How often are those guest rooms going to be used?

How far are you family from you? How often will they all be gathering at your house at the same time?

What will work for you over the long term?

We had similar considerations.

We are building the house for us and how we live and not for the occasional guests. So what we tried to do is arrange for all spaces to be used almost daily, if not daily. We didn't want any of the spaces only working several days or weeks a year.

What we decided is we absolutely wanted a large living/kitchen/dining space for entertaining. And we wanted it opening to the lanai/pool area as we're in FL. And of course a master suite. We felt that 2 1/2 bathrooms are more than enough for us the majority of time.

We have a guest bedroom upstairs, which will also have a window seat that can double as a child's bed. This bedroom will have a queen murphy bed and when not being used by guests, will have my stationary bicycle.

Both of us needed separate office space. DH's is downstairs and will be large enough for a desk, small couch and tv. My studio is larger (I'm an artist), upstairs and has a queen sofa bed that can be used for overflow guests. My feeling is if we have guests in both my office and in the guest bedroom, I won't be using the studio during that time.

If we ever have grandchildren, DH's office can be turned into a third sleeping area for children.

And if we ever have the whole gang over at once, we have hotels walking distance to our house. :)

Disregarding furniture, what is the difference between a bedroom and an office?

Aside from needing a small closet to meet the technical definition of a bedroom...

Essentially you are saying you need 5 rooms in both scenarios. It doesn't sound like you'd like to have an office that doubles as a bedroom when that extra company arrives.

Sometimes I think we all get too worried about what a space is called.

Also, a bedroom in the basement will require other considerations for egress unless it is walk out type. FYI.

Beth - I thought you were moving to be near family - are you still going to need the 2 guest rooms on a regular basis? Will they be long term stays, weekend stays, or slumber parties with grandkids? Either way, I would heavily consider designing at least one of the rooms to serve a dual purpose.

We are moving to be near family--but that won't include at least two of our kids (who are in 3 different states and we can't be near all of them--and even the one who might move to the Chicago area might not stay there if she does).

We have lots of friends who stay with us--sometimes for a few days, sometimes for a week or more. A couple of times a year we have 20 or so people stay with us, but then we have to use the floor and couches--we don't try to have enough beds for that. Having 2 guest rooms in use at a time probably happens 2-3 nights per month.

The differences I see between a bedroom and an office:

1. Bedroom has to have a closet
2. Bedroom needs convenient access to a full bathroom
3. Bedrooms open on to private space; offices can open on to more public spaces in the house
4. Bedrooms generally have a "normal" door--offices often have French doors (with or without windows)

The primary reason I care is that someday we will want to sell (or our kids will) have we don't want to have a 2 bedroom house when that time comes.

I know basement bedrooms have to have egress (we have one now)--it won't be a walkout but we may be able to manage a few windows.

cpartist has a point of building for how we live now--and that means (to me) that we want bigger living spaces and that we can put an additional guest room or two in the basement.

There really is little difference in the size of a "second" bedroom and an office. Appraisers typically say that a bedroom has to have a closet to "qualify" as a bedroom. But offices need storage as well, and a closet is a useful feature for offices.

What you are really asking for is either a 4-bedroom or 5-bedroom house, particularly when it comes to resale and prospective buyers may not need so many "offices", but may need the "bedrooms", or vice versa.

When it comes to guest bedrooms, they are often best located separate and away from the normal sleeping zones of the house, for privacy reasons and for normal cleaning, heating and cooling, which may be different than the areas of the house used for living on a regular daily basis. If this makes sense, putting two guest bedrooms in basement, sharing a large, compartmentalized bathroom may make sense.

The master bedroom/bath, and the two "office" bedrooms, with a shared compartmentalized bath would make sense on the main level.

The result would be 3 bedrooms and 2 baths on the main level (you may also want a powder room for guests on the main level), and 2 bedrooms and 1 bath in the basement.

There are so many ways to consider this, and so many different "zonings" which would work. Your challenge is to think not just about what you need and want for the next 5-10 years, but also resale.

