I don't take any action if there are a few pests here and there. If they cross the limit and are every where, only then I spray a bit of tobacco water on the effected roses. I don't want to overdo even the organic sprays. This time when the whole bush of deep secret and shiela's perfume were covered with aphids that were quickly transferring to neighboring roses too, I sprayed with tobacco water. I have found tobacco water to be very effective against most pests.

During this spring, I didn't have to spray much because I had given a heavy Ca diet to my roses through wood ash as well as manure that contained lot of egg shells. It made the leaves and branches hard (reduction in tissue distance) and most of my roses weren't attractive to pests anymore. However, many of my roses lost good amount of fragrance and the shades were paler. Perhaps extra Ca??? Straw will be able to comment better but that was a good learning for me. BALANCE is the key. Excess of everything is bad.

Generally speaking, my HTs and Floribundas are more attractive to pests and fungus as compared to OGR and Austin roses but this is a general observation. I will mention my specific observation with regards to various cultivars from these categories.

Anyone else facing issues with pests..... zone 9 and zone 8??

best regards

Straw: I didn't have any aphids in spring when I increased K and Ca and reduced N. However, it had it's own effects on the rose.... faded shades, low fragrance, crinkled leaves in monsoon etc. After the monsoon, my bushes were exhausted with lot of symptoms of nitrogen deficiency. I gave them nitrogen, there is lush growth but as you said, tissues are soft and attract pests like aphids.

So.... it has to be a middle way. But what is that middle way? What is the gauge?

best regards

Your honest feedback above is very valuable. Thank you !! I'm leaning toward magnesium as the key to toughen tissue and prevent insects invasion. Magnesium is what makes clay so tough and hard, thus magnesium also makes rose's tissue tough and hard.

Pea-gravel is high in magnesium, that took care for aphids on my Evelyn IMMEDIATELY. Pea-gravel also made dull-leaves Carefree Celebration rose thicker & glossy .. I actually improved the look of that rose when I returned to the store .. I watered with cloudy-pea-gravel water. Husband said, "why do you want to return it, It's so healthy!"

One plant site stated that magnesium is to provide the gloss on leaves. True, glossy & thick leaves really shine in my alkaline clay. Those roses tend to have thick & chunky root that can push through hard clay better.

In the thread I did on soil, one research stated that magnesium is needed for phosphorus to work. Phosphorus is vital for fragrance, and it shifts color to deeper red. What looked like phosphorus deficiency (faded blooms & less scent) turned out to be magnesium-deficiency.

Take 2 local rose parks: Cantigny park, 15 min. from me, with alkaline clay, their roses smell much stronger than mine. Their magnesium-rich soil, along with their high-phosphorus fertilizer made their scents amazing !! In contrast, Chicago Botanical Garden, with alkaline loamy soil (less magnesium), zero scents on many roses, and blooms are washed-out & so faded !!

Magnesium is what holds phosphorus, nitrogen and trace elements, without sticky-magnesium, nutrients are leached out. Years ago when I used to post in Rose forum, I stated that my alkaline clay is rich in nitrogen, no need to use chemical fertilizer. Warm climate & clay folks in California agreed with me on no-nitrogen, but sandy-soil folks in Florida strongly disagreed.

Nitrogen mobility is a 10, it leaches out easily from loamy/sandy soil, unless there's something sticky like magnesium to retain.

Magnesium is rich in heavy & hard clay, or humus like well-rotted manure, black peat (from decayed wetlands). Dense & sticky organic matters are also high in magnesium: beans, corn, oatmeal, decayed greens (kale, spinach, grass clippings).

Straw: Good point on Mg. A spinach shake will be good for a quick Mg doze, isn't it?

BTW, tobacco water is very effective against aphids...

Above is an Internet poster of magnesium-rich foods, with 2 types: acidic vs. alkaline. The seeds are alkaline sources of magnesium, including sunflower (not pictured).

