see what you think. This should be very easy for them to do with the 20/20 software in a short amount of time.

Crown can be hard to add with the 20/20 but I would have them get the crown molding in your drawings as well. Get 2-D elevations as well as some 3-D renderings from them before making your decision. How will your cabinet crown and kitchen ceiling crown interact ?

I looked at some of your older posts with kitchen elevations and the 18 inch high uppers are already starting to look long and low in proportion to your overall layout. I personally and professionally like stacked uppers to feel more square, but some prefer them to look tall and narrow, and some prefer the long and low proportions.

The 15 inch high stacked cabinets will definitely have a long and low look.

Here's a pic of mine before they were taken out. Obviously no crown molding yet. Mine are 42/18 with full overlay frameless boxes.

Thanks Columbus. She uses 20/20 and CAD. She is changing the top cabinets for us (she and I) to look at. I want the same 3 piece molding I had in my last house. It is layered with two flat boards and a tiny crown and I guess I'm worried that 6" won't be enough space. Maybe 6" is perfect and I should leave the 18" cabinets alone.

I'm planning to just take the same trim around the room.

maybe I need to knock on the door of my old house, measuring tape in hand and ask to measure it, lol.

ILR, that does look like a 6" trim in your old house.

Cp..your kitchen is going to be beautiful.

you may be right. I wish I had measured it.

ILR, here is a pic of our kitchen from several weeks ago. Our top doors aren't hung yet and we haven't done the crown. But you can see what that 6" gap looks like before the molding goes on. It's really hard to tell from your pic, but yours might be more than 6". You certainly wouldn't lose any functionality by going a little shorter. You could do 42/16 to get to an 8" gap.

You're very welcome. Take a look at her revised drawings and you'll get a extremely good feel for which version will work best for you. Here are two quick drawings showing the difference between the 15 and the 18 inch high stacked cabinets with ten foot ceilings. Note how the 15 inch high cabinet starts to look long and narrow.

Gthigpen..your kitchen turned out just beautiful. What a journey, huh.

Columbus...very helpful. Thank you so much.

do you think the 15" is squatty or do you think it's just personal preference?

ILR - Thank you. I wish I could say it looks much different now, but not much has been done. We did get our cabinet pulls on, so no more masking tape pulls! I'm going to spent my time off of work at Christmas finishing all the touch up paint that's needed, install the upper cabinet doors and get the crown molding on. We aren't mentally prepared to pick a back-splash at the moment so we'll live with that ugliness for awhile longer. I can't wait to see your final product!

Gthigpen..just saw your note re: 16" uppers. Hadn't thought of that. The pic I posted was 42" uppers with 9 ft ceilings in my old house so that large frieze board won't be necessary.

ETA..i posted the same time you did. Your house will be beautiful. I love your ingenious ideas. Saw your fp. Oh the stories your family will have. I'm a lot older than you and I'm fed up with this da** house, lol.

I think to a degree it's a personal preference. Some like the square look, some like the tall and narrow, and some like the short and long look. The width of your lower cabinets will affect how the shorter cabinets stacked on top will appear.

It also becomes a matter of scale, balance, and proportion in terms of design, which is why you really need to see your entire kitchen with both the 15 and the 18 cabinets shown.

In the drawings up above, I've shown 24 inch wide lower wall cabinets. In the elevation I had found of yours, you had 24 inch wide cabinets flanking your hood.

To give you a sense of scale using my photo.

The glass lower cabinets are both 36" wide so the doors of the upper uppers are 18" x 18". The cabinet to the right of the glass cabinets is 24" wide so the upper uppers there are 12" w x 18" h.

With 42" high cabinets and a 108" ceiling, that's 12" of crown molding if the cabinets went to the ceiling.

With 120", you have 66" to work with. I think you need 39" tall cabinets with 18" above and 9" of molding. The ideal proportion for a stack is 2/3 and 1/3, which is very close to 39"/18". Also, you really want more molding than 6". If you want 12" of molding like at your last home, then do 36"/18".

Also, if you are doing a true stack, separate the uppers from the lowers by a simple bead molding to help with the inevitable seam. It's a great look. Be sure to ask about the warranty for extra tall cabinets if that is what is being done instead of a true stack. Longer wood is more prone to warpage. Some cabinet companies will make extra tall cabinets, but not warrant them.

Also, you really want more molding than 6". If you want 12" of molding like at your last home, then do 36"/18".

She didn't have 12" of molding at her last house.

And why do you really want more molding than 6"? What "rule" is that?

And frankly, I prefer the 42" with the 18 because I find the 18" over the 39" with 9" of molding makes the top look top heavy. Which shows, to each his own.

cpartist did you miss her post above showing the cabinets at her last house? She said they were 42"H, and they go to the 9' ceiling. That's 12" of molding. Not 6".

