My regret is buying 3 duchess de Brabant. I put two on either side of my garden gate , a coveted spot where I expected lush results and one in the center of my birdbath bed , also a coveted spot . Mine are about a foot tall , they are pushing out some healthy growth now so they get a pass but the one in the birdbath bed is getting the shovel. It has canker and looks terribly unhealthy. I don't know why they aren't doing well but that's ok , there are other roses to try !

The ones I wish I never bought are not the ones that do badly, since I can just remove them. The ones that drive me crazy are the ones that do well enough to keep, but not well enough to make me happy. They are also the ones that have moments of wild glory, and long periods of ugliness. Those really make me bonkers.

I agree. The ones that are doing fantastic but don't "make my heart sing" are the ones that I regret buying. I can't seem to shovel prune something that's loaded in blooms!

noseometer, I can only say - life is too short! It's not good to be bonkers, and when those roses are gone you'll never think of them again and will be giddy with happiness to have a rose in place that you truly adore. lavenderlace, yours is a more difficult case, because it's not easy to send a rose to heaven that's loaded with blooms. On the other hand, in my case if the color is wrong and detracts from the overall picture I have no compunction of letting it go. Julia Child was one such rose. I did replant it in a place where there were no other roses but it didn't do well there and so is gone. Since I'm a woman "of a certain age" I don't have time to mess around with roses that make me semi- or completely unhappy.

I had E. Veyrat Hermanos and it had all the different shades, but frankly there was something coarse about the blooms that did not appeal. I'll take Reve d'Or over the Hermanos any day.

To be brutally honest, it does my heart good to know that I'm not the only one who has discarded roses, in my case with rather too much abandon. Some I do regret, like Janet, Mme. Joseph Schwartz, Route 66, Wife of Bath, Carding Mill, Mme. Charles and a few others; they should have just been moved to different locations. I'm being much more circumspect now because growing roses from bands is a slow process, and half of Tea Rose Row is now populated with youngsters less than a foot tall. I don't regret the roses I took out there because I had valid reasons (failure to thrive) but it will take some years for them to put on any kind of a show. That first year especially is agonizingly slow. That will teach me to have patience, something I tend to lack in spades.

Ingrid, that's a good point about being "of a certain age"! I have so many that I want to move now that's it's overwhelming to think about. And of course, what I want to replace them with is always sold out.

Taking comfort from this thread though, thanks everybody!

Baron Girod de l'Ain for me. It was a rust bucket from the week I planted it. I believe I kept it until I got my first lackluster flower and sp'ed it. I can appreciate it at the Huntington or in picture, which is enough after trying it myself.

I've narrowly escaped drinking the Baron Girod koolaid countless times. Fortunately, to date, I've managed to snap out of it before placing any orders. Each time I encounter a photo of a pampered, healthy plant covered in those uniquely bicolored blooms, I have to strap myself to the mast before I'm sucked down the Financial Drain of Really Bad Decisions! Carol

I am disappointed with Austins Boscobel and Tranquility. There were hard to get and expensive. But as usual, they were described as realy healthy, best to date... Both BS magnets. Boscobel has beautiful blooms, so lets see what future brings.

soncna, one thing I've heard repeatedly about Austins is that they often improve a lot in disease resistance and beauty of the flowers after four or five years. So hang in there, they may yet surprise you (I hope).

Forgive me, those who love Girod de l'Ain, but I've always thought it looked as though it had been taken over by disease (hence the white parts) while some malignant bug had been industriously chewing away at its edges. HMF has some rather nice pictures where it's purplish (which I love) but I've seen others where it was bright red (the color I hate most in roses) with the aforementioned deficiencies in evidence.

lavender, one thing that's invariably brought me down is that I've found one or two roses I really like from a certain nursery, but it's cheaper to order four or whatever other number, and that particular nursery doesn't have a single rose in stock (although plenty are labeled 'out of stock') that I love so I settle for one that's okay, but not really what I wanted badly. It's so easy for rosarians to get sucked in. Or maybe it's just me.

Oh, been there, done that, Ingrid! Been sucked in by sales too.

Also, the fragrance ratings don't always correspond with my nose in my climate. A lot of the ones marked fragrant have more fragrance to me than the "exceptionally fragrant". I had assumed that if the exceptional ones weren't actually exceptional, then I wouldn't be able to smell the "lesser" ones at all!

Nary a one! I learned something from every one of them, whether they stayed long-term, or not.