The greens are ACIDIC sources of magnesium, best with alkaline tap, like my soaking mint-leaves for 2 days to neutralize my high-calcium tap-water (pH 9), or your spinach-ground-to-bits, or alfalfa meal (pH 5.8).

In acidic rain, alkaline sources of magnesium are best: pea-gravel, hard-clay, hard-seeds. Below is an internet pic. of pea-gravel, with pH over 10, that made my clay even harder, also improved Carefree Celebration's leaves from dull to shiny & glossy (in loamy pot).

That is a great magnesium chart, Straw.

I've been taking the powered magnesium for myself because it's hard to get enough without too many calories. I know several people who swear that their arrhythmia is much better with a daily dose of cacao and I'm pretty sure that it's the magnesium, among other good things not available in a synthetic pill.

Khalid, my husband used to grow tomatoes and complained about the aphids. We already ordered "fly predators" so added beneficial nematodes (enemy of aphids, thrips, etc.) to the order.

We've been applying them spring and fall since them and I've never seen those particular pests on the roses yet (or the tomatoes since). But since my roses are new, I wonder if they just haven't figured out to come here and next year might be another story. I hope not!

What I have never seen is the cucumber beetle until I brought the roses in. It looks so benign but yet is so destructive. They are on all of my roses now unfortunately.

http://forums.gardenweb.com/discussions/4285259/spotted-cucumber-beetles-on-memorial-day-roses?n=21

I'm trying lacewings next year to try to fight them along with beneficial nematodes and Straw's mineral advice. I'll report in next year on that!

There was a local news story on the invasion of the Asian beetles and warning that they look very similar to ladybugs. But since they aren't plant eaters, hopefully they can be of some natural assistance. People hate them because they gravitate towards their houses and often make their way in.

As far as diseases, I thought that my dry climate would really help me but as it turns out, some roses are just more difficult than others I think regarding BS.

So far, humidity makes Heirloom break out in blackspot for me here, though Straw in her area has figured him out. She must be more of a patient person than me, LOL! Right now, I only have two, and one has spots and one doesn't after both of them previously defoliating. No blooms!

Jude the Obscure does the same thing for me in humidity as treated the same as all my others. Straw has also figured him out but it was too late for me this year. He doesn't defoliate for me though and keeps blooming and the scent makes him forgivable.

Interestingly, I have 9 JTO in full shade since they have been here and they've stayed totally clean, go figure. Surely the shade can't be helping them? Maybe they are less stressed because they haven't bloomed yet?

That's interesting about aphids on tomatoes, I never see aphids on my tomato in my 16 years gardening in hard alkaline clay. But I saw tomato-horn-worm (big & fat & green) when my kid dumped chemical fertilizer NPK 10-10-10 one year. Other 10+ years without chemical fertilizer, zero horn worms.

Great point you made, Lavenderlace, about Austin does better in shade. I see a big decline in health in Jude when I gave it alkaline-tap-water, which zaps out potassium. Jude actually liked the Brewer's Yeast (acidic with potassium). It doubled in size with acidic gypsum & sulfate of potash & alfalfa pellets.

Jude is a cluster-root, that can take acid better than tap-root like Dr.Huey. Cluster-root dries out easily, thus partial shade is best. Multiflora is a cluster-root, and that prefers cool & wet climate with acidic rain.

Jude's root is so thin & wimpy that it can't take prolonged wetness. I really should had fixed Jude's soil with DRY pine-bark for better drainage.

In rooting roses, I notice that soft & thin cuttings need a drier & fluffy medium to root. Soft-cuttings rot easily when soaked in rain. But hard-wood & thicker cuttings, like late fall, needs a wetter & denser medium to root. In rooting indoor through winter, dry perlite & soil medium didn't work, but the dense & wet sand & peat worked well with hard-wood & thick cuttings.

Blooming takes lots of calcium & potassium & trace-elements, thus there's a depletion afterwards. Roses which bloom a lot, tend to be diseased afterwards due to depletion of minerals. Spring flush is always clean, but latter flushes don't have perfect foliage, due to nutrients used up.