6" is perfectly fine for 96" ceilings. Even 108" ceilings. Taller ceilings than that starts to look a bit on the skimpy side, unless the cabinets are pretty plain, like a shaker style. The more ornate door styles and higher ceilings need larger moldings to balance them out.

This is 30"+18" with 6" of molding to a 108" height. It is a common stack proportion as well because the top alignment height at 84" of the first layer is available in a wide variety of cabinet lines and you don't need custom sized cabinets to do it. I do find this a bit top heavy. But anything close to a 2/3 to 1/3 ratio usually works.

Wow, I don't know what to say. We have been working on this kitchen for a year. I was hoping to get them ordered so I could have this over with.

My kd started out with 36" cabinets which she also prefers and I talked her into changing to 42" because all of my doors and windows are at an 8 ft header height and I thought it looked more balanced when the cabinet top of the cabinet lined up with them.

that frieze board and the 3 piece molding together equal 12" . That trim was adjustable to some degree based on where the trim started on the frieze board.

the new cabinets are one piece not actually stacked. Much like the ones Kompy above posted. The company is Amish. Very well known around her. My old kitchen was Woodmode. Maybe I need to have kd price the cabinets from Woodmode as well. But I really was hoping not to go that high this time.

i really appreciate the wise words from All of you. I don't want to screw this up.

Soffits are not outdated. A main function is to reduce the scale of an oversized room to more human proportions. And it comes in handy to reduce cabinets costs big time, and dusting on top of the cabinets as well. It can reduce cabinet costs by 1/3.

Soffits can also create a great tray ceiling look. 10’ ceilings is functionally too tall for a kitchen. You can’t really reach anything in a cabinet beyond 7’ without a stepstool anyway. One casualty of open living is a the kitchen now feels forced into a public reception role to which it’s awkwardly suited. No one has taken open concept so far as the bathroom in most builds yet, thankfully!

Although Kohler wants you to think that their toilet belongs front and center in a living room.

Thanks Sophie. Always good advice. At one point I thought about a soffit and then raising it back in the center and using bead board to create a a tray ceiling of sorts but it just seemed to complicated and overwhelming with all of the decisions I had to make building this da** house. I don't have a designer helping me. Just a kd. No such person in this neck of the woods.

great picture.

Please give me your opinions.

This is my wall cabinets with the uppers at 16" vs 18" with the 42" tall cabinets. The trim is added. My kd has put up with so much of my indecisiveness..she will go back to 18" if I need to...

Do you think the 16" cabinets look squatty?

ILoveRed - I don't think the 16 inch high cabinets look too squatty, especially with the change in the hood panel detail. I would suggest a slightly taller frieze detail though on the crown.

What finish will your cabinets have again ? Will there be ceiling crown above the window ?

The 16” isn’t squattey. The 18” was fine too. The 42” is too tall. That’s been much of the issue all along. Shorten up the too tall lower portion of the stack if you are going to keep stacked. If you want giant crown molding like at your last house, then 36”+18” or 39”+ 15”. If you want glass, the smaller doors at the top tend to look like eyeballs looking down if you go too small. The doors need to be large enough to have muntins that dont make teeny tiny squares. If your are thinking muntins and not open frame.

I was just going to suggest what Sophie said. Try shortening the bottom cabinets to 40".

Also, one of your 16" upper pictures, it says 1'3" on the upper portion. Isn't that 15"?

Sophie...what height would you suggest for the lower?

ETA...Sophie...you don't think it's a big deal that the top of the lower doesn't line up with the top of the window?

Gthigpen...my brain is fried from too many decisions and lack of sleep. That is supposed to be 15" not 16". I misspoke. Thank you for picking up on that.

Decrease the trim level on the windows if that non alignment bothers you. Then tile the whole wall. You are factoring window trim unto this? Not just window rough opening? Because your diagrams do not appear to be looking at the whole.

Thanks guys...sorry I didn't get back here. I was at my daughters this weekend. Recent remodel....She has 8.5 ceilings and 36" plus 18" stacked with a simple crown that goes all around the room. It looks really good and her upper cabinets are very accessible by her tall husband.

Sophie..the window trim is very simple as is. Yes, I thought I should factor window and door alignment into this. Clearly it's not an issue. I can't envision tiling the whole wall. I would have to see it. But I would probably like it.

Columbus....my cabinets will be inset in BM Swiss Coffee with a dark brown burnished cherry island. I have a door I haven't approved yet. I think it's too ornate than I hoped for...Plus I wanted rub through with the island color to show through and it's too much I think. So I have another door coming today that is less ornate but still has the rub through and eased corners. I may post both later today and get you and others opinions. There will be a ceiling crown above the window.

Its a lake house and I was hoping for a look that was more relaxed and not pristine like my last house.

thanks everyone.

Sophie..I can appreciate the eyeball analogy now that you say it and I will not go with too small uppers no matter what I do with the lowers.

My finished kitchen height is just over 10’. My kd and I settled on 36/16 with a 3 pc 12” crown. The 16” are display cabs with glass and side fronts. It’s perfect.

