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haberstarr

Bluestar Platinum 48 range or Wolf Dual Fuel 48 Range? Help!

haberstarr
4 years ago

We're wrestling with whether to purchase BS Platinum 48 Range or Wolf Dual Fuel 48 Range. LOVE Bluestar top with open burners, but trying to gain comfort level with the Platinum's gas oven with PowR burner. My wife loves interface and known quantity of Wolf range electric ovens but agrees with me that Bluestar top with open burners is vastly superior. Plus Bluestar 48 can hold full sheet pan in big oven and half sheet pan in small oven. Neither is true of the Wolf 48. If absolutely necessary we have the room to go with BS Platinum rangetop and Wolf or Thermador wall ovens but want to avoid that is at all possible. If we can get comfort level with oven on the Bluestar PLatinum 48 then it's a no brainer'.


Looking for information from owners only, or someone who has direct operational experience/knowledge of these products please. It's not my intention to start another open/sealed burner war or bring out cheerleaders of one brand or another out of the woodwork. That said, people with actual experience with the BS Platinum and/or Wolf DF 48 PLEASE HELP! Save us from ourselves with your feedback.


THANKS!!!

Comments (49)

  • Rita / Bring Back Sophie 4 Real
    4 years ago

    Google Wolf ovens and blue enamel chipping on GW, to be sure you are comfortable with Wolf ovens.

  • M
    4 years ago
    last modified: 4 years ago

    Just curious why you are looking at the Platinum instead of the RNB? I like everything new and "shiny" as much as the next guy. And I have to admit that I have been tempted by the Platinum.

    But then, the more research I have put in, the more I am convinced that I am actually better off with the RNB. The only thing that I want from the Platinum is the slightly higher BTU burners. But the difference is so little, it's not really a deal-breaker either way.

    On the other hand, Bluestar obviously is selling their Platinum models. So, there are people who see a general advantage in having those features.

    And just for the record, we have a 30" RNB, and I love both the burners and the oven. They work very reliably and simply do what they are supposed to do. The oven does need about 20min to fully preheat. That's where the PowR burner might help. But since you'll also have a smaller oven, I doubt you'll really have too much trouble with pre-heating in the first place.

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  • haberstarr
    Original Author
    4 years ago

    Thanks Rita good point, I'll be interested to see where the numerous lawsuits on the blue chipping end-up.

  • wekick
    4 years ago

    I have the Wolf DF and do not recommend it due to blue chipping.

    Agree with M. I would look at BS RNB. There are many threads about the Platinum. If you just want the 3K BTUs more the platinum gives you then that is your only choice though. The oven is different which would be an issue for me. The convection never shuts off all the way in the Platinum even though you turn the switch off. All the heat comes from the back, no bottom element. If you bake a lot I can't see that being ideal. It might be passable for roasting.

  • haberstarr
    Original Author
    4 years ago

    Thanks M. We like the Platinum's look, interchangeable griddle/grill and 25k btu burners. I know there are valid points of view on both sides of all of those features but it's what we've decided for now. While we may reconsider RNB, I really want to find out about personal experience in baking and roasting with the Platinum oven with PowR burner. Thank you though for the feedback on RNB! It may well come in handy if we reconsider the RNB.

  • catinthehat
    4 years ago
    last modified: 4 years ago

    Hey there haberstarr! Great timing, I just finished my 1 year research journey selecting and ordering a range. I had no budget restrictions, and I ended up choosing the 48" Bluestar RNB. I am a serious hobby chef and required high performing open burners. That alone (surprisingly) limited my choices to the likes of Bluestar, Capital, and American. Who would have thought high performance open burners were so hard to come by in "professional" ranges?! To keep this post brief, I bulleted some of my major decision points below:

    Range size:

    - I went with 48" because I wanted a full size oven for cooking/baking for groups, and a smaller oven for everyday use heating food, baking bread, biscuits, finishing meats and fishes, etc.

    Burners:

    - Open burners 100% for me. Hotter the better. I use to work a bit in a professional kitchen with garland open burners, and I would never willingly go back to sealed burners. Depending on the design they are not hard to clean either.

    Oven:

    - I wasn't looking for anything fancy, just something that is reliable and heats evenly. With the way the Bluestar Power oven works, and all the reviews I've read online, that was a definite no from me. There are inherent limitations to a stove with a rear heating element that cannot be overcome with any tricks. Basic oven designs do not change for a reason, and Bluestar did not figure out something nobody else knew.

