We had a realtor help us look for a home. Realtors usually have a stack of referrals for local contractors, design firms, inspectors, etc. A good realtor can assist you in all of your dilemmas. The realtor will accompany you to the houses you view and make suggestions, based on their experience as to which professional will be able to better deal with issues in the home.

When you settle on a house, the inspector can tell you the extent of any safety or code issues existing. A contractor can quote costs and recommend that you will need an architect to design a certain feature (like moving a staircase).

Expect it to take longer and cost more than you think. City permits can be lost in the system making outrageous waits.

Count on "creeping elegance." Once things have been finalized and the final payments are due, THEN is when that term creeps in. "What would it cost" if we added this, changed that, etc.

You're right, Suzi, using a great Realtor makes the difference! Ours has offered referrals but we are still too early in our house hunting, as we just finalized our desired neighborhood this weekend.

I'm trying to learn through other's experiences through the process to prepare for the next phase of "the hunt."

Like CPArtist mentions, I'm trying to over estimate costs so it will only be pleasant surprises. Ha!

I'm willing to buy a fixer upper, but only if my Houzz inspired ideas work with the numbers.

Is this your first house?

I would definitely look for the worst house on the best block type of house.

No, it's not our first home purchase. Just the first time to consider buying something that needs such extensive renovation.

I think we may have seen "the worst house" yesterday. But it probably needs an additional 30-40% of the purchase price to make it livable after sitting empty for 10 years. Not sure my nerves or pocketbook are ready for that level of commitment, but I'd love to have the end result. Which is why I started looking into design build firms... hoping they would handle the stress for us. But wasn't sure if that is realistic.

What are the ages of the homes you're interested in?

It's already very smart of you to start getting professional opinions before buying a place..because somebody I know closely(her name starts with A...)))) first bought a fixer upper, and then started getting opinions and bids..)))

cpartist is right on the spot, with "whatever they say.." ..whoever they are))))

"Creeping elegance" that Suzi mentioned is a brilliant way to describe things how they unfold..))

Another topic you could start is "What Do You Wish You Hadn't Done," or something like that. My late MIL lived 2 hours away, and we hired a wonderful contractor to update her home, and it sold before it ever got on the MLS for higher than we were going to ask. We really liked that guy, but that house was not somewhere we intended to live.

He assured us (wanting the job of course) that he works all over Southern California, so we hired him for our (2 hours away) remodel of our newly purchased dream home..

HUGE MISTAKE. His crew lived far away and they had to drive and the entire thing took longer, and I do suggest that you choose LOCAL contractors / workers. We updated late MIL's home to sell it. BUT, huge difference when you are going to live there.

It worked out ok for us, but would have been easier if the contractor was local. Keep that in mind.

Re: "Creeping Elegance," it happens because you can't visualize what you think you want until it's done, and then, it's just not quite right.

Staying tuned to your progress!

Wow..same thing with a contractor who's in 2 hours drive..

As we're also in Southern California-I start wondering..))

Suzi - selling above asking before listing it...I can't imagine house shopping in such a competitive market. Hopefully that helped take the sting out of the pain of working with that contractor.

CPArtist - the homes in our target area are over 100 years old. Think historic brownstones & row houses. The front facades are historically protected on a majority of them so they have already been "taken down to the studs" to update the wiring, insulation, and plumbing but...

It's comical how trends change so drastically! One home won awards for the master bath that is covered too to bottom in smokey mirrors and pink marble. So much pink marble. Now imagine an entire home decorated at the same time and you get an idea of what we saw. Beautiful in its day, but that day is long past.

I just don't know if it'd be financially worth hiring a developer to blow out the house and build/restore these homes to how we want, or buy an already finished one that is close enough to our ideal.

Pink! I guess if you wait long enough, it will become trendy again! :-) When we were looking for our current home, there was one that had been on the market for months, even years! The pink marble mansion on the hill. It's been 3 years now. Lost track of it, but it's probably still for sale.

@big_city_lights, I may have misspoken. We had a listing agent, but he had a huge base of fellow realtors and buyers in his pocket. He knew who was looking and what they were looking for.

As soon as we got our updates and staging done, he begged us to show it before the grand open house to all agents. We hesitated, but finally agreed. We had set a price, and the buyer made a full price offer. We countered $10K higher. She swooped it up! I really wanted a bidding war because I knew the location and the house looked great, but she was a cash buyer and hubby wanted a sure thing. :-)

Back to original issues. Here's what strikes me about the situation.... you have never done an extensive remodel, My (albeit limited) knowledge of such projects is that they are most likely successfully when done by 1) professional contractors or 2) very experienced and skilled DIY'ers with no financial or time restraints or 3) people with very very deep pockets. You think that it might take 30-40% of the purchase price to make that one house livable? Take that as a absolute minimum, I'd guess. Figure 30 or 40% overruns on any estimates that you get from contractors, at least. And figure that there will be $$urprises all along the way. Add to this your living expenses during the year or so of construction. Add to this the professional plans and engineering reports that will be necessary to get permits.