I saw those horrible big worms too on his tomatoes. Hubby took great joy in bagging them up and throwing them away, LOL! I hope that they don't come back to eat my roses!

Thanks for pointing out that JTO can't take prolonged wetness. I took it for granted that he could so will be more careful in the future. I have drip hoses everywhere and it's been tricky to keep everybody happy on the same line so I spot water also.

Below is what I wonder is happening with my shade non-blooming (planted fall) JTO versus the full sun ones that have been blooming all summer?

Straw wrote : "Blooming takes lots of calcium & potassium & trace-elements, thus there's a depletion afterwards. Roses which bloom a lot, tend to be diseased afterwards due to depletion of minerals. Spring flush is always clean, but latter flushes don't have perfect foliage, due to nutrients used up."

Khalid, I just saw my first aphids now in February, ughh.. I'm going to call Arbico and see how soon I can use the beneficial nematodes and lacewings. This is earlier than expected but I do have green leaves and new buds.

My first instinct is that I want every single one of them gone INSTANTLY! But I heard a compelling opinion that it's important to have some so that their natural predators will stay and not leave for a more abundant food source.

I love the idea of nature working in harmony as long as there's only a few, LOL!

lavenderlace wrote: "My first instinct is that I want every single one of them gone INSTANTLY! But I heard a compelling opinion that it's important to have some so that their natural predators will stay and not leave for a more abundant food source."

Lavenderlace: I think aphids are also a part of nature and unless there are too many of them, there is no serious problem. This year since start of Feb I can see a few odd aphids on many of my rose bushes every day but unlike last year when I would jump to take some action, this year I didn't take any action for few days. Actually I spotted aphids on more than 30 bushes but left them at their own and after a few days, only three roses bushes had too many aphids while remaining bushes were well under control and had only a few aphids on them. So I treated the three bushes that had too many aphids with tobacco water, leaving the rest at their own.

Last year I used gypsum consistently which made the leaves and shoots hard, making them unattractive for the aphids and other sap sucking insects. So there were hardly any aphids or thrips or spider mite on my roses last year. However, excess of Ca affected the fragrance and shade. Fragrance remained on lower side and shades were lighter as compared to previous years. This was a good lesson for me which made me think that if I allow aphids to stay..... how much damage will they cause to my roses? Will they destroy my roses? So, aphids are there this year but I am living with them. I have used gypsum this year too but in much less quantity. I am hoping to see much brighter shades and stronger fragrance this year though there will be aphids and thrips too. It will be interesting to see how things settle down naturally....

best regards

This is the same line of thinking that I'm following this year, letting nature battle it out!

BTW, after our unusual below 0F windchills in January, Ebb Tide, Midnight Blue, and Savannah already have buds/blooms so they seem to be good in both the heat and the cold.

Most of my pots have buds too but they were protected from extreme cold.

Some of my roses have buds too but almost all of them are in pots. Roses in ground are much smaller primarily because they were pruned late.

I'm hoping to keep mine smaller if possible but with a lot of blooms! Most varieties in my climate have already outgrown their estimated height predictions though.

This morning I woke up to six inch tall sprouts all around my plants. We just had a rain and the mushrooms look so ugly! But I wonder if they will make a good "living mulch" if I can stand to look at them?

Not sure about a living mulch lavenderlace but they will definitely make a good in due course of time. BTW, does it also not indicate that your soil has low pH level?

And yes I agree, in warm climates most roses outgrow the breeder supplied dimensions. Most of the DA roses behave like climbers in my climate in Islamabad.

best regards

The mushrooms look like grass and turned brown so they don't look as bad now. I've heard from people that despise them that they will grow in both acidic or alkaline soil though!

I'm hoping they are here because of the recent rain and all of my organic matter in the soil so it's a good sign!

Yes, I would also take growing of mushrooms as a good sign.

best regards

I just bought a bunch of roses that even people who use pesticides say are blackspot magnets:

Chrysler Imperial

Angel Face

Double Delight

Heirloom (more, why won't I learn?)