    Fit and Finish:

    - I saw Bluestar and Capital in person. I vastly preferred the Bluestar in finish and appearance as well. I did not find too much information on American ranges compared to Bluestar and Capital, and did not feel it was worth spending my hard earned money on a range with less community experience.

    Conclusion:

    In my dream world, I would have the RNB with 25k burners on top, and from what I've researched there still may be a way to make that happen. For now though I plan on enjoying my RNB with 22k open burners and an oven that will serve me well for years to come.

    Good luck with your own journey!

    *edit* Just saw your post above regarding appearance. The new version of the RNB looks identical to the platinum, minus the SS knobs which you can upgrade to on the RNB if that matters.

  • haberstarr
    Original Author
    4 years ago

    Thanks Steve! Did you do any test cooking in the Platinum PowR oven? If so, results? We test baked some cookies but got a little distracted in showroom and they got a touch overdone, but they were evenly cooked. Cooked cookies in Wolf wall oven while watching more closely and they came out perfect and perfectly even. Not a fair test though due to our distraction during BS test. We typically bake bacon in our ovens. As such we also test cooked bacon in the BS Platinum oven....BEST. BACON.EVER. That said we were pressed for time and still didn't come away fully comfortable with BS Platinum oven. If we go with BS range, this will be our first gas oven as well so that's a factor. We have the same reservations you mentioned about Platinum oven, were you able to test cook (roast and/or bake, really curious about bake) to confirm? Also, we haven't seen new RNBs in person yet. They look same as Platinum now? Thanks!

  • haberstarr
    Original Author
    4 years ago

    Thanks Wekick! Do you have any additional feedback on your Wolf DF other than the blue chipping?

  • M
    4 years ago

    Take a look at this thread: http://ths.gardenweb.com/discussions/3659959/blue-star-differences-in-rnb-and-platinum-lines#16687045


    There actually are good reasons, why people prefer the RNB griddle over the Platinum griddle. Of course, the downside is that you can't remove it and can't turn it into a grill. But the upside is that it seems easier to clean and you won't burn yourself on the vent hole.


    Also, with a 48" range you might not actually need the ability to remove it. And you can always use it as an improvised French top, if you really do need the extra space.


    Personally, I wouldn't miss the grill, as I think indoor grilling is a bad idea to start with. But if you don't have easy access to an outdoor grill, your priorities could be very different from mine.

  • M
    4 years ago

    For an alternative option, let me repeat what our new kitchen will look like. I have previously mentioned this in other threads:

    After much soul searching, I realized that I don't really ever need more than 4 burners. I don't need an indoor grill. And I feel ambivalent about a griddle, as I like it when it works, but I don't like cleaning it nor do I like the long preheat time.

    In other words, I am probably best served with a 30" or 36" range. The latter actually would be luxurious and is not technically needed. It would only be used to keep things warm, and that's actually much better done in an oven anyway.

    What I do need though is more than one oven. And really what I need is different ovens. I need both large and small, and I need traditional and steam.

    So, instead of getting a 48" range with two ovens, we decided to keep our existing 30" Bluestar RNB, and we'll add both a Miele CSO and a Miele Speedoven. It'll more than address all of my cooking needs.

    If I didn't already own a 30" RNB, I might consider getting the 36" one; but I am not 100% sold on whether I want a bigger oven that takes even longer to preheat. The 30" cavity is awesome and fits a full size baking sheet. The size is great the one or two times a year when I really need it; but I am hard-pressed to envision the need for anything bigger.

  • haberstarr
    Original Author
    4 years ago

    Thanks M et al, based on y'all's (Southerner for possessive form of "you all" :-)) comments above and a BS Platinum 48 owner's feedback we are going to research RNB 48. possibly going Platinum 48 rangetop and Wall Ovens though I'd prefer to stick with range if possible. 2.5 year owner of Platinum range said he LOVED the top but was so so on the oven. Said it's performance was very similar to his previous GE gas oven. No problems but ever so slightly uneven.

  • haberstarr
    Original Author
    4 years ago

    Exact comments from 2.5 year Bluestar Platinum 48 Range copied below:

    Going to be perfectly honest here.... I absolutely love the top. The burners, the grill/gridle ability. Perfect. The oven is, well.... just an average oven in my opinion. We had a GE Profile gas convection prior to this and to be honest, I am not sure there is much difference. If I had to error on the side of being conservative, I may even give the GE oven a bit of an edge with regards to even cooking. I love convection, but that plus the inferno that the PowR burner in there brings can make for very dark in back center vs the other parts of the oven. (please note that I have had the upgraded retrofit).