I'm mostly with Jeri and Catspa on this one - if I hadn't tried them, I wouldn't have known if I liked them or not. How much worse would it be Ingrid to pine after (say) Girod de l'Ain than to try it and permanently scratch that one off your wish list to go for better roses instead (like your reports of Wild Edric or Potter & Moore). In my zone, I usually don't have to regret planting roses because if they don't do well in my yard they don't survive and at most I have to dig up the rootstock (now Dr. Huey, that I can regret). However, I do rather regret trying Blue Moon six times before I got it to survive in my yard, convinced that a Kordes lavender must be both hardy and robust. Instead, it was not only neither robust nor hardy, but also kind of a "meh" washed out pink when it finally bloomed. It takes up about 6 square inches of space in my bed (not being robust, you understand) so it gets to stay out of default, but I regret not having figured out much earlier not to keep trying.

The only two roses I've ever shovel pruned were hardy survivors that I just found to be ugly flowers and scruffy blooms. One was Harlow Carr that only lasted a year before I couldn't stand the teeny tiny poodle tufts of mum-type blooms on weird Dr. Seuss bushes before it was "potted up" to save garden space (in my yard, that pretty much automatically equates to killing it and it obliged me by dying). The other was Rountuit, that I don't regret planting because I have such respect for Ralph Moore and I wanted to try the rose that I never see anywhere. I gave it 6 years to do anything but put out less than 2 weeks of a few scruffy dime-sized blooms on a thorny monster of a plant, before I actually dug it up and threw it away. Yep, couldn't even give that one to the neighbors in good conscience. I offered to send it to Burling since I know she grows a lot of Moore roses, but she already had her own I think.

I also have the luxury of enough space to grow a lot of roses in the modest sizes they grow in zone 5 and plenty of water most years so I don't have to pick and choose who gets the precious resources. Also, I'm pretty casual about garden color and 'design' not to mention lazy, presuming that if it blooms enough it stays, so I don't reject things based on the careful integration of landscape and plants that Ingrid excels in for her yard. It's far more important for her to make careful choices about her roses for all those reasons, whereas I can rely on survival of the fittest with a couple of exceptions.

Cynthia

Nippstress, Twice in a Blue Moon has been outstanding here in case you're ever in the mood to try another lavender. It's supposed to be way better than Blue Moon.

Nipstress said: " Also, I'm pretty casual about garden color and 'design' not to mention lazy . . . "

THAT is my garden philosophy.

Fortunately, it has resulted in a garden that pleases my DH and myself, even if it's not formal, and totally un-planned. (More in the line of "This HAS to go into the ground, can we find a spot for it?")

I currently grow about 25% of the roses I have planted over the years. I got rid of various roses for many many different reasons, not all having to do with any fault in the rose itself.

And I learned something from every rose I tried. Perhaps I should regret a certain wastefulness, and actually I do; but other than that, I have no regrets.

Rosefolly

I'm being given too much credit for careful planning because I have tall plants in front of little ones, and roses that are too large for their teeny spots. What saves me is that I don't do bright yellow, orange or bright red so that the colors don't hit you in the eye (well, except for the yellow irises that I suddenly have too many of from dividing them). That's about as far as my garden craft goes. If I've fooled anyone here then that's a good thing.

That's artistry, Ingrid. Your restraint is your genius.

I myself am beginning to feel confused about getting rid of roses that don't really float my boat. For one thing, since my soil and general conditions are difficult,the "cost" of raising a rose up to a point of sufficient maturity that permits me to form a reasonably valid opinion of it is pretty high, not in money alone, by any means! Mainly physical work and water! Also, here in Europe we do have rose replacement disease,so you can't just dig out a rose and chuck in a new one in it's place. And digging out a large plant is very, very hard work; I think I really over-did it last fall/winter,and wound up injuring myself. Not to mention that there are just so many other things to be done, in the garden and out of it...

Like lavenderlace,I still have a lot I'd like to move or replace,and it makes me feel over-whelmed. Yet looking back, I remember several times when I went to trouble to move a rose that I thought "just didn't look right"in a particular spot, only to find that the replacement rose has basically the same "look" as it's predecessor, and that I think it's OK. So maybe it'd be best to slow down a bit; obviously my own tastes do change as the years pass.

On the other hand, I don't regret having moved CharlesXII out of it's prominent spot,even though it was very hard work. The plant was huge and vigorous and healthy,but refused to flower well: the blooms were all bull-heads,or deformed in some other way. It was only in it's third season or so,so I did re-plant it ,but it is a relief to not have that thing constantly before my eyes, taunting me! There are two others that are causing some distress: Ceske praci Cest and Georges du Cadoudel.Both are huge plants, and neither has flowered well. If they don't do so this year, I may not be able to resist digging them out. After all, that'd be only two big roses; last fall I dug out 6,and replanted five (and that's just the really big, mature ones)...could be do-able...