Good luck on your journey--exciting times ahead.

CP and Virgil hit on what I was trying to say!

Your architect will really help lead you to what you desire.

I agree with your assessment of the difference between a bedroom and an office -- but I also think it's quite possible to design a dual-use space that could flex into something else if your needs change or for a future bedroom.

How big are you thinking these offices need to be? I guess I'm really asking if you're looking at full-sized offices or pocket offices. Could you place an office near /between the guest bedrooms so that a future owner could convert the office to a walk-in closet? Or a workout room, or a sitting room? That'd be future-proofing.

With your overnight needs, I think I'd consider one "standard" guest room ... and make the second guest room more of a bunk room. Maybe with some of those double-down/single-up bunks. Could you place such a room above your garage? I think we've all seen attractive pix of bunks tucked under sloped ceilings.

Yes, I think shower-only bathrooms are fine for guests. After all, your guests aren't likely to want to linger in a hot, steamy tub -- not during a visit, when they'd want to spend time with you.

All I am thinking is that all that is a lot to put in 2500 sq ft... Do you best to make them bedrooms. IMO there is no "downside". And if you want a french door into a "bedroom" for an office - go for it - you could always put opaque window film over it for privacy. We'll be doing that to a glass door that will be in the guest / pool bathroom that opens to the outside...

mrspete, they need to be real offices. They're the most used rooms in the house, except the master bedroom. I spend at least 60 hours a week in my office--I want it to be pleasant, have room for my desk and credenza and bookcases, a reading chair, and a real window. DH would say the same.

We're planning a ranch--there will be a basement, but not an upstairs. Our current house has just under 2100 sqft on the main level--what we're talking about adding to that is another bedroom/closet and an additional full bath (and closets for the "offices").

(Now, for no reason at all, you guys have me thinking about how I could turn my current house into a 7 bedroom house if I re purposed the offices :-).

Property update: the seller is splitting his lot in two to sell--we need to make sure the half we're buying doesn't have any of the septic system on it. That could be a deal breaker :-(

" And if you want a french door into a "bedroom" for an office - go for it"

You can always change out the door later on.

Making the offices from a pair of moderate sized bedrooms that share a "jack and jill" bathroom would work easily. The bedroom closetc - when have you ever seen an office with too much storage.

I can't imagine the city or county allowing a lot split which does not completely include the septic tank and entire leech field (or whatever type of septic system it may be) on the single property which it serves. It's wise to check and be sure, but it's probably the least of what you should be checking. More important, and more expensive, are issues like access to utility service, access to site for construction and later for access/egress, typography and drainage, easements, buildable envelope inside setback lines, soils conditions and rock formations, etc. :-)

The entire property is actually 6 lots (6 PINs) that one house was built on 60 years ago. The house is on the 3 east lots and we're buying the 3 west lots. It turns out the septic and well are on the eastern most lots. We'll have to consolidate the 3 lots and then be annexed before we build

The soil boring test will be done next week. The other stuff seems like we have a handle on. (Although some of it is expensive)

happy Thanksgiving to all the US folks!

Select an architect and discuss your concerns with them. I know that doesn't perpetuate the discussion here on houzz , but I am more concerned with your personal well being than carrying on a conversation.

I do understand, Mark. I think these conversations are helping me--because it's clarifying what I need (two office spaces, 1 guest bedroom on main floor, resale considered) rather than thinking "one 'real' office" and "one <specific room> that I can use as an office".

It is time for me to select an architect--I wish I didn't feel so overwhelmed by that process.

mrspete,
they need to be real offices. They're the most used rooms in the
house, except the master bedroom. I spend at least 60 hours a week in
my office--I want it to be pleasant, have room for my desk and credenza
and bookcases, a reading chair, and a real window. DH would say the
same.

You sound like this is a retirement house -- how long do you anticipate continuing to work 60 hours a week, and will that have any effect on your desire to have a large office?

You mention a reading chair: How about a built-in window seat?