    I think if I had to do over again, I would have gotten the top and went another direction for oven. BUT, I still enjoy using the 48" platinum range overall.




  • catinthehat
    4 years ago

    Hey haberstarr! Honestly, his review that he provided earlier today is the most positive honest review I've read in all my searching of user feedback for the platinum oven. The few that had glowing reviews of the oven were questionable as to their validity in my humble opinion.

    In response to your question for me earlier today, I did try the oven, although I did a bit more of a scientific experiment to speed things up (great bacon story btw, how could bacon ever come out wrong??). I put a lump of dough in a deep baking sheet at 400 degrees and over the course of 20 minutes observed how it cooked. The results were very comparable to what others have described as the design flaw with an oven that relies on air circulation rather than natural heat dispersion. Top and sides were the same shade of brown, the dough at and below the baking sheet sides were much more undercooked. The air does not flow well in the areas below the recess of the baking sheet. Additionally, the second ball of dough I baked on the bottom rack was not as cooked as the one I placed on the topmost rack, although the difference was not as pronounced as I was expecting. My humble opinion, this is not a baker's oven, but will probably get by for the average user (and it does seem to preheat a bit quicker!). I am not an avid baker myself, but I just couldn't bring myself to splurge extra on a subpar feature.

  • haberstarr
    Original Author
    4 years ago

    Thanks again Steven B! I think I'm convinced to go either RNB range 48 or 48 Platinum rangetop and wall ovens. Problem however, there doesn't seem to be a live RNB Range to cook on anywhere near Atlanta, only Platinum. Additionally, while I'm relatively certain I don't "need" a 25k burner, I'm completely certain that I want one. :-) Frustrating that BS doesn't offer 25k burner upgrade on RNB....VERY frustrating that they have promotional videos on youtube showing Michael Simon cooking on his gorgeous 60 inch RNB range while going on and on about his 25k burner. Either they are being deceitful or they gave him an upgrade they won't give us. Either way it's false advertising. I talked with BS HQ today and they confirmed that there's no way to purchase 25K upgrade on RNB. I wasn't speaking to a decision maker, but still. I'm off to try to find an RNB range to test and/or revisit what wall ovens would go nicely with a 48 Platinum rangetop. I think the Wolf DF 48 is out for us for a couple of reasons......The greatest of which is that after test cooking on both I just don't think I can give up the awesome BS top.

    Thank you very much for the info and good luck with your RNB!! Please update after you've broken it in!

  • haberstarr
    Original Author
    4 years ago
    last modified: 4 years ago

    I really should change the title of this thread as we are no longer considering the Wolf DF 48. (though I would still like to hear feedback from owners of it) It's really down to RNB 48 range, or 48 Platinum Rangetop and wall ovens (likely Thermador, but not a final decision) Some additional thoughts on Bluestar top after test cook on 36 Platinum and Thermador 36:

    1.) Sooooo glad we didn't buy the Thermador 48 which we VERY nearly did last year. The star burners are nice but I discovered that they actually had a wider flame pattern than circular sealed burners of same BTU. As a result, the flame at the star tips would lip around the outside of my 12 inch saute pan at high settings. So while the star burner may provide more even heat than a traditional sealed burner you typically can only benefit from it at lower power settings. To use the star burner at full go you'd need a pan larger than 12". I'm guessing 14" would work but I didn't test myself. This was what turned me off of sealed burners for good. Why would I have a burner I can't use at high power in a normal sized pan. Plus all the heat was at the pan's edge...even on a 12" pan. Even though it was an AllClad Copper Core. I just don't get it.

    2.) I was FLOORED at how low I could simmer on the Bluestar burners. Even the higher octane ones. I used infrared thermometer and Thermapen to see at what temp the burners could hold water at there lowest setting. The simmer burner held water as advertised 125-135F. However, what blew me away was how low the others were. All, including the 25K, could hold liquids well below boiling/simmer....as in no bubbles. the 15K was holding in the 140s, the 18K in the low 150s, the 22K in the high 150s-low160s, and the 25K in the high 160's-low 170s. I was not expecting that all. Especially since when I was using the Thermador I had to get into the Xlow (cycling on and off) to get below an active simmer with bubbling. The Xlow cycling feature would come in handy for keeping things warm at 100 degrees but having to use it to get below 200 or so is not ideal.