I'm with Jeri and Cynthia and whoever else said it. I don't regret a single on. I learned something from all of them- Most Miniatures,some Polyantha's, most own-root Hybrid Tea, and such do not do well in my lazy lo-care garden style, as well as a few of the OGR from certain classes. Because of the winter chill I do get for my Gallicas and Hybrid China's some Teas and China's and such do not do well here and have died. In retrospect my Gallica's and Hybrid Chinas don't care much for our summer heat I don't believe either, I wish it didn't get hot so fast :) Since those are my favorite class I enjoy them how ever much nature dictates. Happy Spring!

SnowFire, long ago I planted this beautiful rose. It bloomed nicely for a while and then reverted back to it's type. Might have been my rose growing ignorance.... I think I didn't protect it enough during our cold NY winter. But it became an ugly, dark, dull red rose.

Every single David Austin hybrid.

All except 'St. Swithun' has died since 2010 when I stopped spraying absurd amounts of fungicide, and 'St. Swithun' is barely hanging on to life. Its shocking how unsuitable the Austin roses are for no-spray culture.

I think I've enjoyed all the roses I've ever planted, but was glad sometimes that some of them didn't stay around a long time.

Years ago, one of the earliest roses I planted was Angel Face. So lovely, but such a disappointment--covered in BS most of the time! Since I didn't know what caused BS back then, I was nearly traumatized!

More recently, I let a perfectly respectable Mayflower (Austin) die one year. It had bloomed faithfully for 4-5 years--but the blooms didn't make my heart sing. Same could be said for Mortimer Sackler (Austin)--except that it simply didn't survive one winter. I don't know why--and didn't really miss it when it was gone.

My climbers--The Pilgrim (Austin) and Dublin Bay--love them both, but they just don't survive winter well here and then limp along all summer. Very disappointing. Climbing Eden was doing well for several years and then also succumbed to winter--but I replaced her. She has healthy growth but hasn't done much yet in terms of blooming. I guess we just have too much warm-cold-warm-cold extremes of temp. here. There goes my climbing roses dream!

I do have a fairly new Clothilde Soupert--not much blooming last year (her first year) but she has lots of buds this year--and it is going to rain for the next week. Now you have me worried that she is going to ball and be a big disappointment. And I was so looking forward to seeing her in full bloom for the first time.

My hybrid musk Jeri Jennings was a big disappointment--love the color of the blooms, but she has serious BS problems at times. Had 3 of them--gave 2 away. Still love her when she first blooms, but then I cuss her out the rest of the summer.

I'm sure there were a few others that disappointed me one way or another, but I can't think of any more right off hand.

What I keep remembering is how good my last few choices have been--Munstead Woods, Love Song, Boule de Niege, Lady of Shalott, Felicia, and Ghislaine de Feligonde. They turned out just as beautiful as I expected and are some of my favorite in the garden--which is good, because I have no space left to plant any more roses, unfortunately.

Kate

Paul, you must live in an unusual climate subset, since I and so many others grow Austins with reasonable success and without any spraying whatsoever. A pity because some are quite nice, although I wouldn't want a whole garden of them.

I like growing a variety of roses also, but I wouldn't be unhappy if the fates decreed that I could only grow Austins. There's enough there to keep me going--and nowadays, more improved BS resistant Austins to choose from.

Kate

For Paul I believe it was the BS susceptibility in the Austins, Ingrid, something neither you or I, in our climates, have as a big concern (plenty of BS in my garden now, though, this year, not to mention rust, but I know fungal issues will disappear with drier weather). Here it was their gangly growth and overall lack of what I think of as "character" or distinction in the flowers -- so many seemed the same and lacking in -- how to say it? -- poignancy or "heartfulness" or singularity, though nice in a pro forma kind of way. I've tried Austins, but none have remained. I think, too, that the history of a rose variety is probably an important part of the deal for me, so the Austins lose out on that point.

It just occurred to me that in 50 or 100 years, the Austins WILL have history and will be weeded out so that just the best, most distinctive varieties remain, as surely the teas and hybrid perpetuals have been --- in their early days there seem to have been many more varieties of those, and many very similar, no doubt.

It's not that I'm sorry to have Shailer's Provence, I'm just sorry I planted it where I did. It is the most rampant suckerer I have. I wish I had planted it away from other roses.

My Dublin Bay has gone downhill too, probably due to several cold winters and a grapevine growing up in it. I think I'll try cutting it back hard.