I do understand, Mark. I think these conversations are helping
me--because it's clarifying what I need (two office spaces, 1 guest
bedroom on main floor, resale considered) rather than thinking "one
'real' office" and "one <specific room> that I can use as an
office".

Clarification of what you want is a good starting place.

I work about 45 hours a week--and still spend a ton of other time at my computer--as does my husband. My volunteer work and many of my hobbies are computer-related. We don't watch TV -- but we're computer addicts :-)

We'll retire in 5 years or so (we hope). At that point (or later), if the computer and becomes less important to me, I can use that space for sewing and such, or make it do double duty as some other type of space.

I love the look of built in window seats--I'm not sure, however, if I've ever been in one that is as comfortable as it looks like it ought to be! (Any ideas there?)

I am spending time trying to collect images of things I like--kitchens, exteriors, great rooms, eating areas. (I'm not wedded to anything, honest--I'm collecting images to communicate a "feel" and make sure DH and I are on the same page)

We're making another trip to the Chicago area in a few weeks and hope to be able to identify and schedule meetings with prospective architects, depending on schedules, and meet with a couple of builders we've talked to. Ideally, I want to do what ARG suggested and work with both simultaneously.

Regarding comfy window seats, the secret is in the thickness of the (high density with memory) foam/cushion... 5" is the minimum I'd go with. If you wanna nap on it regularly -- I know I would, lol -- I would spring for 8".

Also, make it as deep as you can, max of 36", maybe, so you can load it with down (or down alternative) pillows. :-)

My first thought on resale is I wouldn't buy a house with a 4 or 5 car garage. You are moving to an urban area? (Guessing by the tear down issue). Please examine your need for so many garages.

I am starting a journey into a tear down area. Garages are a blight on these areas because the old homes didn't have them. Even a pretty garage doesn't fit into an old area. You can side load them of course which can help or you can back load them. Our tear down area has some back loads. A friend has a back load basement garage. Amazingly inconvenient but at least you can't see them.

I'm a car guy. In the longer term, cars as we know it are going away. Self driving and electrification make all that we have now obsolete.

You mention money - you could shell out 2 extra bedrooms for the price of 2 garages. We have one child and may build a 3 bedroom in a 4/5 market. Thinking of shelling out 500 sqft on the second floor. Arguably cheaper than a garage since it is second floor space. We are going from a 3 car to a 2 car garage - for aesthetics and footprint issues.

You talk about having space you use daily. Do you drive 5 cars daily? Alright - I'm getting preachy....

David does have a point about needing a 4-5 car garage. If it's for visitors, why not build a port cochere instead? While not ideal in a Chicago winter, it will still shelter guests coming and keep most of the snow off of their cars.

The Cliffs Vineyards · More Info

We're building in Dupage County outside of Chicago.

My husband is an old car buff. Currently, he has a 1923 Model T but is looking towards acquiring additional cars and doing renovations once he has space to do so. For regular use, we need two car bays plus a partial one for stuff (lawn mower, snow blower, bikes, tools...). For his car hobby we need another 2-3 bays. We're open to doing some level of double deep so there aren't as many garage doors as bays.

I know there are people who hate garages--I'm not one of them. I'm a form follows function type of person. I actually prefer a front entry garage. (The fact that I hate to back up may contribute to that) We currently have 3 bays from the front and the third bay goes back almost another car length. Just about everyone who sees our garage is jealous.

We know we have some unusual requirements--that's a major factor in why we're building and not finding something existing.

It's an interesting juggling of our specific needs/wants and the recognition that resale is an issue.

Beth, how big is the lot you're buying?

Regarding comfy window seats, the secret
is in the thickness of the (high density with memory) foam/cushion...
5" is the minimum I'd go with. If you wanna nap on it regularly -- I
know I would, lol -- I would spring for 8".

I'd use a twin mattress as the base. This'd allow you to plump it up with a bunch of pillows, plus it could double as a sleeping space. One of the Not So Big books contains a detailed description of how to build a perfect window seat, including dimensions. I think everyone loves the look of a nicely done window seat.