    3.) Cleaning - While we didn't test spill anything, I envision the BS cleaning to be actually easier than the raised pedestal Thermador burners. Only potential cleaning advantage I see with the sealed burners is the burner cap keeping things from getting into the gas holes of the gas burners themselves but on the whole I think keeping the cast iron of the BS looking good will be easier than the black porcelain of Wolf or Thermador. Love to hear from people who have cleaned both, but honestly even if BS's open burners were harder to clean, I still couldn't give up the power and even heat of its open burners.

    Looking for an RNB to test cook on but there doesn't seem to be one live anywhere near Atlanta. May have to make a trip to PA. REALLY wish I could get the Platinum styling (not crazy about louvers on RNB kickplate) with 25K burners and the RNB's oven...If that existed my order would have already been placed. If had to guess I bet we end up with 48 RNB Range and learn to live with the louvers on the kickplate and "only" having 22K burners.

    Keep the feedback coming.

    Thanks!

  • M
    4 years ago

    The difference between RNB and Platinum burners is only about 10%. That's nice. And I fully agree with you that I "want" it. But it's not nice enough to determine my purchase decision. If we were talking about 22kBTU vs. 35kBTU, things would be different, of course.

    If you do get a chance to test-drive an RNB, unless you can do a direct A/B comparison with a Platinum, I doubt you'd be able to tell the difference. 10% is barely perceptible.

    Having said that, I think Bluestar's tight policy is a little self-defeating. Take me for example, I have owned a BS RNB for years. I am not likely to give Bluestar any more money in the near future, as things work beautifully; there simply is no need to buy more. But I would happily throw a few hundred dollars their way, if they allowed me to upgrade one or two of my burners -- even if I honestly don't need to have that extra little bit of performance.

    Talking about simmer performance, yes the regular Bluestar burners are amazing once properly adjusted (your installer should make sure they are).

    In fact, since we only have four burners with our 30" RNB, I removed the simmer burner altogether and we instead have two 22kBTU (front) and two 15kBTU (back) burners. This configuration works great for me, and in fact, I always use the front burners as my primary and the back burners to store pots temporarily. That also means, if I need to actively cook at low temperature, more often than not that happens on the 22kBTU burners. The 15kBTU burners see little use, and I suspect a simmer burner would have seen zero use in our household.

    And if I really need to simmer for extended amounts of time, I do it in the oven instead. That works much better anyway.

    As far as cleaning is concerned, I think the open Bluestar burners are very hard to beat. You simply wipe them with a damp cloth to remove major spills, and brush minor spills into the drip tray underneath. You then clean the drip tray every couple of months as needed. If you line them with aluminum foil, it's an easy job.

    If you season the cast-iron grates, when you first get the stove, they'll develop natural patina and they're easy to keep clean. They won't every look "factory new". But everything looks cleaned up after wiping it down lightly. I believe, that's what most Bluestar owners do.

    But if you absolutely insist on it, you can take out the grates out and scrub them. I don't recommend going to that trouble, though. I like the look of the patina. It's a working kitchen not a display kitchen.

    I have occasionally had something drip into the burner openings. No big deal. A tooth pick cleans out the hole and you are back in business.

  • haberstarr
    Original Author
    4 years ago

    Thanks! After our test cook I can totally see not even needing the simmer burner. You're correct, even the 22K, heck even the 25K cooked as low as you'd likely need. I was very surprised by that. I thought I'd be sacrificing low heat performance going with BS. It's actually quite the opposite. If we can get comfortable with RNB oven then I think our decision will be made. I'm sure the RNB oven is great since it's well established "tech", but we've never had gas ovens so I want to test drive to ensure that's indeed the way we want to go. We have room for double wall ovens but would much prefer to make 48 BS range work instead. We shall see.

    Thanks again!

  • haberstarr
    Original Author
    4 years ago

    Also agree that Bluestar's rigidity in model features and resistance to sell various upgrades and options is counter productive. Seems like they could make more money charging for upgrades and options. Oh well. Hoping we can find what works for us within the existing model set. Currently ideal for us would be 48 Platinum Range with RNB's ovens and integrated griddle. (25k burners, without kickplate louvers but with integrated griddle) Since they won't sell us that I'm guessing we end up with 48 RNB range with 12" griddle. Searching for live RNB to test cook in oven. Last piece of the puzzle I think. Thanks to everyone for the info. Hopefully will help others as well.


  • wekick
    4 years ago

    Haberstarr, you did a great job describing your test cook and are moving in a good direction!

    I might add a couple of things about simmering. BS rates their simmer in temperature which I understand is tested much like you did. The temperature can vary a lot depending on cookware, what you are simmering and whether the lid is on.

