Roses, and Southern California's "Devil Wind" . . .
jerijen
6 years ago
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Sheila z8a Rogue Valley OR
6 years agoK S
6 years agoRelated Discussions
Rethinking Feeding Alfalfa to Roses in Southern California
Comments (13)Hi Jeri, Well there are many variables that could influence our results. Such as what is your soil ph in comparison to mine and is your water more or less acid than mine. I know even in my city the soil varies quite a lot (as the Rancho Santa Ana Botanic Gardens even mentions their differing soils on their website, and the RSABG is fairly close to me). The combination of soil and water differences may produce varying results with plants fed alfalfa. Also the origin of the alfalfa in your tea (where was *it* grown) as well as how strong the tea is. Are there components to your soil that would mitigate the ph raising effects of alfalfa? Just things to ponder. Also the individual roses that we each grow and their tolerances to ph ranges. I'd be curious how Reine des Violettes in particular did for you. Here is my Reine des Violettes (photo taken July 19, 2011), purchased from Greenmantle in February 2011 and planted in the ground right away (note alfalfa pellets on ground in background under other plants): From Reine des Violettes In fact I bought 3 plants at the same time from Greenmantle--Reine des Violettes (not fed alfalfa), Tipsy Imperial Concubine (given a very small amount of alfalfa), Duchesse de Rohan (given a moderate amount of alfalfa). All planted on the same day, adjacent each other, mulched with shredded redwood bark, watered on the same days by hand, same hose. All were growing nicely looked about equally green. Then I fed the alfalfa. One shut down growing and turned the same sickly color as Jenny Duval. That was Duchesse de Rohan. I haven't removed the alfalfa and her color has not improved. Then I have a species rose of which I have three, R. alabukensis. You might know this rose, Kim. I put one (15 gallon size) in the ground using Edna's Best and mulched with the redwood bark. Foliage a lovely dark green. I put one in a 15 gallon pot with only Edna's Best and mulched with the redwood bark. Number 3 I put in a 15 gallon pot in plain garden soil, and mulched with the redwood bark. Then I fed the plant in the ground with alfalfa pellets, the others I fed nothing. Continued watering all 3 plants on the same day, by hand with a hose. Plant in ground quickly became chlorotic. The other 2 not a trace, both still dark green leaves. I removed the alfalfa from around the plant in the ground. It's leaves are back to being dark green. Another experiment was an accidental one with an old butterfly bush. It was way too big, and I needed the space for all the incoming roses this year. So I chopped it way, way back, hacked out some roots. Added roses + bark mulch. No problem. Butterfly bush starts leafing out in multiple locations (hey, it had spread it was so happy!). Added the alfalfa. All new growth DIED. I am not saying alfalfa should never be fed to roses, but for my growing conditions, it is not advisable. It depends on the conditions in your gardens as to how well it may do for your plants. It is also worth considering the why behind the effects. Perhaps some are seeing reduced performance in roses due to this being fed. On the other hand in the right conditions of soil ph and/or water ph, feeding alfalfa may produce spectacular results. For me that would have been great as I have such easy access to it. Melissa...See MoreRose order from palatine for Southern California.
Comments (8)The only caution I would offer is ... what rootstock are these roses on? In the U.S., 'Dr. Huey' is most-common, and it tolerates SoCal soils and water well. In some places, 'Fortuniana' is used -- and it, too, is great in SoCal soils. But at least some Canadian growers use Multiflora rootstock. That rootstock does NOT tolerate alkaline conditions very well. If you live in an area where there are, or have been walnut orchards, and/or Oak Trees, your soil may be in the slightly- acidic range. In some parts of SoCal, though, the soils and water are in the alkaline range. I had recurrent chlorosis problems here, with roses growing on multiflora rootstock. I think that, now, I have only one rose remaining on Multiflora. Thank God. Jeri...See MoreNewbie. Good roses for Coastal Southern California?