And some other reds that I was very curious about the scent! Red with clash terribly with my brick but I will hide them in pots somewhere to see if they are worth it.

I'm pretty sure that I'm going to be complaining about diseases with these but maybe somebody has had some success stories that they can share?

lavenderlace: Double Delight likes is alkaline and if you keep the soil pH over 7, chances of black spot are less. I have two DD bushes in the pot (both on own roots) and though they have other issues like low growth but I have rarely faced black spot problem over the years.

Not much experience in growing Angel Face, Chrysler Imperial and Heirloom.

best regards

Your DD blooms were beautiful though so that inspired me to see if I could manage her!

BTW, the aphids seemed to be disappearing.

Surprisingly there are no lady birds in my garden yet this year and aphids are having a good time. I wonder what is the reason.... may be someone sprayed extensively in the neighbourhood but that is not very likely..

Spoke too soon on the aphids as they have reappeared in different colors! I will have Green Lacewings arriving this week so we'll see if they are up to the task. Large numbers of aphids on the buds make my skin crawl!

Ladybugs won't work in our area because they don't like temps over 90 so they say Green Lacewings are the answer.

My dog chases the birds but I'm thinking of putting in a fountain as a birdbath to see if I can entice them to ignore her. Does your dog show any interest in the lady birds?

OK.... saw a few lady birds yesterday. I am so happy to see them but I need more of them.

Dog showing interest in lady birds? No. My dog is very interested in larger birds and makes sure that no bird lands in the lawn, despite me spreading the grains regularly in the lawn for them. However, I haven't noticed him showing any interest in ladybirds. Actually there haven't been any lady birds so far.

best regards

We were happy when our big puppy would eat every grasshopper that she could find. The downside is that now I have a 125 pound dog leaping in the air and landing on the bushes to keep the grasshoppers off of them!

She's doing way less damage than these huge grasshoppers would do though as we've had years here where they would strip everything.

The birds are still interesting to her but hoping that she'll grow out of that. Of course the cats are still merciless to birds so I'm afraid that my ecosystem is out of balance here!

As advised by vaporvac, I used diluted milk on my bushes that are suffering from mildew. I am not sure for how many days should I spray them with milk? Any guidance on that?

Photos of few effected bushes after they were sprayed with milk

Made a huge bouquet of Lemon Spice this morning and found a lot of ants in one of the blooms.

VV, was that you that had ants eating your First Crush? What did you do? The ants might eat my new green lacewing eggs also and I need them for the aphids!

Khalid, yours is a timely post for me! I haven't seen mildew at all and this morning I see what appears to be mildew on the new plants that I bought from Home Depot. They are my first grafted ones and were so inexpensive that I couldn't resist.

I'm also wondering if it could be some sort of fungicide oozing out of the leaves? I questioned one of the nurseries about that when some arrived looking that way last fall and they said that it was fungicide, which I wasn't thrilled about. I've had these for two weeks though and it just appeared.

Might try some milk on them also! When I did it last year, I sprayed every few days but not sure what the proper protocol is.

It's worth noting that the "mildew" is only on the grafted plants, nothing else. Are grafted plants more prone than own root?

God bless you Vaporvac; mildew on most of my roses is gone after spraying diluted milk three times. It is quite effective and really kills the spores.

Diluted milk is very effective. Look how the leaves that were covered with fungus are now looking so fresh. The fungus is dead and has become sort of a hard film that can be removed by hand or by a water spray, revealing fresh green leaves from beneath.

Wonderful recipe. Thanks again, Vaporvac.

Great news Khalid! I wonder if that's why I didn't see any mildew last year? Going to try in on these new grafted roses that came with mildew.

Anybody seeing any ants in their beds? If so, what are you doing? I don't see them very often but when I do, they can completely destroy a bloom.

lavenderlace: There are ants in some of my beds but I haven't seen them destroying the blooms. Actually the specie of ants that I have stay in the ground but I haven't seen them causing much harm to my roses. Yes, they do come to protect the aphids from predators and that is when I don't like them.