    If low heat is important to you, look at using simmer with things besides water. I can't think of an instance where I would be simmering plain water except just to test simmering. ;-)) With water, you have very free movement of the fluid. The water heats at the bottom and rises quickly. Even then I have tested on my 350 BTU simmer burner and you will get very different temperatures top to bottom in the pan of water. A big pot has a bigger gradient than a small pot. Some cookware distributes heat much better than others

    I like M, use my oven for simmering things I don't want to babysit and is is especially good for things that might scorch like split pea soup, beans or tomato based sauce. I can't use it for my big stockers though. These kinds of things are thicker so the fluid does not circulate as freely so you are likely have more buildup of heat in the bottom. Starchy or things with sugar are more likely to burn. A real test for low heat is a enameled cast iron or Corning pyroceram pot full of mashed potatoes, covered. The pots are very poor at distributing heat and no movement of the contents. I often have that sitting on my burners when we have family dinners. Also pans of pasta holding. A lesser test but still one thing many cooks do is big stocker full of tomato sauce or stocks going overnight.

    These things may not be relevant to the way you use your burners but show the difference in simmer much more than an open pot with water.

    BS and some of the others are reluctant to give the rating of low end of the burner in BTUs for some reason. It is strange to me. It is like saying the top end is rated at 600F instead of 22K. There is no way to say what the temperature is. Too many variables.


  • haberstarr
    Original Author
    4 years ago

    Excellent points Wekick! If I get a chance to test cook on RNB, though it'll be primarily to test the oven, I'll check low heat performance on the top with lid on and a thicker medium.


    The option to rotate BS grate to increase distance of burner to pan bottom another 1/4-1/2 inch may come in handy as well if you're really trying to get super low. Anecdotally, when placing my hand over the Wolf simmer burner vs the BS simmer burner the Wolf felt hotter. Another surprise for me as I thought the Wolf had the lowest continuous simmer. It may in fact but the Wolf vertical distance from flame to pan appeared to be less than half that of BS. Probably accounts for the hotter hand feel at grate level. Regardless of the reason, (I realize this is highly subjective and non-scientific) I could leave my hand at grate level longer over the BS than the Wolf....which was another surprise for me.

    Thanks again. Hopefully all this is helping others with their decisions as much as it's helping me.

  • haberstarr
    Original Author
    4 years ago

    Hi Steven, RNB installed yet? if so, reviews? Thanks!

  • catinthehat
    4 years ago
    Hi haberstarr!

    The range is safe and sound in my garage at the moment. My kitchen renno is behind so here the RNB will stay until her home is ready =(. I am beyond excited though, range came in absolutely flawless condition. Is there a way to private message on this forum? Would be easier to pass on some additional thoughts to you!
    haberstarr thanked catinthehat
  • ryburns26
    4 years ago

    Excellent choice. You can’t go wrong!!

  • haberstarr
    Original Author
    4 years ago

    Thanks! Looks great! We're in a holding pattern on our kitchen redo as we haven't been wowed by the cabinets we've seen and good contractors in this area are booked solid with the best being booked out for a year or more. :-(


    I'll check on PM options. Thanks again!

  • haberstarr
    Original Author
    4 years ago

    Steven, I've updated my profile to allow PMs. You should be able to click on my profile, then click on "Message" icon in upper right hand corner of page.


    Thanks!

  • opaone
    4 years ago
    last modified: 4 years ago

    Seems like a lot of us have the same issues with BS. I think the problem is that nobody there actually cooks so they don't know what people who do cook really want. They don't really offer a premium product but strangely offer product A (RNB) w/ a good oven, middle of the road griddle, lower BTU burners, and ugly kick plate and product B (Platinum) w/ better burners, nicer kick plate but quite poor oven and griddle.

    - The platinum kick plate without the ugly louvres will fit on the RNB.

    - Another thread on here discussed drilling out a 22k burner to make it a 25k. I seems several people did this successfully.

    - Fairly consistently everyone I've talked with says the RNB oven is better than the Platinum.

    - Griddle on RNB appears to not heat as evenly as the one on our AG Wolf though still much better than the removable burner-top of the Platinum. I hope to know more in a week or two.

    We're planning a 48" w/ 24" griddle, 4 burners, and kick plate from platinum.

  • alishaes
    4 years ago

    Great thread! Anyone have any updates? After a year+ of reading reviews/threads, I purchased a 36" RNB with 12" griddle for our kitchen remodel. My 2nd oven will be a XXL Miele Combi Steam (plumbed). I've never cooked on gas or used a steam oven, so the learning curve will be high. Any tips for either?