Clotilde Soupert is one of my very favorites, so much that I have five plants of it in the ground. It's not unusual to lose the first flush to balling...balling is much worse in cool damp weather. It reblooms so well that it is not a big deal to me to lose the first flush. It's just outstanding here in terms of plant shape, disease resistance, rebloom, fragrance, vigor, and beauty. I think the blooms were solid white for a couple of years but after that they pretty consistently had pink centers.

I love Austins. I think they vary quite a bit. I just like a garden with a variety of types of blooms and sizes, and a mixture of types of growth. So I wouldn't want all Austins but I would want a lot of them.

But don't they all have history? It's frustrating with Austin's that they don't often declare the lineage, I think it's so very important, but I see all roses as having history in a way, if you know the breeding...

''Found'' roses are very popular on this forum, yet rarely does anyone seem to know the actual origins of a particular rose, or care too much about that aspect...

It has to be location. Yes, it would be very difficult if not impossible to grow healthy Austins in the east as no-spray. Most of them are bad BS magnets. Some are so bad, even with spraying, they have problems (I'm talking about you Golden Celebration). Still they are lovely and have a lot to offer. If I didn't spray, my rose collection would be a lot smaller, that is for sure.

I think the "history" of a "found" rose is mostly that which it acquires from where it is found, Marlorena -- which is more than a little circular! ;-) "Ferndale Red China" is significant for me because it was found in the cemetery of the little town of Ferndale on the far northern CA coast, where my grandparents once had a dairy farm. Ditto "Hoag House Cream", found in front of the oldest wooden house remaining in Santa Rosa, where I grew up, and "Westside Road Cream Tea". And so on. Plus, some of us hope we will figure out what these unknowns are some day. A lot of old tea varieties also have unrecorded lineages.

Clothilde Soupert may do better in a moister climate. Here, the outer petals dry and there are so many interior ones that just can't push the blossoms open. We also have powdery mildew problems with it - again, we are in a climate where the mild dry springs usually enourage more PM than other areas. I remember first learning YMMV (your mileage may vary) on this forum many years ago - location makes such a difference!

Oh, Clothilde Soupert.....What can I say. I have been in a love/hate relationship with her since we first got together, about two years ago. There have been times when I was so disgusted with her behavior that I almost kicked her to the curb. I think the only thing that saved her may be part of her problem.

I've kept here in a plastic square pot all this time. I think she wants out! The only reason she is still here after all her balling and thick powdery mildew, is because I COULD shove her out of view when she was too ugly to be seen. She will soon be liberated from her cramped quarters, due to recent removal of 3 large Queen Palms and a 50 foot long hedge of Texas Pivet.(Crazy thing was 12 ' high and out of control).

When Clothilde Soupert is good, she is very good. When she is bad, she is just plain rotten, literally!! Right now she is pretty good, other than some powdery mildew. After I take a few pics, I'll cut the open blooms and hose her down with water in the sun. The air is pretty dry here, warm days, cool nights. Here is the lady herself..... Lisa

This last photo shows some mildew-laden buds. Bad girl! Lisa

One more plug for Clothilde Soupert, shown with Leveson Gower, and some annuals.

She really is lovely, and all is forgiven when she looks like this. Lisa

Another rose (CS) I've changed my mind about more than once. The pros and cons are always extreme. I guess she is one you REALLY love or REALLY don't. I just put her back on my want list. With photos like these, what's a girl to do?? I wonder if she'll be as pretty and sweet in my zone 5.

C.S. was a good rose here... although I viewed purchasing it as a risk after reading that it did not fair well in the hot and dry. C.S. was adequate enough to keep its allotted space, I just wished it bloomed more often.

Just chiming in on Austins. I have also found that most are very unhappy as no spray plants, and many have been shoveled out of my beds over the years. There are exceptions in my garden, but I'm guessing that at least 90% of the Austins blackspot horribly in my area. The other 10% either blackspot somewhat but continue to forge ahead, or they mostly don't blackspot at all until very late in the season when I pluck diseased leaves weekly. Carol

I love Clothide Soupert. In my opinion, my best polyantha. Mine blooms constantly and I love the beautiful, delicate blooms. She's a treasure to me. I think she's ok with dry but doesn't like the awful heat ( who does?).

Probably the rose I had the worst luck with was Reine Des Violettes. Hated my climate but I would love to grow it if I could.

"moments of wild glory, and long periods of ugliness" Thank you, Noseometer, for the perfect description of my central Florida rose garden.

