Can we see the plan how it relates to the rest of the floor?

The sink and DW could be switched. You'd be prepping over the DW, but at least you'd have a nice prep space between the sink and range. Have you considered a counter-depth fridge, or recessing the fridge into the bottom wall?

Recessing the fridge is a possibility. Currently, the range is on the same wall as the fridge which isnt ideal so we are building a wall so the range can be in this placement. It does close in the kitchen more though. I will try to post some better visuals.

This is current layout for reference.

Yes, to removing the soffits. Cabs will be to the ceiling. I like the look of those windows but I think it might be a bad idea with a stairwell on the other side.

How about making it an L shape and move stove down a bit. That way at least you have room for 2 people working in the kitchen. One between sink and stove and the other on the left side of the sink. It seems like you would have room for a small island too, but I would make it so it wouldn't be a permanent one. Ie it can be moved. Doesn't necessarily need to be on wheels for that. Or no island and you have plenty of space to move around too.

Dishes would go to the left of the sink so close to the dining easy in and out of the kitchen to get to things. Less colliding among multiple people.

I really love having some stool seating but I will chew on that. Thanks for the fresh idea!

I like the look of those windows but I think it might be a bad idea with a stairwell on the other side.

Yes, I would have a short backsplash, to keep anything from rolling off the counter. Is it currently open to stairs behind the base cabinets, or am I misinterpreting the pics?

I really like the mobile cart idea that lyfia posted. The cart could be pushed back to where the peninsula is now, for serving, or just to get it out of the middle of the kitchen.

I really like Lyfia's idea but would also like to see how your kitchen relates to the rest of the floor space around. Meaning your dining and living areas. Especially since you mentioned you're closing in a wall. There might be another way to create the kitchen

Yes, it is open to the stairs beyond those bade cabinets. I don't know how they lived with that. Obviously those stairs are fixed, so I need to work around that. On the other side of the dishwasher peninsula is the dining room.

What is the length of your dining room. Peninsula edge to large windows. Can the kitchen be pushed far enough down into the dining room to have your dishwasher next to the sink. Are you okay with the dishwasher perpendicular to the sink?

Here is an update to my initial layout. Still thinking over some of your suggestions.

Here is an idea for putting the dishwasher directly beside the sink. But what about those drawers/cabs in the peninsula when the dishwasher is open

I'm curious about the 1st layout. Is there a landing next to the stairs behind the stove. If so, how wide is it. Are those 12 inch deep cabinets in that space? How would you access the cabs?

Again, can we PLEASE see the full floor plan? Meaning how the kitchen relates to the dining room, family room, mudroom or whatever other public rooms are nearby?

Right now I have my DW catty corner to my sink and I hate it. Every time I want to load something into the DW, it means turning around to load, which means water splashing.

Okay, I will try to come up with the layout

The Layout Help FAQ might help.

How do I ask for Layout Help and what information should I include?

• http://ths.gardenweb.com/discussions/2767033/how-do-i-ask-for-layout-help-and-what-information

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In the corner where you have the circle, you'd need 2-3" of filler on each side of the corner, to allow the DW door and drawers to open past each other and the handles. A base cabinet could be turned 90 degrees to open facing the dining area, so that the space in the corner wouldn't be lost. I think you might need a pony wall for support, if you use shallow cabinets, but someone else might be able to comment on that, or check with your contractor. With the shallow cabinet, pony wall, and filler, you might be able to use a standard 24" base cabinet in the corner.

With the DW in the corner, you will need more than 2 or 3 inches - I would go with 4 to 6 inches to be sure everything clears the DW door and handle.

See this thread for an explanation of filler needed: http://ths.gardenweb.com/discussions/4306236/m=3/kitchen-design-and-layout-considerations

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How does your layout apply to this full-house layout I found on your March 15, 2016, thread? The stair location doesn't seem to match up! Have you moved the stairs?

Here they are oriented the same way:

Staring at it some more, and I'm still confused...maybe I need caffeine!

I must have the orientations wrong...

Buehl, sorry for the confusion! That is my personal home, which is still in the works! Hoping to do that in the spring. I really wanted to do that in the fall but we needed new heating and cooling, new siding, and we need to save up a bit more. This current home is one my husband and I are renovating for sale. Every winter we renovate a home to stay employed :). To add to the confusion, my username was frmrsdghtr until a couple of months ago when I put the houzz app on my phone. Gardenweb has helped me give fantastic facelifts to several kitchens in the last few years. I met with a kd yesterday who gave me the top layout, but I always spend a bunch of time on the Ikea planner feeling things out. This one has been a huge challenge to me!

How about this?

You'll have 40" or so inches to the left of the sink and about 45" between sink and range corner.

I reduced the cab size to the right of the range from 24" to 20". Your aisle here is quite tight. As it is, it will be difficult to get a full size fridge through here. They'll likely need to remove the fridge door if they choose to move it in from this side of the kitchen.

What's behind the fridge wall? If you can recess it more than 3", that would help your clearances even more.

Can you remove some or all of the wall between fridge and dining room? A 30" side cab is a decent size but even so, that section will be on the dark side so it would be nice to open it to the side.

Just saw your note about using the Ikea planner. Are you using Ikea cabs? That would change things since they don't offer a corner sink cab other than one that only accepts a butterfly sink (horrible sink design). I have seen hacks to make a corner sink cab from Ikea cabs.