  • homechef59
    4 years ago

    If you have never cooked on gas and you just bought a BS, be prepared to have your mind blown in a good way. Unlike conventional electric, gas will provide instant heat control. In order to control the heat you can slide it off the heat and then turn the heat down. You will want to purchase new heavier duty pots and pans as the budget allows. Flimsy pans will soon warp and degrade.

  • M
    4 years ago

    I have had good luck with a combination of Lodge rolled steel skillets (inexpensive), Staub enameled cast iron Dutch ovens (more expensive), Vollrath stock pots (good deal), and rolled steel round bottom wok from my local Asian kitchen store (about $40).

  • alishaes
    4 years ago

    homechef59- It's going to knock my socks off for sure! I cannot wait to wok cook on it! The youtube wok cooking videos sold me on this range.

    M- We had a house fire so I am replacing pans/bakeware but haven't decided on that yet. I had a couple Le Creuset dutch ovens before but I have seen the Staub around. I haven't heard of Vollrath. Did you get your combi steam? People seem to love them but I am a little worried about the learning curve and lack of recipes online. I've found a few websites and the Miele recipes but not much out there.

  • M
    4 years ago

    LeCreuset is very comparable to Staub, and would be another good choice. I prefer Staub, as they cost less and get a few of the details right, whereas LeCreuset wants extra money for that.


    They come with metal knobs, which means I can put my pots into a hot oven without spending much thought on whether the phenolic knob really survives 500°F. They have a black interior, which is easier to clean. And they have more options for pots that facilitate condensing vapors, so that I won't lose as much flavor.

    Vollrath is a brand that targets professional kitchens, although I see that they now also offer consumer-style products. That means, less brand name recognition, but better prices. Qualitywise, it's no frills but generally just as good as most of the other multi ply stainless cookware. In other words, great for a stock pot. I bought mine from a restaurant supply store.

    Rolled carbon steel makes for amazing cookware. Super easy to clean. Non stick. Lasts forever. You can put it into a hot oven. You can use metal utensils in it. The only downside is that you need to take a bit extra care to season it once. And you preferably wash it right after use when it's still hot, and then make sure it's completely dry before you put it away; maybe even rub a thin coat of oil on. Also, the non stick properties only really work, if you make sure it's hot before you add ingredients. But with a powerful gas stove, that only takes about 20-30 seconds at full heat.

    Lodge is a great and inexpensive choice. Or you can splurge and get the Matter Bourgeat. I hear great things about their skillets. America's Test Kitchen really likes them.

    As for the steam oven, I'm annoyingly still waiting. My contractor is having serious scheduling issues and keeps delaying the project. I have worked on many projects with him in the past. But this year is strangely difficult to make progress.

  • alishaes
    4 years ago

    I remember I had to buy stainless knobs for my Le Creuset. Good to know there are other options, I'll definitely look into Staub. Great input on Vollrath and carbon steel too. What are your thoughts on the carbon steel skillets compared to something like All Clad? I hadn't actually considered carbon steel until you brought it up.

    Thanks again!


  • M
    4 years ago
    last modified: 4 years ago

    As long as you treat your carbon steel cookware properly (and that takes minimal effort), it's an amazing tool for anything that needs frying. I use my skillets and my wok all the time. In fact, I use my wok for lots of western dishes, because it handles so nicely and cleans up easily. And because of the thin material and the nice infrared emissivity, there are things that can't really be done in other types of cookware. There is a reason why restaurants like carbon steel pans.

    But there are times when stainless is more appropriate. I have some triply sauce pans and a big stock pot. It's good for things that need to boil or simmer. I don't like stainless for frying or any high heat cooking.

    Sometimes stainless is fully interchangeable with my enameled cast iron pots (both Dutch ovens and some smaller pots), but sometimes stainless feels like a better fit.

    I feel that with the even heat distribution of the Bluestar burners, I can't tell much difference between most triply pots. So, there are plenty of brands to choose from. All-Clad is a recognizable brand. But for most purposes my Vollrath pots work just as well. Although admittedly, in a previous life I've used really low quality steel pots; and yes, that's not a good idea. So, it is possible to go too cheap.

    I guess what I want to say is that you should get a mix of materials and brands. They each have their specific use cases

  • S W
    4 years ago

    Bump. Interested in updates on the OPs experience with RNB and in follow up to original questions.

    I was looking at similar dilemmas (and am in Atlanta, too, as it were). Anyway, I was all sold on the Platinum, and then I started seeing some not so sure opinions (but still, as to the OPs original question, not many opinions from anyone who actually has one!) For us the 48 is only on the table because of a need for two ovens, and a preference for one of them to be smaller. How is the preheat capability on the smaller oven? I would think it wouldn't matter Platinum vs. RNB, correct, as only the 30" has the POWR? Thanks.