I have regretted quite a few but my 'favourite' is The Fairy. I planted a few of them in a spot and that was the rose which taught me that some roses can be very chlorotic in my alkaline calcareous soil.. The fact that many roses can get very mildewy in my garden I knew already.. It is also one of the worst roses to try to prune or tidy up due to its dense nature and zillions of tiny thorns which cling on your gloves... It's a pity because this rose blooms constantly from late spring to late fall in my climate which is 6 months long.

The pictures of Clothilde here are the best I've ever seen of this rose (well, not the one with mildew) and she looks wonderful as a cut flower. I've never been brave enough to get her since I have trouble even with roses that don't have her reputation.

Ingrid, please keep me posted on your Charles Darwin--I almost got him this year but didn't. I wish I had Love Song, but can't get it anymore!

I'm in coastal San Diego and really struggle with powdery mildew on Baronne Henriette Snoy. I haven't tried spraying but maybe I need to before giving up.

Clothilde has a terrible reputation for balling, but amidst all of the winter rains it pumped out a few terrific blooms in December.

I bought a band of CS as an experiment that I would move on from at the first signs of failure, but I have no intention of removing it after seeing and smelling these.

Arbutus, I hope you continue to have good luck with Clothilde, who looks gorgeous in your photo. I hope she never shows you her less attractive habits that so many people struggle with.

delmargarden, I'll continue to evaluate Charles Darwin (I have one in less and one in more sun) and provide upates. I cover the one in more sun with a shade cloth during the hottest parts of the day as I noticed that the branches were turning yellow. I have a feeling this is a rose that does best with afternoon shade.

Delmargarden, Northland Rosarium has Love Song if you're interested in an own root band. Theirs are always a nice size and guaranteed virus free. Northland Rosarium

Oh yes, the lovely frustration of Clothilde Soupert. I find her less frustrating if I simply think of her as a novelty rose with round blooms, sort of like a white balloon flower. Almost nothing else balls in my zone (not the very double Austins, not Belinda's Dream, not Eden), but CS is dependable to ball in her first flush or two. Even in my semi-arid zone in baking hot sun between the sidewalk and street, here's what she looks like most Junes:

Fortunately, later in the year she condescends to open up and bloom more conventionally, though even at the best of time her young blooms have a very round quality.

As for Austins, I'm fortunate that they do quite well for me no-spray, since they are among the hardier roses I grow beyond the once-bloomers and Canadians. That's one of the benefits of being in a dryer zone, as I need to remind myself next August when I'm hauling the hoses around the yard in baking 100 degree heat.

LavenderLace, thanks for the recommendation of Twice in a Blue Moon. That's another lavender that is just surviving in the warmest spot in the yard by the skin of its teeth (what you think roses don't have teeth?? Ahem, they're called thorns). I do get a couple of blooms a year but it's hard to call them lavender. Still, I don't consider this a washed out pink and this one earns its 6 square inches of garden space.

Now you want lavender/purple, Veilchenblau blows them all out of the water in its spring flush. Here is was last year and it has almost doubled in size this year. I'm expecting very nice things from it...

Cynthia

Cynthia, will your Veilchenblau grow up that tree behind it, or will you let it mound as a large shrub? I would love to grow it, but don't have anything for it to climb. I wish my deer fencing was strong enough to support a rambler. If it is suitable to grow without a support, I could grow it as a shrub.

Oh wow, nippstress! That's wonderful that you can grow TiaBM in your zone, great work! For some reason, I absolutely adore this fragrance, even when it's been sitting on the counter for two weeks.

That Veilchenblau is amazing too!

Flowersaremusic, I don't see any reason you couldn't grow Veilchenblau as a freestanding bush, just give it room. I have vague intents of tying it up to the tree just to keep it out of the way of the mower, but I'm mostly too lazy to do so and it has been a free standing shrub for the past 3 years or so. It would probably grow like Darlow's Enigma to be big enough to hide a deer fence without needing to drape itself over the fence like a wimpy diva. The canes are long and loose, so it flops around close to the ground, but I notice it starting to build up some structure in the middle. I suspect it'll always be wider than tall because of that floppiness, but as long as you let it bush out as it likes without trying to prune it back to a tidy shape I think it'd be happy.

Wow, lavenderlace, I'll have to try smelling TiaBM when it blooms this year. I've seen you mention its fragrance elsewhere, and I haven't tried smelling it since I can't detect scents in about 80% of the roses other people can smell. I'll probably have to lie on the ground with my nose poked up into the bloom to try it (even highly scented roses never "waft" in my dry zone), but it's worth the experiment.

Glad you liked the pictures.
Cynthia

Cynthia, you've given me all the encouragement I need. I'm on my way to Northland Rosarium in a few minutes, and if she still has one, it's mine! I've admired that rose for years. Thank you for sharing yours.