By the way, my pots are all plastic pots. I often post on the Citrus forum and many there believe that it is a bad idea to put citrus in terra cotta pots because evaporation through the pot walls during the winter while indoors would cool the soil too much. I am not sure I agree. I use terra cotta mostly because it is lighter than plastic.

Absolutely. Let's say I have a block of even something like Furcraea. The sun exposed rows are going to have less growth than the inside rows due to heat. I'm going to start shading that exposed row this year.

I had a feeling that book would suit you.

Plant Production In Containers-11 is a book with a lot of good information. However, it is also a book with a ton of self serving information for Dr. Carl Whitcomb, and his company. - Silica

It's pretty obvious which is which and the fact of the matter is that conventional plastic nursery containers produce crap root systems. That has been accepted by the horticultural community for decades and is apparent to anyone in the field. He is one of only a few people trying to remedy those issues.

I have a few plants growing in black plastic semi-hydro containers and was wondering if heat would be a problem. I have no way to check the temperature but I'm hoping since there is a small reservoir of water at the bottom, and the containers are sitting directly on the ground in part shade, they stay cool enough. I am using a 50/50 turface:granigrit mix. They often droop so maybe it is the heat? The plants definitely look better when I am home and can water them in the middle of the day.

Asked:They often droop so maybe it is the heat?

Asking: What happens to the leaves later in the evening if you don't water ? Although it might be a good idea to water them after making the what happens to the leaves after sunset observation.

Assuming Nil is talking about the same plastic pot as this one there are many folks who have great looking citrus in the same pot as the link and or modifications yet they don't know they have a problem when all one has to do is read the citrus forum.

The Mississipi heat is so hot you can feel the heat radiating off your face, even in the shade. If you don't have a moisture retentive soil...let excess water remain in drain container.

Yeah those are pretty standard nursery pots nomen and they produce crap root systems full of girdling and j roots. That doesn't mean you can't grow plants well in them just that you need to recognize what the ramifications of using them are. I plant thousands of plants every year from nursery containers and they all have root problems. On annuals and herbaceous perennials it doesn't matter much, but on woody perennials it matters and those faults should be corrected for the long term health of the plant. I'm sure those citrus growers you mentioned repot their citrus and root prune in order to deal with root problems.

If I can grow plants in gravel and calcined clay without a tray of water in the dry heat of Los Angeles, I have a hard time believing that I would not be able to do the same thing in hot and wet Mississippi.

If if where pots and pans the whole world would be a kitchen. IF the operative word of the millennium If you lived in Mississippi you would have the same problems as Anthoney IF and only IF you believe still dont make it true.

Well considering there are forum members in Florida that successfully use aggregate media, it doesn't take a while lot of effort to deduce that it should work in Mississippi especially when my experience with aggregate media in a location that is hotter and more arid than Mississippi has been very successful.

I'm sure if I were in Mississippi I would experience the same problems as Anthony. However experiencing the same problems and using the same solutions are very different things. There's more than one way to solve most any problem.

Anthony is a troll.

Well to put an end to this, I looked up the worst reference evapotranspiration (ET0) for Mississippi. In the Eastern prairies the average ET0 for July is about 6". In my area of L.A. it's 8". Therefore growers in Mississippi should have a much easier time growing plants in aggregate media than a grower in L.A..

Anthony is the same guy who tells others they should use garden soil, leaves and pine needles for their indoor containers. He's a lost cause and there's no point trying to explain anything to him.

Wait, so Nil do you grow in gravel/calcined clay in regular nursery pots? How often do you water?

Dave: Try not to let some "troll" named Anthony in this case bother you to much. There will always be those who don't have the better concern for what other people are trying to do.

Personally I would much rather question Nil even though some of what I typed reads as disagreeable it really isn't. Nil took time to explain on a personal and somewhat professional manner that hold facts that would apply to me The same facts he mentions would be handled in a different manner here and VIA word for word At least close enough to word for word.... IF I where cultivating the same plant that he is referencing in my different growing conditions than his growing conditions.