We are likely doing Ikea cabs. Maybe doors elsewhere. We priced Kraftmaid and it's just out of budget. Besides my husband is getting good at Ikeas hacks :). lisa_a if the cabinet to the right of range doesn't come to the end of that stairway wall, will that still look okay?

DON'T use a butterfly corner sink. It's what we have in our rental now, and as bad as it is to turn to use the DW, that sink is the bane of my existence right now. NOTHING fits in it. LOL.

Since it's for a flip, if you can do a corner cabinet sink hack with a real sink, I like Lisa's version.

Hi frmrsdghtr! I remember you.

Ikea makes an 18" cab so you're only losing 2" so I think it will look fine. And those extra 2" will help with aisle clearance in that area. Oh, wait, never mind. I forgot that Ikea's corner Susan cab requires 38" of wall not 36" so the end point and aisle width stays the same.

btw, Ikea's pantry cabs are 15" deep, not 18" deep as your plan shows. I thought they had 24" widths in that depth but all I can find on their website are 15" wide, 15" deep pantry cabs.

Here's the plan spec'd with Ikea cabs.

Glad your DH is up to an Ikea hack challenge!

(thanks, cpartist!)

I agree...use Lisa_A's latest layout. Since you flip routinely, I assume you have the skillset to hack an IKEA cabinet.

I was worried about workspace for 7 people! Good to know it's not your personal home!

I would not void out the corner - you don't gain anything. The layout is not very good and you lose cabinet space. By putting in a corner sink, you combine the two least functional spaces into one (sink bases and corners) and have a nice prep space b/w the sink and range.

With the voided corner layout, there's not enough space b/w the range and sink and trying to prep to the left of the sink puts you too far from the range and involves major zone-crossing.

Glad to hear that new_beg, thanks Lisa and Buehl. I have to say I have never considered a corner sink. I really dislike the look - but i will think on it!

I really dislike the look - but i will think on it!

Oh I do too but remember this is to get the most functional kitchen for you to sell. Not for you to live in. And many folks do like corner sinks. Just not me. LOL.

The other solution is to do an L shape kitchen and build in storage between the wall studs on the left side, like this:

DC Design House · More Info

100 Square Foot Kitchen Remodel · More Info

Thanks cpartist!

Last question - hopefully :).

This is the visual of my 15" depth pantries next to my fridge. I'm hoping to recess the fridge a little but this is still a lot of visible cover panel. Does this look okay in your opinion. I chose short depth cabinets to maximize the aisle space here.

If it is a flip then definitely do the L-shape with an island since people are so in love with islands in general. Also the L shape will look more open and spacious than a U-shape. As buyer I'd hate the u-shape and corner sink. I'd want a kitchen for more than one person to use at the time. The U makes that tight.

Can you build pull outs and a cabinet in the empty space next to the stairs that open to the hallway?

I don't think there is room for an island with seating--only a mobile
cart, at most 30" x 48" (red outline). In an L, with a cart, a helper
would have to stand on the fridge side of the cart, because the aisle in front
of the DW would be only 36"--not wide enough for two people. If you
want seating, I think the original plan is better, with the DW moved to
the end of the peninsula, so that there is space to stand between the DW
and the perpendicular counter. The peninsula isn't that far from the
range--one can prep on the peninsula, then turn and take step, or two, to the range.

This is a small kitchen, so I think some compromises have to be made. While I'm not necessarily a fan of corner main sinks, there are times when they are necessary to provide a functional space. I do have a corner prep sink in my kitchen - which I really like for several reasons, but it's not the main sink...and I'm the one who uses it the most. (I get priority!) Yes. others use it, but not when I am!

I would much rather have the corner sink with workspace on the "top" wall b/w the range and sink than having virtually no space b/w the sink and range with the DW far away from the sink (relatively speaking).

CPArtist's "L" might work, but I'd move the DW to the very end of the run and then move the sink over next to it so prep space is maximized.

It looks like there's no wall b/w the Dining Room and Kitchen. I think moving the DW down as far as possible would work. If that's going to be a peninsula with seating, then I would rather have the sink in the corner than fully on the peninsula.

Just some thoughts for now.

Good luck!

I'm going to be away from the the Forum for 1.5 weeks - I suspect this thread will be "done" when I get back, so I wanted to wish you luck now! :-)

CPArtist's "L" might work, but I'd move the DW to the very end of the run and then move the sink over next to it so prep space is maximized.

Agreed.

We had a corner sink for 21 yrs and we didn't mind it one bit. The only reason we didn't keep it is that if we had, we wouldn't have had more than 27" between sink and cook top (we moved cook top from island to perimeter). Moving the sink next to the corner gave us 42" of counter for prep - much better!

I'd rather turn from a corner sink to a DW at a 45 degree angle than from a sink to a DW at a 90 degree angle. That's more twisting than I want to do and more than people with back problems should do per my chiro and my physical therapist. Sometimes that kind of situation can't be avoided. And sometimes it works quite well; holligater's kitchen comes to mind but her situation doesn't translate to this kitchen.

As MG pointed out, there isn't room for an island. Well, there is but it would be quite narrow, by my calculation only 18" wide at most in order to have at least 36" aisles between it and sink wall and between it and the fridge door. That's not very useful plus it wouldn't be wide enough for 1 seat at the counter at the end. Not sure an island that size without counter seating would be a selling point.

This GW thread has good info about corner sinks.