Good luck.

CPArtist - the homes in our target area are over 100 years old. Think historic brownstones & row houses. The front facades are historically protected on a majority of them so they have already been "taken down to the studs" to update the wiring, insulation, and plumbing but...

Now you're talking my language as I'm an old house lover. My first house was a 1927 craftsman bungalow and my second house was an 1898 colonial revival/victorian.

If it's been taken down to the studs so the mechanicals are all updated, then I think it's doable.

My dream was always a brownstone in Brooklyn NY, so yes I know what you're looking at.

It's comical how trends change so drastically! One home won awards for the master bath that is covered too to bottom in smokey mirrors and pink marble. So much pink marble. Now imagine an entire home decorated at the same time and you get an idea of what we saw. Beautiful in its day, but that day is long past.

Sorry, I can't think it was even beautiful in its day. LOL.

Are you looking to restore the house to close to what it might have looked like back when it was built and if so, do these houses still mostly have the architectural features that made them so wonderful? The moldings around the doors and windows? The wide base molding? Crown moldings? The built ins? What about the flooring?

I just don't know if it'd be financially worth hiring a developer to blow out the house and build/restore these homes to how we want, or buy an already finished one that is close enough to our ideal.

Are you willing to put up with the dust and debris? How long are you planning on living in the house?

What is your market like where you're looking right now? Is it a sellers market or a buyer's market or is it right in the middle?

Are you willing to choose the house that's been sitting on the market the longest and that might be able to be gotten for less than others in the neighborhood?

That's what we did back in 2010 with our condo. We found the condo that had been sitting on the market for well over a year that was dreary gray and stuck in the early 80's throughout and was the worst condo in an excellent sought out building.

We completely gutted it and updated it. We didn't do the work ourselves, but had a contractor do all the work. We just sold it this past April and it sold for close to double what we paid to buy it in 2010. Of course almost half of that went to the reno costs but even so we did very well.

If you're willing to find the true diamond in the rough, and you stick within your budget for the reno, you can reap the rewards of it more so than buying what someone else did.

However, if you move into it, you need to put up with the dust and the mess, and having workmen in your house on a daily basis. If you don't live in it, you have to factor in the cost of living somewhere else for that time period.

I personally love the process of renovating and/or building and getting exactly what I want and in the case of an old house, restoring it to its former glory. I love hunting down and making all the decisions regarding flooring, tile, sinks, etc. I don't mind the delays, the problems, etc. I consider it the cost of reno. However, my DH has less tolerance for it all and he leaves most of the decision making to me.

Im sorta acting as my own gc, so our situations arent entirely comparable - but I found a buyers agent with background in construction and house renovation/reselling. Still may want to call in experts at some point, but it s valuable having some feedback right from the beginning re: ballpark costs, how and what can be done, whats feasible vs. not realistic, code issues, etc.

Buying a renovation project is a combination of common sense, imagination and experience. Rule #1, don't fall in love with it. Be willing to walk away. It's a business transaction. Rule #2, You make money when you buy, not when you sell. Repeat that rule. Rule #3, When you look at a home, assume everything is going to cost you. Don't trust anyone. Rule #4, Try not to add square footage. It's expensive. Rarely will it work out from a cost standpoint. Rule #5, Water is the enemy. Does it leak? Is it wet? Is it damp? Does the water drain away from it? .

Norm on This Old House used to use the analogy of the old man dressed for winter. Does he have a hat? The roof. Does he have shoes? The foundation and basement. Does he have on a sweater? The walls and windows. Is he fully dressed? If yes, it's a candidate. If no, it's going to cost you a lot of money and trouble. They aren't sexy items, but those are the things where you will spend unexpected money.

Renovations are hard work. I think most people are not capable of doing it. That's why houses in need of renovation are hard to sell. Only the brave or the foolhardy can do it. You learn after looking at enough houses what to consider and what to walk away from. Much of the elimination can by done by you. Only when you get to the point where you are about to put money down, do you call in the inspector, contractor, plumber, electrician and roofer to give you a review, Be prepared to pay for them. Nothing is free. That's why you can eliminate most candidates early.

I've walked away from houses with unexpected issues revealed in an inspection. I've also bought houses without an inspection on the assumption everything was a problem and needed to be addressed. Every situation is different. Use your common sense.

Alot of food for thought here. Luckily we are not in a rush to buy and can take our time pondering how much we are willing to take on. We would live in our current condo during any renovation as my SIL just renovated and walking through the work site was enough to convince us it will be factored into the budget.

We are not DIYers (at this level), so everything would be handled by professionals.

Homechef- If there are only 2 camps of renovators, I hope we are merely brave and not fool hardy! Lol! Luckily we haven't seen any "love at first sight" homes so we have no problem walking away if the numbers don't work for us. And it helps that my husband is a numbers guy by day.

I have calls into a few firms, but with it being a holiday weekend, my mind is spinning and I wanted to hear from houzzers.