I see that pot type being selecting from a nursery may be an issue /of concern for some but as Nil said a plant can grow in the pot in disagreement. I also noted that he didn't say how well it would grow though nor for how long it would healthily grow nor it's production rate Ect ect ect .... Example the same plant that grows well for me in a nursery pot doesn't guarantee it will do as well right across the street from me.

A little off subject but there are some even many who think ( and believe) there plants are doomed with out the use of turface Fact is Turface use does not always apply to everyone every time for every plant Fact two: There has been no turface AKA calcined clay in any of my pots, the plants don't know and are just as productive as any other

In my observation for a plant in gravel soil alone ( It kind of depends on the plant as well) watering regiment would be ALOT and frequently as well..... while it's in it's growing times and watering hardly any and much less frequently if it's not the plants growing season.

The saying goes when it's time for certain plants and they break it's dormancy "" Be there with the water"" of the ones that I do have here & especially in tree form... holding back on water in fear of rot or anything is the Old wives tail

BTW I don't have any plants in a nursery pot that have any need for watering...... Why not water a plant if it's in a nursery pot ? (In case some troll has the need to ask).........Because there are no plants here in nursery pots.

I don't let the troll bother me. However, I do post and correct s lot of what he says. Not because I like responding to him, but because I don't want new comers to pick up his bad habbits or terrible ideas.

I will keep doing so.

Skip, watering frequency in any medium depends on the weather and the plant. I have plenty of cacti in gravel and turface (MGB) in terra cotta pots that need watered once a month in summer and not at all in the winter. Other succulents in nursery pots and MGB might get watered once a week. A lush woody vine might need watering every day during the heat of summer but I've never had to water twice a day. I have a bunch of stuff in a coarse aggregate medium but some things like epiphytes are in coconut husk chunks and perlite. Sometimes you need bulk density, sometimes you don't. IME, people tend to grossly underestimate how much water aggregate media can hold. I don't grow everything in aggregate media, I just think it's ridiculous to claim that it can't be done.

A soil that is moisture retentive gives you more flexibility in regards to watering. If you must water a plant every day...that means something is wrong.☺

Watering a plant every day does not mean something is wrong. That's a ludicrous statement. Is something wrong when hydroponics growers water 5 times a day or when bonsai growers water everyday? Absolutely not.

A moisture retentive medium doesn't give you flexibility an irrigation system gives you flexibility.

Anthony, you're obnoxious. I know that's your goal though.

Nil, what is MGB?

I worry about pot temperature. Black plastic pots are the worst but when I do use them I either bury the pot in a pile of mulch or in the yard (when they are outside obviously) or use a cache pot with mulch. Some pots have a second trailing plant that hang down the sides shading the pot.

Black plastic pots have another downside as someone already mentioned above - circling roots. This is my hypothesis: As the plastic heats up the soil layer next to plastic dries out and "releases" itself from the pot creating a air gap. A peat based mix does this more since it shrinks rapidly as it dries out. I am sure some of you may have noticed how easy it is pull a nursery plant out of its pot especially when it is a bit dry. With a clay pot it is not that easy.

The air gap just inside the plastic pot allows the roots to occupy that space and circle around. I think the plant finds this air gap a little more conducive environment (in spite of the heat) where it can get both air and water instead of the airless soil medium.

Anthony what part of " Depending on the type of plant did you not understand ?"

Pay attention Anthony because a change of plant type will certainly change watering requirements rather drastically.

Misted daily with a few ounces of water and even gets left out during rains ( if we ever get any) as it too is in it's peek growing season. A different type of plant also in a high fired hand made pot for the same heat stress considerations and also has more pot size than the prior pot.

Make note Anthony that neither of them are dead plants and no such crap ( that you call soil) is in ether of the pots

As some try to express feed back on the subject of heat concerns and pots one should try to be on subject and offer some feed back with suggestions for managing cooler pots with warmer tops VS who's doing something right VS who's doing something wrong. BTW if you look close enough Anthony neither of them different plants are dead.