Comments (14)WELCOME!!! You've come to the right place to save yourself a whole lot of heartache in the rose dept. I used to think that roses didn't do well for me in L.A. Airport adjacent because I didn't spray for fungus regularly enough. After all, what I bought locally should all do well for me, right??? So, so wrong. I learned here, that I just needed to buy roses that are resistant to fungus (we have a VERY heavy mildew burden here). ***I didn't need to spray*** Who knew??? While I honestly don't like to spray for environmental reasons, if I'm going to be honest, I'm not structured enough to do it on the strict schedule required. Something to think about - once the leaves get mildew, you can't 'fix' them. But guess what? There are lots of choices anyway! And, I'm afraid, it's just another area of one's life where one should be a careful consumer at the local store. Of the modern roses, I think you may learn to appreciate florabundas. Very pretty landscape plants, often in your size range. I'd like to suggest Walking On Sunshine. I got it in spring of last year on Jeri's advice and it has been just amazing. About 3' round in our garden and always in bloom. Lovely saturated yellow, but fading to a still lovely creamy yellow that doesn't look faded. Also a nice scent. Wouldn't be without it now. Armstrong's should have it when they get roses in next year. If you have the room (depending on soil), I'd heartily recommend Golden Celebration as well. I call the blooms 'happy blooms' and I really like the smell as well. Your mileage may vary. Depending on your soil, size may vary. When I was LAX adjacent, it never got more than 4' in sandy loam and half day sun. Three miles inland in amended clay, it wants to be 6' tall (or better when the DH fertilizes the adjacent lawn ;-) It's not great in all parts of the country, but here it really shines, imho (and if Jeri agrees, enough said ;-) Lemme see... Our Julia Child was an experiment and I'd get it again. It is tall as the other poster said. It also fades well, not a common trait among yellows. Reminds me of Julia cutting into her favorite food, butter, new ones are like the outside of a stick of butter and older ones are like the inside. There are lots of others we can explore here. The only other advice I'd say is that roses aren't hard if they're the right roses in the right place. In fact, roses are a great hobby/passion and have wonderful history. Just don't get the ones labeled 'red' or 'white' or 'yellow' ;-) Oh, one other thing to think about. I would bet, if you got America late season, that it didn't have mildew because it was sprayed at the producer. Just a thought....See MoreGrowing Enchantingly Beautiful Roses in HOT Southern California
Comments (8)Thank you so much for starting this post ! :) I'm always keyword searching the rose forums for roses that grow best in hot and dry socal, Arizona, Nevada... :) I'm in the west San Fernando Valley, zone 19, my front garden is all day sun with patches of shade but my back yard is something beyond "full sun". It laughs at full sun. It's slightly elevated, open around a pool, full southern sun all day beating down morning til night with red brick patio/walkways that heat up like an oven, and white stucco walls, it's blindingly bright and hot as hades most of the year. It's 94 out back right now. We've slowly covered the walls in creeping fig and jasmine which has helped cut down the heat a bit. For me, my most blooming roses are Belinda's Dream, Iceberg, Vavoom, Julio Iglesias, Pope John Paul II and Julia Child. In terms of sheer beauty, Belinda's Dream, Pope John Paul, Mutabilis and Grand Dame. The best in both categories: Belinda's Dream, Pope John Paul II and Mutabilis. They seem to love baking in the heat. Belinda's Dream is an amazing rose. It grows and blooms like crazy with little care and handles heat, sun and reduced water, like Iceberg. But it's blooms are more special. The blooms start like a hybrid tea, and end looking like an antique rose (resembling Souvenir de Malmaison). It's a light pink that blends well with both modern and antique roses. It's lovely in every phase. I have 3 bushes, and one tree rose of her. Alas, little to no fragrance. My Pope John Paul II blooms in quick flushes, perfect white blooms, very fragrant. And Mutabilis, blooms like a champ without any supplemental water beyond getting over spray from a sprinkler sometimes and her single petals are everchanging, silky, colorful and beautiful. I even love the stems, thin flexible and reddish burgundy, they really set the blooms off. Regarding your Austins, do you have them in full sun or part sun? I have an big open spot in one of my front garden bed, full sun, that I would love to put a fragrant full bush type in but I'm not sure if an Austin's color would hold up well or fade. Any thoughts? Also if it might need more shade and possibly more water to grow well. Cardin Mill is really lovely and I like the varying color. Have you tried Boscobel or Bishop's Castle? Curious about those too. I've been wanting Jude the Obscure for a long time, but I'm assuming it would look better with a little shade. I really do need an Austin soon. :D...See Moreingrid_vc so. CA zone 9
6 years agolast modified: 6 years agokittymoonbeam
6 years agoCori Ann - H0uzz violated my privacy
6 years agoMelissa Northern Italy zone 8
6 years agoLisa Adams
6 years agojacqueline9CA
6 years agojerijen
6 years agoportlandmysteryrose
6 years agolast modified: 6 years agoUser
6 years agohoovb zone 9 sunset 23
6 years agonikthegreek
6 years agoUser
6 years agosultry_jasmine_nights (Florida-9a-ish)
6 years agoportlandmysteryrose
6 years agosultry_jasmine_nights (Florida-9a-ish)
6 years agolast modified: 6 years agoportlandmysteryrose
6 years agoingrid_vc so. CA zone 9
6 years agosultry_jasmine_nights (Florida-9a-ish)
6 years agoroseseek
6 years agojerijen
6 years ago
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