My first thought on resale is I wouldn't buy a house with a 4 or 5
car garage. You are moving to an urban area? (Guessing by the tear down
issue). Please examine your need for so many garages.

I do agree that such a garage-heavy house would limit your potential buyers. In addition to the excessive nature of the idea, few people could afford to buy such a house, even if they wanted it -- you could easily end up losing money at resale.

You might consider a lift. It's cheaper than building
additional garage stalls, and while it requires additional height, it's
less space than a traditional garage. And -- I think -- in case of
resale, you can take a lift with you.

Don't underestimate the importance of this question: What's the norm for garages in your neighborhood? You want to stay close to average for resale.

Yes, this is the "juggling" between your unique wants (I don't think you can call a 4-5 car garage a need) and the possibility of resale.

I'm a car guy. In the longer term, cars as we know it are going away.
Self driving and electrification make all that we have now obsolete.

I'm not sure I agree with that, but with more people working at home, more students studying online, and more transportation options available, I do think we're headed for a world in which more families will opt to downsize to one car -- it's a very big savings to the family's bottom line -- and those families won't be willing to pay for a 4-5 car garage.

People are giving me a lot to think about. And I did broach the idea of a lift to DH.

The lot is just over half an acre--150x160.

For what it's worth, I've been watching the expanded northwest/west Chicago suburban area for homes with extra large garages (or both an attached and detached garage). There aren't many and they disappear fast. They will only appeal to a certain market, but to that market, they're in high demand. (Car collectors, people who have a hobby that requires a large workshop)

As for garages in the neighborhood, the few existing homes have 2--several with an additional detached garage. The new homes mostly have 3--and a few have 4.

I know it's not what everyone would do but that's one of the reasons to build instead of buy--because we can plan for the things that are important to us, even, or especially, if they're not commonly available.

But when it comes right down to it, few of us only have as much house as we "need". I *need* a place to sit with a computer. I want it to be comfortable (desk with pullout keyboard tray), and I want a window to look out of, and I want to have nice furniture in it. I don't need any of those things (although my chiropractor might make an argument for the keyboard tray). But I want them and can't think of any reason why I shouldn't make them happen.

We're all different--there are those on this board who prefer jack&jill bathrooms. I hate them. There are those who think a 2nd sink for a hall bathroom shared by kids is a waste of money. I disagree (and so would my kids)--but that's okay. We want a house with a large double shower and don't care at all about a soaking tub. Someone else wants that tub enough to devote 36 sq ft to it. That's all okay.

Looking at houses on-line, I saw zillions of "newly remodeled kitchens" that I hated. Some were objectively bad designs. But most of them weren't--they were just finishes that I didn't like at all--and knew we'd pay a premium for that 'newly remodeled kitchen' even though I'd want to rip it all out.

It's all part of why people build instead of buy. We want what we want--and some of us are fortunate enough to be able to make that happen.

Design the attached garage as easily expandable space for the dwelling. A two storey height garage with dormers for extra natural light can have a couple of lifts in it to work on stuff. Yet if you ever sold, if it is designed to connect with the upstairs correctly, you could just add in framing for that second floor, pop open a door to the hall, and have bedrooms there. And the downstairs nearest bay could become a flex room, guest room, office or MIL suite, between the car parking and house. You just need to think about bathrooms (or rough ins) right next to the garage space as becoming part of the ''other'' space in the future.

It's not hard to design an L or U shaped space than can have all you want automotively and still be versatile enough for a future buyer. You just need the room to do it right. And a separate HVAC system for the garage. And the willingness to pay the taxes for so much under roof.

I think Sophie and Mrspete are onto something.

I have a few architects names to start having preliminary conversations and we've talked to three different builders and have arrangements to meet one in person when we're next in Chicago (next steps) and see some of his work.

If the architect and builder think we can build in sort sort of flexibility of garage space for little cost, we'd consider it. For that, I'll have to listen to ARG and find someone I trust enough to think creatively about it.

Now I need to recognize there isn't anything else I can do until time moves along a little bit!

Best of luck with your meetings.