  • M
    4 years ago

    48" is a lot of space. If the only reason you're considering 48" is for the dual ovens, then that doesn't really sound convincing to me.

    If you have another reason why you need 48" of cooking surface, then of course, the combination works really well. And yes, I agree with you on having dual ovens that come in different sizes.

    In your situation, I'd get a 30" or 36" range and a separate wall oven. I feel partial towards getting a steam oven, so that you diversify both oven size and heating technology. But you have to decide for yourself whether that's important to you



  • homechef59
    4 years ago

    I have to say that my 48" rangge with two ovens is not my preference. I find the little oven to be too small and the big oven barely big enough. This would be true regardless of the brand. I've had a BS 36" platinum range top combined with a set of Thermador double convection ovens. It was an excellent combination. It had the added advantage that I could replace one of the two if one were to become unsatisfactory in the future. If you have a big range, you are stuck with the one who brought you should something go wrong.

  • S W
    4 years ago

    Yes, thanks, we were looking at a 36 range first (and still are) and possibility of a second wall oven, but we can deal with 48 and have the room for it. But ideal would be a rangetop and a way to find space for two independent electric wall ovens (but not stacked or above the counter height)...I don't even really care what brand or if they match the rangetop, as the rangetop is the priority (for a lot of reasons, we are trying maximize large, open areas of counter space, both for visual openness and usability, so really liking the idea of all ovens/micros, etc., fitting under the counter...just fits our style and needs).

    I was shying away from the 36 range, however, because I'd rather only have a 30 inch oven max for better preheat speed (27 if the 30 can't fit full size like BS), better cooking when not at capacity, etc. The combo on the 48 seems to meet those needs. I just have zero need for a 36 oven and can't foresee one and would rather have two smaller ovens.

  • M
    4 years ago

    Fitting a full size sheet is a "nice to have" feature. Would I feel seriously limited if I didn't have that? Probably not. But now that I have the option, I find I use it somewhat more regularly. Being able to place half sheets side by side instead of on top of each other does make some things much easier.

    As for a 36" instead of 30" cavity, I don't think I'd ever need that much space for the type of cooking/baking that we do. But others might appreciate it, if they regularly cook for very large groups.

    Preheating my 30" RNB does take time (about 20min give or take) and a little bit of planning. It's not a huge handicap, but it certainly convinced me that a second smaller oven would be a useful addition to my set of tools. I find that quite frequently I only need enough space for a single Dutch oven. And my 30" oven cavity is extremely oversized for that application.

    As for fuel source, I notice less of a difference than what others have stated in the past. In fact, I have used both gas and electric at various times, and I honestly don't have a preference, as long as the oven is overall well designed.

    My RNB gas oven is wonderful to work with. I wouldn't want to give it up. But supplementing with an electric wall oven does make sense. There are many times when I could use more than one oven.

  • Anthony C
    4 years ago

    we were considering the wolf df and the bluestar RNB 48". We went with the bluestar. My wife preferred the wolf, I preferred the bluestar. The wolf is beautiful, but just doesnt quite have the performance of the blue star.

  • Home cook
    2 years ago

    I know this is 2 years old - but can anyone tell me how loud the cooling fans are on the RNB 48 range? or the platinum? We just bought at 48” Thermador pro Grand all gas range and the three cooling fans at the rear of the range sound like there is a train in my kitchen / entire first floor of my house. We had a different Bosch Technician come out twice and both said it was normal to keep the electronics from getting damaged. Seriously thinking of exchanging for Blue Star or even paying more for a Wolf DF if the fans are significantly quiete. Given the shelter-in right now can’t go to any live demos so appreciate any feedback form anyone on this thread. Hope all are safe at home!

  • M
    2 years ago
    last modified: 2 years ago

    I only have a 30" RNB, so I can't tell for sure. But I believe there are no cooling fans in Bluestar ranges. Cooling fans are only needed for appliances that have electronics and/or that are dual-fuel. Bluestar doesn't do any of that. It's a very reliable and basic all-gas design.

    Just make sure to buy the open-burner version. The closed burners don't play to the full strength of what Bluestar can do.