Conclusion: Someone buys a book to educate themselves regarding heat and pots cause they have a concern for heat stresses on a plant in a pot and all Anthony does is say your doing something wrongs... Good grief

I appreciate you trying, but Anthony doesn't listen or pay attention to any useful information that's posted on this site.

He thinks he knows best and is not open to anything.

He spreads terrible advice and never backs up a single thing he says.

He isn't here to help anyone and he isn't here to learn a single thing either.

TOC, MGB stands for Missouri Gravel Bed. It's an aggregate medium recipe developed at the Univ. of Missouri to hold bare root trees for bare root planting any time of year. They originally started with plain gravel but had to water multiple times a day, so they added calcined clay to the mix to decrease watering frequency. It produces a really big, tough, fibrous root system.

You are pretty much right about the plastic pots and circling roots. It's all about oxygen. Some researchers took an MRI or similar device and scanned pots. The root systems were almost entirely on the periphery of the pot. The centers had very few roots. Now compare that to aggregate media where every single sqin of media is colonized.

Aah Missouri Gravel Bed. Read about it a few years back. Very interesting findings. I do grow various succulents in pure grit and turface and some ficus too. Some succulents are in pure grit. I have a few plants in haydite and pine bark and few others in haydite and turface. And a few others involving lava rock, pumice and recently grow stones too. I have always been delighted to see the root systems in these kind of mixes. Still learning the properties of each of the above types of aggregates.

It's just me just being a little supportive to your ( factual) views of a certain individual.

If someone wants to use Anthonys' suggestions it's up to that person. Although IMVHO they should also ask Anthony if he will buy a replacement plant that they use to follow his suggestions. Thinking at least one step ahead in the Anthony game of his rules After replacing them lost plants by use of his advice could lead to a thin broken wallet & he wont be able to afford the computer to give ill advice over the internet.

The posted pics are for those who are interested in different potting materials that show a real time view with air temps in the high 80's today They are also intended to show that different materials pots are made of help and reduce the amount of heat a pot will allow in The pots do the work when it comes to heat absorption being lower inside they allow more heat retracting or heat resistance They assist this user greatly with inner pot heat management ( control ) As heat ( that sometimes hit 100's F ) is also a concern here during the dryer one day more humid the next day up and down at will summer season here.

I had suggested that a growing plant needs more water more frequently in it's growing season one of them plants goes dormant during the winter

Unfortunately Anthony would be right in just one very minor detail. I would be doing something wrong if I watered that one as heavily and as frequently as I water it now. Understanding that in late fall - winter it's going to be dormant, as EVERY DAY means 365 days to me it would be a very dead tree (rotted beyond and deeper than the grave dead).

Fall- winter into early spring the succulent type in the smaller pot goes under lights it gets a less frequent watering regiment as it does outside but watering volume remains pretty close to the same at times.

I never give advice. I just share ideas. Light and your watering skills are what a plant needs most.

Anthony is here to bother other members. Unfortunately, he's also spewing bad advice that hopefully any new comers do not pick up on.

maybe a mod will ban his or her IP address.

I've an idea too but that doesn't mean I must insist on sharing it in a manner that annoys others who already have an effective plan.

Here's an idea. Ideas are better served when kept to ones self. Hopefully this idea is effective enough for annoyances to descend, at very least the idea I had just expressed be understood.

Since I use a lot of black plastic containers, they are available and cheap, to deal with the heat I've been fashioning aprons (from old potting soil plastic bags_with the white side out) and wrapping them around the part of the container that is hit by the sun, about 180 degrees worth. I try to leave them loose so there is an air gap between the plastic apron and the container. I think it's making about a 10 degree difference on hot days.

jbclem: For a moment I thought you were talking about 180 degrees temperature. Lol.

Anthony: I think you do not understand the difference between idea and advice. When you say " Light and your watering skills are what a plant needs most." - that is an advice. But that is as useless advice as "you need water to boil potatoes"