Around here the pine bark mix at Home Depot that works is the #302 Golden Trophy bags. I've been using this for the last 4 or 5 years. The only problem is that the #302 bags vary significantly from pallet to pallet. You need to check an open bag and make sure. If the chunks are small then the entire pallet is probably OK. If not the bags in the entire pallet is not usable. I got burned this year in my first buy and had to unload all the bags to someone's in ground garden (after a harsh winter I wasn't thinking straight :-). The bags were wet and the chunks seemed small after a quick inspection but after getting them home they stunk (which I heard was not good) and had a lot of sticks and bigger chunks hidden in them. A week later I went to a different Home Depot and found a pallet of perfect #302 pine bark and loaded up as many bags that will fit into the van. A couple of years ago the good pallet of #302 was behind a bad pallet which required me to climb over the bad pallet to get to the good pallet. The employees at Home Depot must have thought I was nuts. Last year I found #302 Golden Trophy at Menards with the same pallet to pallet differences but this year Menards doesn't seem to carry it.

Am I reading that correctly - you are in Orange County, CA, right? If so and you're using county water then your water quality looks great to me. If I'm looking at the right report (see here) then you have pH ~8 with ~16 ppm of Mg and ~48 ppm of Ca and total alkalinity of ~120 (180 as CaCO3 equiv). Your alkalinity is on the high side but the rest of the report looks great (for plants, I wouldn't drink it). 1 tsp of FP in 1 gallon of water will give you ~6 ppm of Mg and ~25 ppm of Ca. I mention this because your water has a good ratio of Ca:Mg and it already has both in higher levels than you'd get with typical usage of the liquid fertilizer most people around here talk about. To answer your question directly: no. The mixes are not neutral. The gritty mix will be closer to 7 than the 5-1-1 (which will be more acidic) but *it doesn't matter.* The pH of your mix initially has very little to do with the pH levels your mix will maintain over time. In containers the soil pH will be determined mostly by the pH and alkalinity of the water you use and by the type of fertilizer you use and its ratio of ammonium to nitrate (*and* the rate at which the plant is taking up both of those nutrients which can vary depending on temperature, cultivar, etc). You should basically assume that the initial pH of the mix itself is of no consequence when it comes to determining the pH of your soil over the long term. You do need to pay attention to the initial pH but only because if you transplant something into the mix you want the roots to function reasonably well from the get-go. All this means is that you need to raise the pH of the bark or peat slightly so they are more friendly to transplants - the directions for doing that are built into the 5-1-1. I grow citrus trees in both mixes. Either will work for you and there are pluses and minuses to both. In terms of pH and nutrient availability you will find that the 5-1-1 is slightly more forgiving than the gritty mix. At your pH and alkalinity if you grow citrus trees in containers you will almost certainly develop Mn and Zn deficiency even if you use something like FP (which, again: you do not need to do based on your water quality). You could avoid this by acidulating your water or by using foliar applications of Manganase Sulfate and Zinc Sulfate (1.5 g per gallon and 1 g per gallon respectively - they can be mixed and applied to new growth on plants showing deficiencies). Just looking again at your water report you also have adequate/luxury levels of B, S, Cl, Na, & Cu. Nickel will be in your soil via the bark and or peat and you likely don't need to add any. All your water may be missing is: Mo, Zn, Mn, & Fe. Were I you I would use a straight 5-1-3 fertilizer and then manage the micros as needed myself. You will find it much cheaper than the usual suggestion. You could also go with Jack's Professional 25-5-15 High Performance and you wouldn't have to manage your micros as often (you will still get Zn and Mn deficiency at your pH unless you acidulate or use a serious acid reaction fertilizer - but then you will blow your NPK ratios). The cheapest and easiest option would be to use the Jack's (or another 5-1-3 with Mo and Fe) and then use the foliar sprays 1-3 times a year. If you acidulate your water I wouldn't use sulfuric - you have a ton of S in there already. Maybe citric or vinegar (don't use phosphoric, nitric is dangerous). This will be moderately expensive and moderately time consuming even with a chemical injector. Do yourself a favor and avoid the expense of Foliage Pro with your water. You will be correcting micro issues in any case and you have better Ca/Mg/S than the fertilizer can offer you anyway.

Yes you can, and in the short run 5-1-1 in may actually perfom better than the Gritty mix. But it will wear out quicker (break down) than the gritty mix. I tend to think of annuals going in the 5-1-1 mix, and perinnials in gritty mix. If you are going to be up-potting in a couple of years go with what you have. Either are a better choice than most anything you can find in most garden centers. Gritty mix makes future repots a dream, tip the pot over and you have bare roots.. Grading the pine bark is not fun, I hate it! A major concept of the gritty mix is based on particle size, larger particles have less surface area (by volume) and thus less water retention. 1/4 to 1/8 inch seems to be the optimal size, although due the screening process of pine bark and the thin strips I will let most 1/2 and under get in the mix (under 1/8 is not good either). If you are looking for Turface MVP check a local irrigation supply house, the stuff was designed for baseball diamonds so look in that direction. The dust is not good for the mix (particle size) The gran-i-grit is intended for chickens to help them digest grains. There are many other products other than gran-i-grit that will perform just as well. Look to a local farm supply house for the rock. Rock dust is not good for the mix (particle size) Gypsum is available at the big box home improvements stores. Gritty does dry out quicker than potting soil so you do need to water a bit more often. It is extremely difficult to overwater with gritty mix, that includes mother nature overwatering. Root rot is probably the number one killer of potted plants. After water, air is the most important thing you can give roots (most plants), more important than fertilizer. Gritty mix excels at this without drying out the root system. Gritty mix is heavy stuff, an advantage of heavy is the pot is less likely to tip from heavy winds. Al is a smart guy, it is such a simple concept.

Hey Rina. Thanks so much. I am in Boston, so the Agway i go to is basically in the suburbs. The demand for chicken growing products is certainly lower around here, probably leading to higher cost. However, the weight issues is really the bigger problem. If you find a thread that i haven't seen, by all means forward. Always love to nerd out on my favorite nerd topic of soil science!!! Laura, there are a few (many) posts that Al has put together that sums things up in a very succinct way. This one is more basic. While this one speaks directly to soil and water retention. The latter has some great links at the bottom as well. There is one last one on growing trees in containers i can't put my finger on right now, but i am sure you will find it. I think that is about a books worth of knowledge!