    Also, I personally don't really like the Platinum as much. The small bump in BTU is nice (I upgraded my RNB after market), but wouldn't be enough to justify the price difference. The griddle on the RNB is thermostatically controlled, whereas the one on the Platinum isn't (but then, it is removable). And I am still not quite sure I like the oven burner on the Platinum. It presumably helps with much faster preheating times, though. On the other hand, it does involve a fan and that might or might not be a concern in your situation. My RNB takes about 20min minimum to preheat. But afterwards, it's an amazingly even heat that works extremely reliably.

    And of course, the broiler in both models is unrivaled. Really amazing tool. We use it all the time, even if just to make toast or heat up English muffins.

  • Home cook
    2 years ago

    Thank you for that info.

  • Angie
    2 years ago
    last modified: 2 years ago

    We owned a 48” Thermidor for 14 years and regretted it for 12 of those years. We put at least $2,000 into replacement parts over that time. And yes the oven fans were very loud and near the end they would stop working and then my oven would stop working.

    I spent over two years researching ranges and reading hundreds of reviews. Finally we decided on the 48” RNB. We considered the Platinum but I had the same concerns as M concerning the heat coming from the back of the oven only and the constant fan blowing. Convection isn’t always the best for baked goods, bread, cakes, cookies etc. After reading some reviews on the pros and cons, I decided to go with the RNB. I have no regrets.

    The ovens are so quiet that I had to check to see if I turned them on. I was so used to hearing a loud fan that at first I thought something was wrong. Took a little getting used to the quiet.

    I love these ovens! My Christmas cookies all came out perfect; nicely browned outside and moist on the inside. Cheesecake, brownies, bread, and pizza have all baked beautifully. Meats and casseroles bake evenly and on time. My old Thermador has not baked evenly in a very long time and often stopped in the middle of baking. The RNB small oven does a wonderful job. Both ovens heat up quickly. My old small oven was useless. It took nearly an hour to heat up and twice as long to bake. I baked two 9 x 13 dishes at once in my small RNB on Christmas day and they were both finished at the same time. I could never do that in my Thermador. The ovens clean up easily, if you just take a few minutes to wipe up after a spill.

    I did want the higher burners of the Platinum but the oven made the difference. Also I did not need to move the griddle around. I would have like a grill to but we grill outside whenever we want so that isn’t an issue. The rolled steel griddle is like a restaurant and so much nicer than I expected. You can turn it on and leave it while you prep with no concerns. I went to a restaurant store and purchased a cleaning pad like they use in restaurants. Cleanup is easy.

    Something else I love is the removable steel trays underneath the burners and griddle. I just stick them in the dishwasher every couple of weeks and the look like new!

    I would never go back to a Thermador. I hope this helps.

  • alishaes
    2 years ago

    2 years old and still loving my 36" Bluestar RNB! the burners are amazing for wok cooking! No issues with the oven or noise. Love it!

  • Home cook
    2 years ago

    Thank you all so much. We have a bit of dilemma if we want to swap out the new Thermador. There is a 25% restocking fee and we got the hood / DW included free so would need to pay For those (discounted). Being stuck at home during this pandemi (strange even typing that) we are using the oven a lot and the whistle from the cooling fans is hard to deal with. Logistically I‘m not sure I can even trade in right now and before paying money to swap, ideally would like to test drive or see a live demo. Really regret not doing that before buying the Thermador. It was a great deal, look amazing and two weeks in performs good too...but the sound! Our newly remodeled kitchen sounds like an airport or train station when using the ovens :(


    The RNB sounds really great from your commentary.

  • Angie
    2 years ago

    I understand your frustration. Our Thermador had two fans and they were extremely loud. When we were looking at the BlueStar the salesman told us that when you run self clean on a gas oven (which our Thermador was) the heat gets so high that it destroys the electronics. We rarely ran the self cleaning feature but it did destroy the electronics. We replaced more than one mother board. I am assuming they corrected this problem by adding more fans. The noise must be deafening!

    Sounds like you got a great deal. But it is still a large investment and if you are not happy the salesperson should make an effort to rectify the situation. I hope it works out for you. :)

  • M
    2 years ago

    Yep, pyrolytic self-clean is a miraculous process to see -- when it works. But it also is generally ill-advised and I wish consumers stopped asking for it. It puts a huge amount of wear and tear on any appliance. The required temperatures are just not a great idea in such a small device inside of a residential kitchen.

  • tasharijke
    last year

    DO NOT BUY HESTAN 48" dual fuel range Cooling fans run 100% of the time when any oven is turned on. Lights came broken and burned out. 4 service calls in 30 days. No response from Hestan except "you do not need to email us" Fans when running is at 67 DB which is 4 times as loud as a conversation in a home. Time to return to store.