PS. Not sure how to measure but my posted dimensions were the door fronts. Hope it helps

can’t seem to get a good photo. Photo Looks ‘squatty’/wise when I submit post

Mags...that looks really good. Proportions are very nice.

will you tell me a little about your hood to the left and get another picture of it with the cabinet above it, please? Not asking much, am I , lol.

thank you so much!

Mags...this is just about what Sophie suggested so I really appreciate the pic. Easier to visualize.

The 12" crown looks beautiful but to me it's a more formal look.

It does. But what do you think of the molding I had in my old house that i posted above? It was 12" with the frieze board and the other 3 pieces and the whole thing was almost flat? It's a much less formal look I think. my kd is going to kill me if I go back and ask her to change the cabinets to 39" or 36" and 18" but I think I have to or I will wonder what it will have looked like.

@Cooks Kitchen

"With 120", you have 66" to work with. I think you need 39" tall cabinets with 18" above and 9" of molding. The ideal proportion for a stack is 2/3 and 1/3, which is very close to 39"/18". Also, you really want more molding than 6". If you want 12" of molding like at your last home, then do 36"/18"."

thank you so much! Just got off the phone with my kd and she didn't mind at all changing this for me to 39" and 18" with 9" leftover, which is what you suggested and very close to what Sophie suggested as well. Hopefully I will get to see it tomorrow and I will get your opinions.

thanks again.

There is no one way is the right way as you can see as long as the dimensions are close. Sophie's right in that you'll never reach the top shelf of a 42" cabinet, but to me, that's where I'll store things I rarely use. Or since in my case it's mostly glass, I'll put decorative items on the upper shelves. It's what works for you.

I'll see how it looks. Who knows ..I may end up with the original drawing :-)

ILoveRed - there was a photo here of my hood as I’m still without a backsplash and was getting help. It’s a Modernaire barrel style hood. Initially considered stainless as I had seen them here and they were really nice. At the last minute before ordering, kd suggested black (went with matte) and the black color was the right choice. It works well with the soapstone countertops. I’ll post a picture but embarrassed to say I’m still tileless. I’ve taken a lot of sophie’s advice posts and have been happy with the results. I need a real ladder to access the upper glass cabs. I use a 2step stool to clean top of hood to give you an idea. I found the 42” upper cabinets in old kitchen almost as useless as a 12” base cabinet; top shelving was inaccessible and dragging a real ladder into the kitchen aisles was a hassle. This time, I did a pantry wall around and as deep as the fridge and that goes up to the crown. Storage was key for this kitchen as old houses seem to lack storage.

ILoveRed, don’t look at the calendar and try to rush to get it over with. Kitchens are worthy of the time spent planning.

Thank you Mags. Don't feel bad about lack of backsplash. It does take a long time to get things right. I've taken forever. Just ready to be done with it. But, thanks for the encouraging words.

i love your hood. My kd called today and we are going to get a price on the same hood for my kitchen. I'm sure it will be way more than I want to spend but I love that hood. The black looks sharp in your kitchen..

Sophie and Cooks Kitchen....please take a look at my drawings. This is 39" and 18" now with room for 9" trim. What do you think? Any other suggestions?

Thank you.

No mullions in glass uppers. Antique glass. Short fractional Mullions in kitchen windows. Crown will be over window as well..

Hood is undecided.

They all look fine. How about putting together a pic of all three and have us all look at them together.

The trim level suits you and your taste. The shorter cabinets look more proportionate overall.

Now look at how the window trim is going to be handled and how it relates to the cabinets or other built ins. It all has to work together. Which is why CPA’s hatband trim is such a great detail for her home. It presents s unifying detail. You need a “trim package” that does a similar task for you.

ILoveRed - the hood was more than I wanted to spend as were the cabinets, flooring, etc etc. The hood/stove was the focal point of the small kitchen.

I love your hood.

If easily doable, consider counterheight window. My window behind sink was raised above like in your drawing. I lengthen the window down to counter-height. It was a great move and so glad I did it. Shld also mention, I went with a crank handle to open vs a sash window so I didn’t have to ‘lean into’ the sink to open a sash window.

Hi Mags...my house is almost at the drywall stage so way too late for the counterhight window but I seriously considered it at one time. I love the look.

i did heed the advice of the crank out window. They are casement windows. The architect drew in 3 windows and I gave up one to get more upper cabinets. I hope I don't regret that when it's all done.

we (kd) called modernaire and I'm working on a hood. We shall see. Thank you for the advice!

Mags...i have a question.

We just got a price on the hood. In order to get the bottom of it 30" above my range top, we have to have a custom size of 28" height (instead of the standard 30").

Did you do the same or change your cabinet design to accommodate the standard size hood?

thanks.

Only builders using cheepchinesecrapola that doesn’t offer enough height options to do the job in proper proportioned.