Each home we have seen is in a different level of need. Some only need cosmetic updating, since behind the walls is recent. We are good with this.

Another needed an exterior wall moved, removal of previous bad reno work, expand garages etc. - we quickly agreed to walk away as it required much much deeper pockets and someone with a higher risk tolerance.

Now we are focusing on things we cannot change - what are we wiling to compromise on? We have crossed off some located on a busy street since we can always renovate an ugly bath but can't move the house.

CPAartist - you sound like me! I can see the potential in homes and renovation doesn't bother me (I grew up helping my DIY father complete some serious DIY projects on his house). My husband has trouble "seeing it", but the more we house hunt the more he is on board. It helps that nearly all the homes sit on a standard lot size and are the same width & depth, everyone just used the lot differently through the years so you wind up borrowing ideas.

Our favorite homes are a blend of historic and modern conveniences. A lot have been owned by people who value the character in them and try to always keep and reuse the original items through the years. I just love the historic crown molding and gorgeous original wood banisters.

There were a few that have carriage house studios or basement apartments, so there was talk of living in the "rental unit" during renovation to save money. Since they are legal rentals, they are on separate HVAC systems, so reno dust wouldn't be in the vents. Anyone done that before??

Yes. You still feel as if you are in a renovation zone, because you are. There are workmen coming and going. There is dust and scrambles for parking places. It's always something.

I firmly believe that you will get better results by being on site. Any questions can be answered quickly. You will see the mistakes as they happen and can get them fixed. Or, at the least, be part of the solution. But, it's still wearing on you. You will be glad when it's done.

In my experience one of the most important things when renovating is choosing a contractor who is familiar with the type and scope of work you are planning to do, and does it repeatedly. So I recommend walking around the neighborhood, contacting a few of the contractors who are currently working on similar houses, schedule a brief meeting and ask one of them to look at a couple of homes you are considering to give you a quick estimate of how much it would cost to renovate it. And then, yes, add 30-50% to that to get a safer number.

You've gotten some excellent advice, including the adding 30-50% to the cost. LOL.

I would have no problem living in the rental unit during reno.

In my first home, my ex and I did all the work ourselves. I'm very handy and so was he so it worked out well. I painted, wallpapered, laid floor tile, helped him hang cabinets, etc. We hired out the plumbing when he decided he could take out a kitchen in the master bedroom the previous owners had put in, and wound up not being able to shut the water off. (Don't ask. lol)

In our second home, we did all the demo work and then hired out for the major work of rebuilding walls, etc. I then painted, tiled the backsplash, etc.

In our condo we just sold, I decided I don't have the time, patience, or the back anymore to do all that. LOL. I'm too old.

That's a great idea FreeOscar as there are plenty of renovations in the area. Thank you.

We have had a twist in the house hunt today...

There was a condo we liked back in February. We lost the bid to another buyer over just $10k. Even our agent said it was weird they didn't counter and just accepted the other offer. We move on and start looking at houses since no other similar condo units have listed.... Until now.

Of course the condo also needs updating. So I'm looking at renovating a kitchen and 2 baths there and still waiting on contractors to return calls. Since I have been stalking these particular units, we feel confident about making an offer based on market price (as many of the recent comps were not renovated either).

Must have posted at the same time as you CPArtist. I wish I had the skills to do work like you did! But some of the houses are just too far gone to even consider going without professionals.

Lesson from all:

Double any estimates we get. Got it!!

If it's a condo I'd be sure to get the condo docs first before making an offer. Make sure they have enough in reserve, etc.

Also I'd want to know why the listing fell apart now 4 1/2 months later. Usually houses have closed before that.

CPArtist - oops, sorry I wasn't clear. This is a completely different unit. Same complex and same floor plan, just a new listing. We did our due diligence on the HOA back in February and we're happy they are as healthy as it is.

It's just we have already mentally moved on to searching for a single family home and then this unit pops up. :/

So now you have to decide if you'd prefer a condo or a single family. :)

We lived in a condo for the past 6 years and while we had wonderful neighbors and good times there, we're ready for a single family house again. We're calling it our last hurrah house. LOL. What finally got us to decide to move was when they looked into putting hurricane windows into our units, (we're in SW FL in a building built in the early 80's). Their idea of looking into it was to ask the insurance agent if we were ok and they said it was fine. We felt in this case they were being penny wise and pound foolish because what they had for "hurricane shutters" would not be up to code nowadays.

So we decided to find a single family home once more.

We have done complete Reno twice. First a lot was DIY and we did things slowly when we had the money. The 1870 we are in now we did it all at one with a very talented restoration expert. Expensive - but we are older & didn't want to live in constant construction. Both times our decision on purchase was based on LOCATION.

Daydream, these forums are not for soliciting business. We call it spam.

Sushi, I flagged it. You should too.

i did. It takes more than one of us to actually get it pulled. One person can pull an original thread, but it's harder to get rid of these in the middle of threads. Looks like we were successful here!